Second Life Forums Archive - I am the subject of Cris's tyrade.

Cristiano Midnight

Evil Snapshot Baron

Join date: 17 May 2003

Posts: 8,616

05-11-2006 11:38

From: Cocoanut Cookie

Opinion:

I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny.

Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked.

If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual.

But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her?

coco

I again will remind you that the person who made this public was Phaylen. I went to her last night and presented all of this to her, and talked to her about it. The IP address spoofing theory is ridiculous, and the IP has been confirmed multiple times.

_____________________

Cristiano

ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less.

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Cocoanut Cookie

Registered User

Join date: 26 Jan 2006

Posts: 1,741

05-11-2006 11:39

From: Cristiano Midnight

I again will remind you that the person who made this public was Phaylen. I went to her last night and presented all of this to her, and talked to her about it.

Point taken.

coco

_____________________

DoctorEgon Spengler

Who you gonna call?

Join date: 7 Mar 2006

Posts: 92

05-11-2006 11:43

From: Sarg Bjornson

A sentence in the first document has really scared me... "There ate two kinds of FIC..."

Does that mean the FIC is out to eat us all? Mom, I'm scared

they eat babies.

it's true.

Belaya Statosky

Information Retrieval

Join date: 3 Jun 2004

Posts: 552

05-11-2006 11:46

From: Cocoanut Cookie

Opinion: I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked.

No they can't. Ignoring things such as proxies, we're discussing taking someone's specific address and then masquerading as it. That cannot be done unless the machine was compromised, which is unlikely. Think of it this way: Communication between two points requires more than just shouting in one direction (usually).

In this case, working with a webmail site to send mail means traffic needs to be passed back and forth in order to work (quite a few times, actually -- there's a whole acknowledgement to initiate a connection). There are tricky ways that are mathmatically improbable to try and sequence your forged traffic so it looks like you're constantly replying while the responses the other person is sending to the victim go ignore because the victim's machine has no idea to respond to it. This is so hard that you shouldn't even consider it is being done over something like this -- I've never actually seen this type of hijack done in the wild.

Now other types of email, it's possible to (sometimes) forge the email header, but that usually leaves mistakes all over it that flag it as faked. In this case, the webmail provider handles the entire thing leaving no chance for this to be done.

So they had the IP and they got an exact match later. Unless you believe Cristiano and others are outright lying about what was in the header, then there really isn't any other conclusion to be reached -- they came from the same machine. Keep in mind, that email and its headers have been forwarded around. If someone was lying, it'd have been exposed by now.

Surreal Farber

Cat Herder

Join date: 5 Feb 2004

Posts: 2,059

05-11-2006 11:46

This thread hasn't been Jeskaed yet?

_____________________

Surreal

Phobos 3d Design - putting the hot in psychotic since 2004

Come see our whole line of clothing, animations and accessories in Chaos (37, 198, 43)

Lecktor Hannibal

YOUR MOM

Join date: 1 Jul 2004

Posts: 6,734

05-11-2006 11:47

From: Cocoanut Cookie

Opinion:

I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny.

Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked.

If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual.

But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her?

coco

LOL

_____________________

YOUR MOM says, 'Come visit us at SC MKII http://secondcitizen.net '

From: Khamon Fate

Oh, Lecktor, you're terrible.

Bikers have more fun than people !

Aimee Weber

The one on the right

Join date: 30 Jan 2004

Posts: 4,286

05-11-2006 11:48

From: Cocoanut Cookie

Opinion:

I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny.

Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked.

If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual.

But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her?

coco

No case is necessary. Everybody can decide for themselves. The IP of the perp was obtained from the e-mail. The suspects were narrowed down to a few people, and one of those suspects had the same IP as the e-mail,

-Maybe the dynamic IP system shuffled the IP address from the perp to the innocent accused just before they were busted. Hey stranger things have happened.

-Maybe somebody else obtained her IP address and then spoofed it in hopes of framing her!

-Or maybe the person sending the e-mail under that IP address, and the suspect going to cristiano's website are the same person.

I'm going with Occam's Razor on this one, but everybody can decide for themselves.

_____________________

Lewis Nerd

Nerd by name and nature!

Join date: 9 Oct 2005

Posts: 3,431

05-11-2006 11:51

From: Belaya Statosky

So they had the IP and they got an exact match later. Unless you believe Cristiano and others are outright lying about what was in the header, then there really isn't any other conclusion to be reached -- they came from the same machine. Keep in mind, that email and its headers have been forwarded around. If someone was lying, it'd have been exposed by now.

Actually so far, none of it has been proven - we've just been told "it is true".

I'm still trying to find out the motive for whatever and whoever it truly is. That's what's more puzzling.

Lewis

_____________________

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Dhalia Unsung

confused not conditioned

Join date: 30 Dec 2004

Posts: 297

05-11-2006 11:52

i just read this pdf. Its disgusting. Its one thing to make claims about FiC (whether i believe it or not doesnt matter in the slightest). But these vitrolic and extremely cruel personal attacks have no place in this "article". Any good journalist knows you can make a point without getting personal.

what the hell?! "over-weight pigtailed... quirky personality which all plump girls develop to compensate for their lack of appearance" I really have no words to ... Im shocked! I don't know Aimee but no one deserves hearing things like this! It sure seems like the person who wrote this has a hardon for Aimee because in the second pdf it even gets worse. Im not even going to quote those because its downright disgusting.

"...whines incessantly, and this combined with high-pitched overtly feminized vocal tones..." Oh yeah, this was necessary!

Not only that we go on to rip on an sl member who comes here to enjoy the sexual aspects because "she's... contracted so many STD's that the only place she can get off is a virtual world." *shakes her head*

I really feel sorry for the writer. They OBVIOUSLY have issues. HUGE issues.

And Im sorry for the people mentioned in the articles. Im sorry they have to deal with such disgusting personal attacks. Its funny they call the "FiC" attention seekers when thats obviously all these articles are for.

Belaya Statosky

Information Retrieval

Join date: 3 Jun 2004

Posts: 552

05-11-2006 11:55

From: Lewis Nerd

Actually so far, none of it has been proven - we've just been told "it is true".

I'm still trying to find out the motive for whatever and whoever it truly is. That's what's more puzzling.

Lewis

I've seen the headers and I've seen the logs, Lewis. But yeah, I guess Metaverse Messenger is in the habit of framing other people by changing email headers before forwarding stuff onwards and Cristiano is a liar about what he pulls out of his access logs. Hell, I'm a liar, too.

This still doesn't change the fact that if everyone is telling the truth on those two items, that IP masquerading DID NOT occur.

Zapoteth Zaius

Is back

Join date: 14 Feb 2004

Posts: 5,634

05-11-2006 11:58

From: Surreal Farber

This thread hasn't been Jeskaed yet?

But its about to be Zapped..

Locking this thread for Linden Review.

Torley Linden writes:
And Zapped it has been! And now I am keeping it closed... very sad. These types of personal disputes are inappropriate, as per our Guidelines.

_____________________

I have the right to remain silent. Anything I say will be misquoted and used against me.
---------------
Zapoteth Designs, Temotu (100,50)
---------------

I am the subject of Cris's tyrade.
Cristiano Midnight Evil Snapshot Baron Join date: 17 May 2003 Posts: 8,616	05-11-2006 11:38 From: Cocoanut Cookie Opinion: I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny. Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked. If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual. But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her? coco I again will remind you that the person who made this public was Phaylen. I went to her last night and presented all of this to her, and talked to her about it. The IP address spoofing theory is ridiculous, and the IP has been confirmed multiple times. _____________________ Cristiano ANOmations - huge selection of high quality, low priced animations all $100L or less. ~SLUniverse.com~ SL's oldest and largest community site, featuring Snapzilla image sharing, forums, and much more.
Cocoanut Cookie Registered User Join date: 26 Jan 2006 Posts: 1,741	05-11-2006 11:39 From: Cristiano Midnight I again will remind you that the person who made this public was Phaylen. I went to her last night and presented all of this to her, and talked to her about it. Point taken. coco _____________________
DoctorEgon Spengler Who you gonna call? Join date: 7 Mar 2006 Posts: 92	05-11-2006 11:43 From: Sarg Bjornson A sentence in the first document has really scared me... "There ate two kinds of FIC..." Does that mean the FIC is out to eat us all? Mom, I'm scared they eat babies. it's true.
Belaya Statosky Information Retrieval Join date: 3 Jun 2004 Posts: 552	05-11-2006 11:46 From: Cocoanut Cookie Opinion: I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked. No they can't. Ignoring things such as proxies, we're discussing taking someone's specific address and then masquerading as it. That cannot be done unless the machine was compromised, which is unlikely. Think of it this way: Communication between two points requires more than just shouting in one direction (usually). In this case, working with a webmail site to send mail means traffic needs to be passed back and forth in order to work (quite a few times, actually -- there's a whole acknowledgement to initiate a connection). There are tricky ways that are mathmatically improbable to try and sequence your forged traffic so it looks like you're constantly replying while the responses the other person is sending to the victim go ignore because the victim's machine has no idea to respond to it. This is so hard that you shouldn't even consider it is being done over something like this -- I've never actually seen this type of hijack done in the wild. Now other types of email, it's possible to (sometimes) forge the email header, but that usually leaves mistakes all over it that flag it as faked. In this case, the webmail provider handles the entire thing leaving no chance for this to be done. So they had the IP and they got an exact match later. Unless you believe Cristiano and others are outright lying about what was in the header, then there really isn't any other conclusion to be reached -- they came from the same machine. Keep in mind, that email and its headers have been forwarded around. If someone was lying, it'd have been exposed by now.
Surreal Farber Cat Herder Join date: 5 Feb 2004 Posts: 2,059	05-11-2006 11:46 This thread hasn't been Jeskaed yet? _____________________ Surreal Phobos 3d Design - putting the hot in psychotic since 2004 Come see our whole line of clothing, animations and accessories in Chaos (37, 198, 43)
Lecktor Hannibal YOUR MOM Join date: 1 Jul 2004 Posts: 6,734	05-11-2006 11:47 From: Cocoanut Cookie Opinion: I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny. Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked. If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual. But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her? coco LOL _____________________ YOUR MOM says, 'Come visit us at SC MKII http://secondcitizen.net ' From: Khamon Fate Oh, Lecktor, you're terrible. Bikers have more fun than people !
Aimee Weber The one on the right Join date: 30 Jan 2004 Posts: 4,286	05-11-2006 11:48 From: Cocoanut Cookie Opinion: I don't think any of this is funny in the slightest, whether or not this person is guilty, and I think it says volumes about a person who does find it funny. Moreover, I've read the documents, read this individual's blog, and am far from convinced that she is guilty. Not being in on all this, maybe it is as obvious as people are saying - but the case hasn't been made, as far as I'm concerned. I'm more likely to be swayed by the fact that IP addresses can be faked. If this person isn't guilty, what is being done to her is a far graver crime than any opinions put on a PDF. I understand that people would be anxious to find out who it is, and have no particular ax to grind just because the signs point to this individual. But stop and think - what if she isn't the one? Then what have you done to her? coco No case is necessary. Everybody can decide for themselves. The IP of the perp was obtained from the e-mail. The suspects were narrowed down to a few people, and one of those suspects had the same IP as the e-mail, -Maybe the dynamic IP system shuffled the IP address from the perp to the innocent accused just before they were busted. Hey stranger things have happened. -Maybe somebody else obtained her IP address and then spoofed it in hopes of framing her! -Or maybe the person sending the e-mail under that IP address, and the suspect going to cristiano's website are the same person. I'm going with Occam's Razor on this one, but everybody can decide for themselves. _____________________
Lewis Nerd Nerd by name and nature! Join date: 9 Oct 2005 Posts: 3,431	05-11-2006 11:51 From: Belaya Statosky So they had the IP and they got an exact match later. Unless you believe Cristiano and others are outright lying about what was in the header, then there really isn't any other conclusion to be reached -- they came from the same machine. Keep in mind, that email and its headers have been forwarded around. If someone was lying, it'd have been exposed by now. Actually so far, none of it has been proven - we've just been told "it is true". I'm still trying to find out the motive for whatever and whoever it truly is. That's what's more puzzling. Lewis _____________________ Second Life Stratics - your new premier resource for all things Second Life. Free to join, sign up today! Pocket Protector Projects - Rosieri 90,234,84 - building and landscaping services
Dhalia Unsung confused not conditioned Join date: 30 Dec 2004 Posts: 297	05-11-2006 11:52 i just read this pdf. Its disgusting. Its one thing to make claims about FiC (whether i believe it or not doesnt matter in the slightest). But these vitrolic and extremely cruel personal attacks have no place in this "article". Any good journalist knows you can make a point without getting personal. what the hell?! "over-weight pigtailed... quirky personality which all plump girls develop to compensate for their lack of appearance" I really have no words to ... Im shocked! I don't know Aimee but no one deserves hearing things like this! It sure seems like the person who wrote this has a hardon for Aimee because in the second pdf it even gets worse. Im not even going to quote those because its downright disgusting. "...whines incessantly, and this combined with high-pitched overtly feminized vocal tones..." Oh yeah, this was necessary! Not only that we go on to rip on an sl member who comes here to enjoy the sexual aspects because "she's... contracted so many STD's that the only place she can get off is a virtual world." shakes her head I really feel sorry for the writer. They OBVIOUSLY have issues. HUGE issues. And Im sorry for the people mentioned in the articles. Im sorry they have to deal with such disgusting personal attacks. Its funny they call the "FiC" attention seekers when thats obviously all these articles are for.
Belaya Statosky Information Retrieval Join date: 3 Jun 2004 Posts: 552	05-11-2006 11:55 From: Lewis Nerd Actually so far, none of it has been proven - we've just been told "it is true". I'm still trying to find out the motive for whatever and whoever it truly is. That's what's more puzzling. Lewis I've seen the headers and I've seen the logs, Lewis. But yeah, I guess Metaverse Messenger is in the habit of framing other people by changing email headers before forwarding stuff onwards and Cristiano is a liar about what he pulls out of his access logs. Hell, I'm a liar, too. This still doesn't change the fact that if everyone is telling the truth on those two items, that IP masquerading DID NOT occur.
Zapoteth Zaius Is back Join date: 14 Feb 2004 Posts: 5,634	05-11-2006 11:58 From: Surreal Farber This thread hasn't been Jeskaed yet? But its about to be Zapped.. Locking this thread for Linden Review. Torley Linden writes: And Zapped it has been! And now I am keeping it closed... very sad. These types of personal disputes are inappropriate, as per our Guidelines. _____________________ I have the right to remain silent. Anything I say will be misquoted and used against me. --------------- Zapoteth Designs, Temotu (100,50) ---------------

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I am the subject of Cris's tyrade.