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SecondLife: The Lost Aesthetic (Or The Eyesore of Rampant Consumerism)

Kiamat Dusk
Protest Warrior
Join date: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 1,525
11-26-2005 08:22
This is going to sound strange coming from an admitted pro-sumer, but it seems to me that much of the beauty and wonder of Second Life has given way to the onslaught of consumerism, marketing, and avarice. Gone are the awe inspiring vistas like Heaven and Rivendell, replaced by gaudy casinos, obnoxious Tringo/Slingo boards, and a jumble siezure inducing vendors.

Sure every once in a while Bedazzle comes along to knock our socks off, but they never stick around for long. They're like a travelling circus and once they've gone we all shuffle back to our malls and our Slingo parlors and our favorite cookie cutter clubs.

What happened to the artists who would build beautiful things simply for beauty's sake? I understand that it costs money to rent land and with the LL subsidies gone, it's hard, but what about charging a small admission fee? I know I'd be more than happy to throw down some cash in order to be able to get away for a while and just wander around a well designed, well imagined area and get away from all the glitz if only for a little while.

-Kiamat Dusk
Laments the loss of Rivendell and Heaven...
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Paolo Portocarrero
Puritanical Hedonist
Join date: 28 Apr 2004
Posts: 2,393
11-26-2005 08:26
I agree with the sentiment of your post, Kiamat. However, I believe that we need to keep SL open and minimally restricted so that those same artists will have the freedom and incentive to create their awe-inspiring works.
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Forseti Svarog
ESC
Join date: 2 Nov 2004
Posts: 1,730
11-26-2005 08:28
beauty definitely exists... the places may have changed, but there's still a lot of people out there interested in beauty. If you liked Rivendell, go check out the expansion of Lauk's nest -- lauk has done amazing things.

there were a lot of commercial builds a year ago and there are now... and some commercial builds are actually quite beautiful
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Kiamat Dusk
Protest Warrior
Join date: 30 Sep 2004
Posts: 1,525
11-26-2005 08:31
From: Paolo Portocarrero
I agree with the sentiment of your post, Kiamat. However, I believe that we need to keep SL open and minimally restricted so that those same artists will have the freedom and incentive to create their awe-inspiring works.



I agree with you completely. I'm not stumping for zoning or building standards, just praying for the return of just awesome builds or a compromise of awesomely built malls/casinos. Nomine is a great example or the two Transylvania sims.

-Kiamat Dusk
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"My pain is constant and sharp and I do not hope for a better world for anyone. In fact I want my pain to be inflicted on others. I want no one to escape." -Bret Easton Ellis 'American Psycho'

"Anger is a gift." -RATM "Freedom"

From: Vares Solvang
Eat me, you vile waste of food.
(Can you spot the irony?)

http://writing.com/authors/suffer
Enabran Templar
Capitalist Pig
Join date: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 4,506
11-26-2005 08:32
Something can have commercial intent without being painfully ugly.

There are a lot of people in SL who couldn't care less about artistry and polish in their business -- or their personal stuff. I am not one of these, and I am continually disappointed by others who are. Second Life is ugly because of lack of followthrough and lack of passion. In a perfect world, clubs would be gorgeous expressions of theirs owners' desire to bring people together. Instead, we usually have boxes of mis-aligned textures and other painful examples of geometry. That this is the case is disappointing but unavoidable -- symptomatic more of individuals than of business itself.
Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
11-26-2005 08:33
From: Enabran Templar
Something can have commercial intent without being painfully ugly.

There are a lot of people in SL who couldn't care less about artistry and polish in their business -- or their personal stuff. I am not one of these, and I am continually disappointed by others who are. Second Life is ugly because of lack of followthrough and lack of passion. In a perfect world, clubs would be gorgeous expressions of theirs owners' desire to bring people together. Instead, we usually have boxes of mis-aligned textures and other painful examples of geometry. That this is the case is disappointing but unavoidable -- symptomatic more of individuals than of business itself.

And quite like the real world, too.

coco
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squall Murakami
Burning SOMETHING
Join date: 5 Sep 2005
Posts: 84
11-26-2005 08:33
it IS just annoying seeing something like a one prim texture blade on a sword, or a car made out of just textures... i really, just hate that.. thats why I do my best when building to be as... interesting as possible
Tod69 Talamasca
The Human Tripod ;)
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 4,107
11-26-2005 08:50
Aye! If there's one thing I like to see in SL is some creativity. Even in Clubs! Not the simple hollow room w/ dance floor, but the ones with the scripted light show, emitters, and all kinds O' Crazy stuff! I too, would like to see a SL area for Artists (being one myself). And dont forget- sometimes it's not how "artsy" it is, but how well it works, like amusement park rides. Stuff like that.
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Foolish Frost
Grand Technomancer
Join date: 7 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,433
11-26-2005 08:57
Well, their are two sides to that idea...

Of COURSE malls, homes, and clubs don't have to be ugly. They don't even have to be 'normal'. The Rave Rose Dance Club, Aztecha, Ravenglass... All were made to be pleasing to the eye (no. not everyone's eyes.) and reasonably easy to navigate.

The problem is cost: The land owner has to PAY for the build, and that cost is added to the initial cost of land. This leads to a longer recoup time for thier shops to become profitable.

So?

Easy. I've seen no evidence it actually helps get customers. In fact, the only benifit I've seen is that the place is complimented more often, making the owner feel better about themselves for paying to have it built.
Cadroe Murphy
Assistant to Mr. Shatner
Join date: 31 Jul 2003
Posts: 689
11-26-2005 09:04
It seems like a tradeoff. There are a lot more commercial builds in the world than there used to be. But there is also a higher quality of content overall because of the money to be made.
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Enabran Templar
Capitalist Pig
Join date: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 4,506
11-26-2005 09:10
From: Foolish Frost
Easy. I've seen no evidence it actually helps get customers.


One of the easiest ways to differentiate yourself in Second Life is to appear professional. Credibility is important and establishing that credibility through a professional-looking build can't hurt. I know that I took the retailers who put time into their builds a whole lot more seriously when I was a newb.
Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
11-26-2005 09:22
From: Cadroe Murphy
It seems like a tradeoff. There are a lot more commercial builds in the world than there used to be. But there is also a higher quality of content overall because of the money to be made.


Yep, I agree with that completely.
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Foolish Frost
Grand Technomancer
Join date: 7 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,433
11-26-2005 09:25
From: Enabran Templar
One of the easiest ways to differentiate yourself in Second Life is to appear professional. Credibility is important and establishing that credibility through a professional-looking build can't hurt. I know that I took the retailers who put time into their builds a whole lot more seriously when I was a newb.



True. But by WHO? Other builders? That helps with socializing with other named individuals, I suppose. And helps build brand recognition as well...

Bottom line I was talking about is that it does not seem to offer greater profit to the average mall owner/club owner.
Enabran Templar
Capitalist Pig
Join date: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 4,506
11-26-2005 10:04
From: Foolish Frost
True. But by WHO? Other builders? That helps with socializing with other named individuals, I suppose. And helps build brand recognition as well...

Bottom line I was talking about is that it does not seem to offer greater profit to the average mall owner/club owner.


If you have a build that looks amazingly life-like, you're going to attract much more curiosity than someone whose build looks like an enormous, poorly textured shoebox. I think that's the case with anyone, experienced builder or not. That alone is worth it to me.
Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
11-26-2005 10:06
I might be a good test case.



Just flying by, West Trade Imports looks residential and is about 50% forested.

In a PG sim - not a single mature item in the entire place.

Buyers have to explore a house to find 95% of items offered for sale. Not 'stuff' scattered about under an open sky.


Foolish strategy? Perhaps. Likely there are far more profitable methods, but this is what pleases me.

If it were just about money, I'd open a sex casino. Or something. Feh.
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Foolish Frost
Grand Technomancer
Join date: 7 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,433
11-26-2005 10:13
And that was my point: People who do it don't do it for immediate profit.

And that's why not everyone does it, and you have cube-clubs... :(
Enabran Templar
Capitalist Pig
Join date: 26 Aug 2004
Posts: 4,506
11-26-2005 10:25
From: Foolish Frost
And that was my point: People who do it don't do it for immediate profit.

And that's why not everyone does it, and you have cube-clubs... :(


Oh well. They're avoided easily enough. :)
Laukosargas Svarog
Angel ?
Join date: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,304
11-26-2005 10:42
From: Kiamat Dusk


...

What happened to the artists who would build beautiful things simply for beauty's sake?

-Kiamat Dusk
Laments the loss of Rivendell and Heaven...


So do I lament the loss , it seems nearly all the great artists who were here when I joined SL and who were the entire reason i joined SL in the first place have left. I'm not naming names but I know one or two great builders who simply got fed up with the utter negativity of the place. I'm begining to understand how they felt. I seem to be permanently on the verge of throwing in the towel these days.


... and thank you for your kind words Forseti ! :)
Surreal Farber
Cat Herder
Join date: 5 Feb 2004
Posts: 2,059
11-26-2005 10:49
Come visit Chaos. Lovely and very detailed futristic urban build.
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Artemis Fate
I'm a big stupid-face.
Join date: 24 Oct 2003
Posts: 746
11-26-2005 11:04
From: Kiamat Dusk
This is going to sound strange coming from an admitted pro-sumer, but it seems to me that much of the beauty and wonder of Second Life has given way to the onslaught of consumerism, marketing, and avarice. Gone are the awe inspiring vistas like Heaven and Rivendell, replaced by gaudy casinos, obnoxious Tringo/Slingo boards, and a jumble siezure inducing vendors.

Sure every once in a while Bedazzle comes along to knock our socks off, but they never stick around for long. They're like a travelling circus and once they've gone we all shuffle back to our malls and our Slingo parlors and our favorite cookie cutter clubs.

What happened to the artists who would build beautiful things simply for beauty's sake? I understand that it costs money to rent land and with the LL subsidies gone, it's hard, but what about charging a small admission fee? I know I'd be more than happy to throw down some cash in order to be able to get away for a while and just wander around a well designed, well imagined area and get away from all the glitz if only for a little while.

-Kiamat Dusk
Laments the loss of Rivendell and Heaven...


Well, as a big explorer of the SL grid I can agree with you and disagree with you. SL is indeed a lot of pre-fab houses, crappy looking casinos and clubs, and franchise stores all over the place. And a good chunk of the private sims now are rental private sims with the aforementioned in them all the same. But there are treasures still though they be growing less and less.

The problem is a few things here:

1.) Creativity isn't necessary in SL's consumer world. You don't need to make your club look pretty or your casino realistic, because people don't come there for that, infact sometimes it makes it laggier and worse. All you have to do is build a shoe-box with lights and run tringo and best thong events 24/7 and you'll be guarenteed top 10 club within 2 weeks.

2.) People don't want solely creative things anymore, they want places to do something. You don't just build a place as an art work anymore, you need to build it as an artwork with a shop, or a club. One of the questions i'm asked a lot in Nexus Prime, a place that has no clubs, events, or casinos but still stretches across 2 sims, is "What are you going t odo with this place?" And I always answer "What do you mean? We built it to look nice, that's what we did with it." And they run around the city for a few more minutes, take some potshots at the walls with open source guns and then run off to the clubs and casinos, never to be seen in Nexus Prime again.

3.) Is on that, is that pretty and creative places don't hold interest. They're like the grand canyon or other landmarks, you go look at it for maybe a day then it just starts to look less and less amazing. Beautiful things don't hold people's attention for long, they need to do something besides be beautiful. So even if you make the entire grid a creatively wonderful place, chances are the last bastion of clubs in SL, whatever it may be and as ugly as it is, would probably have that tower of green dots at it that we're all so familiar for.

Basically, there are still nice looking and creative things in SL, look up the Mushroom Kingdom for one, that's quite possibly the most creative thing ever in SL. It's just that unless they run events, have a club in them, or a casino, or a mall with popular stores they'll not attract any attention like the clubs do and people won't hear about them.
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Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
11-26-2005 11:18
I also wonder if at least part of the blame can be laid at the foot of a certain person who has problems with a certain president.

Why bother making your build look nice if it can be ruined by someone else who buys an adjacent 512?
Foolish Frost
Grand Technomancer
Join date: 7 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,433
11-26-2005 11:22
From: Yumi Murakami
I also wonder if at least part of the blame can be laid at the foot of a certain person who has problems with a certain president.

Why bother making your build look nice if it can be ruined by someone else who buys an adjacent 512?


:confused:

Sorry. Can't follow that. How about once more around the park with less cryptic?
Noel Marlowe
Victim of Occam's Razor
Join date: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 275
11-26-2005 11:26
Anti-President Bush signs.
Forseti Svarog
ESC
Join date: 2 Nov 2004
Posts: 1,730
11-26-2005 12:00
From: Laukosargas Svarog
who simply got fed up with the utter negativity of the place. I'm begining to understand how they felt. I seem to be permanently on the verge of throwing in the towel these days.


bah!

ignore the negativity... you can find it everywhere... first life, second life, gazillion life... anywhere human beings exist... SL will never return to the artist enclave of beta, and the only way to achieve that atmosphere again is to create a new SL and shut the doors once the population hits a few hundred.

that said, SL is now a zillion microcosms of mini-cultures. There are groups of people out there who still create for the joy of it, and while many sell their creations, the money isn't their raison d'etre. One can escape the negativity simply by ignoring the forums and choosing one's friends wisely.

would sure hate to see you go
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Heather Partridge
...and so am I.
Join date: 9 Feb 2005
Posts: 12
Games2 sim
11-26-2005 12:13
the games2 sim (and games1 as well) are a nice place to visit.
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