Intuos3 12x19!

Drool.

Okay, this may be borderline off topic, but since this is a texturing tool, I figured I'd post here.

Damn you, Wacom! I finally get the money set aside to buy the 9x12, and you come out with this. Now I need to save another $300, ya bastards.

Anyway, kidding aside, this thing looks freakin' awesome. I had been meaning to upgrade my little tablet for a while now, and up until this new giant was announced, I was having trouble deciding between the Intuos3 9x12 and the Intuos2 12x18. As a traditional artist, I always draw on really big paper, usually 18x24 or larger, but on the computer, I've been using a small tablet forever now, mostly because of cost. So, the debate between buying the full sized Intuos2 vs. the better featured but smaller Intuos3 had been raging in my head for like a year now, ever since the Intuos3 line came out. Now that they've added a full sized Intuos3, however, it's obviously a no-brainer. I must have this!

Call me dorky, but I just blew up the website photo to full size and printed it out. Pretending to draw on it feels so cool. Finally drawing on the computer and drawing on paper feel like the same thing. (Okay, maybe that's because I am just drawing on paper since all I've got is this silly printout right now, but I think it's close enough.) The only problem, really, is figuring out how to rearrange my desk to fit this monster while I save up a few hundred extra dollars to throw at the real thing. Exciting stuff.

go with the Intuos3 12x12 and save $200!

Thanks for the suggestion, but a square canvas is not what I want. It's not about the $200. It's about being able to draw most naturally. The bigger the canvas, the more natural it feels.

Some people prefer a small drawing space, but not me. I can get by on one sure, but I'm tired of just getting by. It's time for real freedom.

Good luck with that!

I've been thinking about upgrading to the Intuos3, because it looks like the sliders and things on the sides would make drawing much easier. As it is, I have to kind of hang the keyboard on the edge of the tablet, so I can use them both at once. But I dunno. My old Intuos2 is still working like a champ, and I don't need a larger size. (I use a 6x8, but I prefer to work small, and have very little desk real estate.)

I'll be interested in finding out if the 3 is really that much better than the 2, once you get it. Let me know!

One particular complaint I heard was from an artist who enjoyed eating during drawing... the Intuos3 doesn't have such a "flat" surface, there are gaps between the buttons... and as a result, crumbs would fall inbetween, all nasty and stuff. So he actually ended up using an Intuos2 more. It's a different design aesthetic--to me, the Intuos3 looks a little more retro, as curious as that sounds.

I've been drooling so much over the Cintiq, I finally decided I will never afford it and end up buying a big packet of chrysanthemum juice to replace all the drool instead.

I have an Intuos 12x12 and love having the large size tablet for two main reasons... first it fits in my lap very nicely which is how I most like to draw, and second, the drawing area is about the same size as my monitor so my hand movements are in the same approximate scale as what I'm looking at which I've always found easiest. Plus I can always define a smaller active area if I don't want to have to move my arm much. Give me a large tablet over a small one any day. If you get this let us know how you like it. My Intuos 1 still works great so it's hard to justify upgrading to the 3, but it sure is tempting

Does it count as necroposting when it's your own thread?

Well, I finally decided after a year that the price on this bad boy is never gonna come down, so I went ahead and bit the bullet. Yes, $750 for a tablet seems insane beforehand, but all I can say is it's worth every last penny. The amount of precision in the brush strokes I'm experiencing with this thing is simply amazing. For the first time, I truly feel like I'm using the computer as a canvas. I don't feel like I'm wrestling with the machine at all to get the results I want. Every movement of my painting arm is reproduced exactly. It feels so fluid and natural. Wow, wow, wow.

I don't know how I ever lived without this thing.

Needless to say, it took some doing to make room for this monster on my desk, but who cares? Truthfully the desk could have used a good cleaning anyway.

Calling all texture artists: If you have a few hundred bucks to spare, get this tablet! You won't regret it. It's by far the best computer accessory I've ever bought.

Well since I asked you to tell me how you liked it if you got one, I say hooray for necroposting! hehe. My Intuous 1 is still chugging along so I still can't justify upgrading it, but maybe I'll just have to get a bit klutzier with it... then again I've tripped over the thing about a hundred times and it still works as good as it did the day I bought it. I can't say I'm surprised that you're loving it. I think having a big one is sooooo much nicer than the little ones. I keep mine on the floor tucked out of the way and just sling it onto my lap when I need it. I love that the wacom driver makes switching between mouse and tablet so painless so you can just keep the driver loaded all the time. Congrats, Chosen!

Droooooool... I WANT!

I had always drawn on small surfaces, until I took a class on figure drawing. Boy that changed me. I need room. More room. Much, much more room. Drawing big is so liberating!

Yeaaaaa for Chosen! You have always been so giving, in helping us. It is good to hear that you got something to help make you better. I am happy for you.

Jen

I have a carefully-designed space for music composition that I'm trying to also use for SL design work. It's going to be a real challenge fitting this thing in, particularly with the constraint that I don't ever want it to be completely flat because I don't want cats walking on it.

Actually, I should just ask...is the surface likely to be harmed by cat claws? I'm guessing it is.

I would say yes if your cat likes to jump on and off of Wacom tablets. The intuos 3 has a clear plastic top covering much like the Mac computers. I already have scratches on mine because it travels with my laptop. It's a durable shell, but I am constantly pulling it out and puting it on different surfaces, be that a couch, table, or concrete. With my cat I am more concerned about the connecting cords. My cat likes the chewy rubber end of the USB connector, so I have to be careful if it's unplugged.

The Intuos 2 has an opaque textured plastic cover on it. I've had one of these for several years, and I'd say it's probably doing better than the Intuos 3, but it just sits on a desk, so it doesn't get quite as much abuse.

Thanks for the kind words, guys.

Anna, yeah, what Nam said. It's hardly a cat-proof surface, and that probably goes double for the 12x19. Unlike the other sizes of the Intuos3, the 12x19 does not have that hard acrylic covering over it, probably because they assume it's not something anyone would ever tote around. The surface of the active area is a translucent vinyl sheet, similar to what was on all the Intuos2's.

The sheet is fairly thick and durable, certainly tough enough for normal use, but I'd imagine cat claws would probably do a number on it. Any dents or scratches in the surface will affect your ability to draw on it.

If cat-proofing means making sure surfaces are not level enough to walk on, I'd suggest investing in the largest book stand you can find, perhaps the kind they have at libraries for those huge dictionaries, or maybe building something similar yourself, to keep the tablet on a ptiched angle. A drafting board might work well, as long as you rig up some sort of ledge at the bottom to keep the tablet from sliding off. Depending on your desk setup, you may find it easier to draw on the large surface if it's not level anyway, so this could be killing two birds with one stone.

Of course, if your cats are daring, and they try to walk on the sloped surface, they might do some incredible damage as they start to slide off and extend their claws to try to stay put. I don't own any cats though, so I'm just theorizing. You know your pets, and what they're capable of.


EDIT: I got curious, so I called Wacom to ask why the 12x19 does not have the clear plastic casing over the gray surface like the smaller ones do. Customer service had no idea what I was talking about; the lady was absolutely clueless. It was almost funny. She even said she had all the sizes in front of her, and she could see no difference between them other than size. Eventually, she transferred me to tech support. The TSR knew instantly what I meant, and said that the clear plastic cases were problematic to put on the larger tablets, so they leave them off. I don't really understand how that could be, but I'll take his word for it I guess.

I own a 9x12 Intuos 2, picked up off ebay about 3-4 years ago. I love working at this size - I agree, working at a larger size promotes better, more intuitive hand movement and gestural work. It is a vast improvement over the 4x5 Intuos 1 I had previously, where I was constantly getting hand cramps from trying to get details in that I can do easily now with the larger tablet.

Given that I work with a laptop and not a desktop unit, however, the tablet is far larger than my laptop... and is a pain to have to lug around wherever I go. I did at one point own a Graphire 1, but have since sold it to a friend who needed a cheap tablet to get her started.

I will probably be looking in to a reasonable comprimise between the two sizes... does anyone have any opinions on the 6x8" vs 6x11"? I am using a Powerbook 15"... so I'm thinking about the wider one... but would like to hear your thoughts first.

I'd imagine if you get scraches in the vinyl overlay sheet that you could fix them with an acrylic scratch filler similar to that used to fix scratches on lenses. Since Wacom sells refurbs their tech support could probably give some pointers on doing it and if it would cause any problems (like signal deflection).

I have my computer's tower case on the floor next to me and just lean the tablet against the side of it when I'm not using it, out of the way of cat tampering.

Then you don't want to hear about the $3000 I spent on my monitor...

Actually, I would. What is it, and was it worth it?

Myself, I'm very curious to check out the new 3000:1 contrast flat panels that Samsung is coming out with in March. They've got one model out already, which is impressive but has some flaws (doesn't have the 178 degree viewing angle that Samsung is famous for). The newer ones should correct that. They'll be in the $800-1000 range for the largest models (24" & 27". That's quite pricey, for flat panels by today's standards, but considering I spent $700 apiece 4 years ago for two 19" Samsung flat panels with just 700:1 contrast, it doesn't feel very unreasonable to me.

So, what, pray tell, did you find that you could spend $3000 on? Even the Cintiq 21UX, which is probably the most expensive monitor I've seen recently, is 'only' $2499. Was your purchase recent, or was it back in like 2001, when a 20 inch LCD actually did cost about $3000? You've got me curious.

The Samsung's look very nice, but fror reading lots of reader reviews while shopping for an HDTV recently it seems that their support in the US is pretty awful. Great products as long as nothing goes wrong with them.

The NEC 2180WG-LED costs $8700 (MRSP, about $6900 street-price.) It's a 21" LCD with wide color gamut (approximating AdobeRGB) -- a professional photographer's dream monitor. Not that any printer could actually print anywhere near that gamut.

Contrast-ratios are somewhat overrated because it has become a marketing gimmick. The above NEC has a contrast ratio of "only" 500:1. Both calibrated LCDs I use for my pro photography work have 800:1 ratios (yet still nowhere near the quality of the NEC.)

-peekay

I've never had a problem with any Samsung product, from my 10 yr old VCR to my monitors, so I wouldn't know about their support. Big fan of their monitors though.



Interesting. I didn't know such monitors existed.

You're absolutely right about the marketing gimmicks on the contrast ratios, by the way. That's why I want to check out the new 3000:1's in the store for myself when they come out. What I can say is the current one, inferior viewing angle aside, was showing levels of detail in its imagery that every other monitor in the store was missing. I don't know if the 3000:1 stat can be trusted precisely since it is labeled "dynamic contrast ratio", which could mean anything, but clearly there is something to it. Even with Circuit City's typical crappy hookup (analog connection split with a dozen other monitors), the picture on the one I saw was fantastic.

Interestingly, in a room with any stray or ambient light, our eyes can't perceive the difference between a low contrast monitor vs. a high contrast one (assuming that was the only difference between them.)

A room lit at just 1 lux (e.g., a very dark room with one small candle 3 feet away), our eyes can't perceive anything above 500:1. At 30 lux, our eyes can't perceive anything above 50:1.

In contrast (pardon the pun), the average living room is lit at 50 lux, and a typical store or office is lit at ~ 400 lux.

Yet many a salespersons will try to convince you that a TV with a higher contrast-ratio (and correspondingly high price tag) is clearly better "as you can plainly see here for yourself" in such a nicely lit store.

In a totally darkened room (with windows all sealed), one might perceive a marginal difference between a 500:1 LCD and a 2000:1 one.

The monitor you saw at the store probably is better than the others, but its contrast-ratio has nothing to do with the reason why.

-peekay

Wouldn't that logic only hold true if the monitor itself were not a light source? Because the screen is lit, doesn't the amount of ambient light become almost a null factor, unless the ambient light is sufficiently bright to drown out the screen light (which it usually wouldn't be indoors). Isn't this the reason we watch movies in the dark, so that we can see more contrast on-screen because there's less ambient light competing with the light coming from the screen?

Back when I worked for Dish Network, our showroom had black painted walls, dark gray carpets & ceilings, and very dim recessed lighting. This was so that the picture quality would really stand out on the TV's. People who left the blinds open would get yelled at because the extra ambient light coming in through the window would lessen the perceptible contrast on the TV's.

You can try this experiment yourself right now. Pull 5 or 6 really bright lamps into the room with you, and look at your screen. Now turn all the lights off, close the blinds, and look at the screen again. You should notice that you see far more on-screen contrast when there's less ambient light, not when there's more.

The numbers you cited, those relationships between detectable contrast ratios and ambient lux amounts, may be true when you're talking about items being passively lit by ambient lighting, but they're not at all applicable when you're talking about items that generate their own light.

i have the adesso cyber tablet 12000 and it is 12" X 9" and i paid less then $200....i think it was $150ish at microcenter actually. I like it but I've been thinking it would be nicer to have a smaller size tablet because it's so big i have to hold it in my lap. and in real life, when i draw on paper, i like drawing larger better...but i think i'd like a smaller drawing surface for texturing maybe.

i don't know if the adesso is crappy compared to the wacom but i wouldnt' know the difference since it is the only tablet i've had. i like it over all.

No. Intuitively we know this because even with CRT and LCD TVs we still want to "turn-off-the-lights" before we watch a movie!

Contrast-ratio is the intensity difference between "on" (white) and "off" (black) areas of the screen. With any kind of screen, ambient light is reflected by the screen (including its "off" areas), severely limiting its contrast. Even emissive screens are good reflectors because they tend to have surfaces made out of glass or plastic.

Suppose for argument sake we have a CRT TV with an "fully on" intensity of 100 lux at viewing distance. In a totally dark room and an all-black image frame, the contrast-ratio of our CRT screen is therefore is infinite (100/0).

Now suppose there's some ambient light, and the same screen reflects just 0.1 lux of it. Now the theoretical maximum contrast-ratio has dropped from infinite to 1000:1 (100/0.1), due to such a tiny amount of reflection! This limit holds whether the screen is emissive or reflective.

Another limiting factor is biological. While our eyes can see over a huge range of intensity values, our retina's static contrast-ratio is only about 100:1, and in well-lit conditions its maximum dynamic contrast is only about 1000:1 (for photographers, that's 10 f-stops.)

-peekay