Your SL Business Name is not Safe!!!!!

Hate to say it ( as it has already been said )

As Gypsy moon already exists you don't have a leg to stand on, and nothing to complain about.

LL can't enforce it ( that would set a presidence they don't want to get into ) and attempting to take it to RL would land you face to face with the real gypsy moon - who might take umbridge at you using their name.

If you want a unique name that no-one else can use - pick one, then trademark it

It's gonna cost yer - but without that you cannot do a thing as all the other person has to say is "So ? I like that name as well, you don't own it - so I can use it"

RL laws have started arriving in SL I'm afraid - and the bigger it gets the more RL stuff will start coming in.

( Myself - I will have to pick a new name soon as Caligari is already taken in RL )

Hate to say it ( as it has already been said )

As Gypsy moon already exists you don't have a leg to stand on, and nothing to complain about.

LL can't enforce it ( that would set a presidence they don't want to get into ) and attempting to take it to RL would land you face to face with the real gypsy moon - who might take umbridge at you using their name.

If you want a unique name that no-one else can use - pick one, then trademark it

It's gonna cost yer - but without that you cannot do a thing as all the other person has to say is "So ? I like that name as well, you don't own it - so I can use it"

RL laws have started arriving in SL I'm afraid - and the bigger it gets the more RL stuff will start coming in.

( Myself - I will have to pick a new name soon as Caligari is already taken in RL )

i dont think so, LL have been quick to protect RL companies images such as star wars etc's copyright, so if you register a RL company trademark, inform LL of the copyright violation surely they'd have to act in the same manner

Since trademarks are generally territorial, am not quite sure about it. That is, if SL is expected to be 'virtual space' it may be difficult for a company located in any particular country to prove their trademark extends to what's world-wide 'net space. Although U.S. company is likely to have more leverage here, given they share physical location with LL servers...

That's like trying to have your cake and eat it at the same time.
If a name already was used in RL, you cannot bring it to SL without permission (hence the police blotter about products "a drink named Coca-Cola" etc.). Same goes for SL: if it already exists, you should not be allowed to use it without permission.

However, some sidenotes (as far as I know):
1. TMd names, like Coca-Cola means that the brandname is protected and therefore cannot be used by anyone without permission to name anything.
2. Generic names can be used if the product is different. An example could be someone named McDonalds (assuming the name isn't TMd) is opening up a clothing shop called McDonalds... A clothing shop has no correlation or competition to a fastfood restaurant. However, opening a bar Chez McDonalds might cause problems because of the possible overlap of deliverables.

But I'm no lawyer; it's just my general perception of some issues if seen/heard about in the past.

OK, let's write up a conventional argument.

1. Trademarks should be dealed with the same with RL. So you might have to give up using it, if it had already been registerd in RL.

2. Keep it in the grey zone. Although you can use it, you have to admit of others using it.

3. Hey, we are just playing in the virtual world. RL is no matter. All we have to have is in-world's order.

Lol, I completely missed that the first time I read her stuff.

If your a lawyer, why are you posting here asking for suggestions? Go sue happy on them!

Oh and the real "Gypsy Moon" people might not be happy with you, ofcourse you know this being a lawyer.

I'm sure glad now that I picked a stupid name.

Mr. P's

Does everything have to be a legal event? No.

Is Linden Labs a court of law, judge, or qualified legal professional or professional corporation? No.

The issue you have is a question of fact - Whether you have an established trademark in "Gypsy Moon", or any given arbitrary trademarkable name; Or, whether some other entity holds that trademark.

Second Life is not a closed society/space/system. It is still subject to the laws of the United States, and so is Linden Labs. They're not a court of law, nor a judge, and for them to engage in a decision as to who rightfully can exercise trademark rights or copyrights is irresponsible to the trademark holder and to anyone who contests same. It's also opening themselves to liability for contributing to wrongful exercise of trademark rights and copyrights.

They want to reach common carrier status - wherein they are not responsible for the content transmitted in any way, shape, or form - as opposed to service provider status, where they have some expectation of policing. They do not extend that 'policing' to legal questions, be they questions of fact, questions of opinion, etcetera. They're not going there.

The law provides a process under DMCA that Linden Labs is required to follow - the DMCA takedown and counter-takedown process. The DMCA is apparently meant as a recourse for copyright/trademark holders to protect their intellectual property without having to step into a court of law to enforce law when there are no questions of fact - to cut down on litigation.

Does it work? You seem to think it does not. Do you feel that Linden Labs is not pursuing the DMCA takedown requests or counter-takedown requests in a timely or professional manner? Compile evidence. You may wish to consider legal action to discover whether they are or not.

I think that if you do so, you would discover that they have retained professional legal help to ensure that their DMCA takedown requests and counter-takedown requests are processed in a timely manner and in accordance with the law - and no less, and no more.

Why?

Again, it is so important that I will repeat it: They are not courts of law, nor are they themselves legal professionals. It is not their place to decide questions of fact as to the ownership of particular parcels of intellectual property, and it is irresponsible for them to entangle themselves in such questions except as far as the law requires them to do so.

If you feel that current trademark law or copyright law is insufficient to protect an informally-created, unregistered trademark or copyright - then I urge you to undertake the process of enacting a change in legislation.

If you feel that people are being taken to the cleaners by others who are formally registering an existing trademark/copyright as their own, then I urge you to author and widely disseminate advice to trademark holders/copyright holders as to how they may best protect their interests within the scope and framework of the current law, and how they may work to change current law.

But asking Linden Labs to put their hand in is not - in my opinion - a reasonable thing to ask.

I am not a lawyer. This is not legal advice. It's my opinion - solely.

hehe, I just googled mine. I may have to add "*not to be confused with the Catholic Men's Fellowship of Florida, or the Conference on Modelling Fluid Flow" to my sig.

Your first mention in Google is #9 out of a list of about 79,500, right under Mr. Pessimistic and Dr. P's Dog Training. Not too shabby!

This place gets worse and worse.

'gypsy moon' is hardly original or creative. no shit someone else used it. has nothing to do with you its just a common name

A voice of reason, speaking out in a wilderness of whining.

It doesn't really matter, people always think I am Chip Midnight anyway. I finally gave up and started selling his skins

That's true Joannah. If a business is located in say Australia and hs not taken the time to register their trademerk with the USPTO then it's free domain. The thing is that most large companies worldwide do in fact register their trademarks in the U.S. because they sell their products here.



Adriana,

In the U.S. the following Trademarks exist regarding your name:

CALIGARIS OF PARAGUAY
(cancelled status)

THE CABINET OF DR. CALIGARI

Neither of these are registered in the particular class yours would be in. So I don't think that you would have to get a new name at all. LL resides in the U.S. so if no one is using your name and has it registered in the U.S. then you don't have a problem.

Since the original poster is a lawyer, I'm sure she knows all this, but a number of people have posted some common misconceptions about trademarks to this thread.

1) No matter what the Lindens tell you, the DMCA--or any other copyright law--has no bearing on a trademark. Copyright and trademark are two different things under the law. Filing a DMCA takedown notice over a trademark violation will just make you look ignorant. [1]

2) Just because someone else is using the same name as you, does not mean they are necessarily infringing. It is possible for multiple companies to have registered trademarks for identical names. In trademark law, this is not a problem as long as the marks do not cover similar goods and services, i.e., there is no "likelihood of confusion" or "overlapping channels of trade".

As a practical matter, if you are the first to use a mark in one of the forty-five classes in the International Schedule of Classes of Goods and Services, you are almost certainly going to get the mark. It is also possible to have the same mark awarded to multiple holders even in the same International Class--as long as the Patent & Trademark Office can be persuaded that the marks will not conflict with each other. A listing of the classes is available at:

http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/doc/basic/international.htm

Just because someone else is using a name, doesn't necessarily mean you can't also use it, too. As an example, there could be multiple "Gypsy Moon" businesses. A "Gypsy Moon" restaurant would likely not conflict with a "Gypsy Moon" clothing designer or a "Gypsy Moon" software company.

Note that if you do apply, your International Class will probably be 042, which includes "design and development of computer hardware and software", and not the class that what you make and sell would fall into if it was not a "virtual" good. This is something you might want to talk to a lawyer about first.

3) There are both state and federal trademark registrations. A federal registration is preferable. If someone registers "Gypsy Moon" in as a state registration in Texas, that would not prevent someone else from registering it in California. Applying for a federal registration costs 325 US$. That may be worth the money for some SL businesses.

You don't need a lawyer to file a basic trademark application. It is something that you can do yourself--if you take the time to research and understand the law. I'm not a lawyer, and I've done well over a dozen successful trademark applications in the last two years.

4) LL adding some sort of SL trademark system would not do much good. Say I "registered" my SL business "Carl Metropolitan Designs" (horrible name--I go by CMD now) with the SL registry. Then someone else--in game or out--registered it with the US Patent & Trademark Office. In such a case, the SL "registration" would not be worth the pixels it was printed on if owner of the Federal mark complained to SL about infringement.

5) Virtual space or not--as long as the SL servers are located in the US--US trademark law applies in SL. However, most nations have treaty arrangements so that a mark can be registered internationally. Look up the Madrid Protocol. You will probably need a lawyer to help with this.

[1] For the pedantic, they only way copyright might possibly apply is if you are using a logo you designed--and the person violating your trademark is using a very similar logo. You could claim copyright protection for that particular artistic expression of the logo. However, the infringer could just change his or her logo--and still use your name. It would also be a really ass-backwards way of dealing with a trademark claim.

My forum tag isnt safe either! I saw someone using the store name Banannah Annah! (or something like that)

I really don't care about the issue at hand one way or another, I just have to make a pedantic comment on one of those niggly little things that drive me up a wall:

The word is not copywrite. The word is copyright. As in 'the right to copy'. I don't know who started the 'copywrite' thing, but it needs to stop. Before I'm forced to go on a paintball spree across the internet. It looks dumb. Don't do it.


This has been a public service announcement. Thank you.

FYI I am "the real" GM people!

No, thank *you*. This annoys me almost as much as folks who talk about "freedom of speach" and "bank withdrawls".

A note to everyone crying about the bad lindens and how they have changed and how sad it is etc.

I am sorry to break it to you but, just by wishing so, does not make LL or SL a law free space.

I saw somebody doing a copy of a dress of Project Runway. Surely a lot of work. Still a non licenced use. If you sell stuff with labels on them which have trademarks etc on them, you are looking for trouble.

You may have gotten away with it in the past - but only because it would not look good on companies at the moment to come into second life and as a first act start suing people.

But, they will come, sooner than later.

Having a business by the same name? As long as you don't have an international mark registered for this, you will not have a chance to force Linden to eventually change it. And if at all, it would be you against the newbies. i would be careful though. THEY might have had the legal work done.

What is interesting though it the article about patented work - this is something we have to be careful aware of. If people start doing trivial patents in Second Life and get them granted and not disputed, this might have a much bigger impact than just some people having a business by the same name.

Image what happens when somebody does patent a way "to produce a virtual good which resemles the fall / texture / behaviour of real close on an avatar or piece of building in a virtual reality world". NOBODY will be able then to use flex prims for clothes without paying fees!
If you are afraid of something, this should be the things you should be aware of.

you should not assume a disconnect! just sayin' Some people do have real world business interests that have a presence in SL.

Looks like the trademark process would be required to protect the use of the name, and even then there are issues of enforcement.

There are now griefers in SL who are having a childish chuckle over this but to many who work hard in SL its an issue of concern.

Prove it.