No Copy vs No Transfer

I'd like to hear from some vendors on what makes them decide between making their items 'transfer / no copy' or 'copy / no transfer'. Mainly with regard to clothes, skins etc rather than objects you place in the world separately - where you obviously choose the former.

Lately I've become irritated with clothes that are 'transfer / no copy'. I like to make a folder with a full outfit in it - from body shape to jewellery to clothes - so I can switch to that outfit in 2 clicks. It's SO irritating to have to load most of an outfit then go rooting around for those other few items that you couldn't copy and want to use in multiple outfits!

That's not true, you often see things to go in the world that are copy/no trans. Sometimes an item is such that a buyer would clearly want a bunch of them (my friend sells a train where you have to lay out pieces of track to make it run on) or where someone might want to modify but be able to know what the original was or where you might lose the item (like a vehicle).

The no copy on outfits is really irritating. I have a humongous inventory, and I have this one no copy outfit I like. I recently lost half of it and I don't remember where I put it, or what avatar I may have saved it with.
It's one of those freak out moments when you realize you thought your clothes were just loading but are instead not even in that folder, and your standing naked in front of people!

That and jewelry! I hate it that you buy an expensive item or a six piece outfit that you can only use in one outfit! I have two necklaces that I use extensively because they can be copied and only buy from slexchange, slboutique where you can see the rights or when a shop post the rights with a item so I know where I stand.

This discussion comes up a lot. The big cutting point for most designers is the size of the investment. Cheap stuff like t-shirts? Copy, no transfer. No one cares if they end up throwing it away when they get tired of it. No one would bother buying a used t-shirt.

A 12,000 Linden animated sex bed? No copy / Transfer OK. If you get tired of it, you'd sure like to be able to sell it to someone else and get some or all of your money back!

Most of my expensive clothes are no-copy, transfer OK, so you can resell your single copy of the outfit later and spend the money on something else. But you can contact me for virtually any one of those, and obtain a copy OK, no transfer version, so you can do just as you were suggesting.

If you're a clothes designer you certianly want to protect your designs/fashions from being sold by the less scrupulous as their designs. This means, as a designer/merchant, you can't set the permissions to copy/transfer. However, many people want to be able to give clothes as gifts. This requires the item to be transferable.

What's really needed (and this has been mentioned many times before) is a setting for no resale. The designer will still need to decide if they want to allow copy and transfer, but at least they will know no one is making a profit from their IP.

I have precisely one outfit on the market, made up with a great deal or prims to accomplish what the clothing in SL just won't do. So not only did I toss in a body shape for the prim inexperienced it's copy, modify, no transfer for those who like to tweak things.

I love some of the modifications I've seen of the original outfit.



This can't stop someone from just handing the outfit to someone else and being paid direct. Or some clever scripter making up some work around that fools the object transfer into thinking it's a gift while 'script b' collects the money. At least as things are right now.

What is the problem with having an item copy/no transfer? I can't sell copies of the clothing because it's not transferable, all the creator is doing is making me extremely frustrated with the inability to create a managable inventory with mulitple outfits, and going mad searching for what I paid for in the first place! Furniture and such I can understand, but clothing, no matter what the price, should have copy permissions.

Personally, I try to make my items as friendly to the user as possible -- which in the case of my swords means I offer both copy/no transfer and transfer/no copy so that people can choose depending on their needs. I leave mod rights on, too, which is risky, I know, but is much better for customers since they're going to want to be able to drop scripts like SafeZone or whatever inside in many cases. The risk is somewhat mitigated by the fact that I heavily restrict permissions on the custom animations and etc. that I include inside them, meaning that even if someone copied my design (not easy to do perfectly since I often use measurements that go beyond the visible decimal places), it wouldn't have the nifty extras.

So far, I've kept my statuettes transfer/no mod/no copy only, as they'd be a little too easy to copy, given mod rights, for my personal comfort. I haven't decided yet whether I might include a copy/no transfer version in the future ... I have mixed feelings about that.

I think the real solution here isn't giving you the ability to copy an item, but giving you the ablility to create a shortcut to it. The item would stay in its original folder, and in your outfit folder you would create a shortcut to it. In fact, when you "save" and outfit, rather than have no-copy items moved into your outfit folder, SL should create shortcuts to everything you are wearing, from your skin to your clothing to your jewelery.

That would be the best way.

In the meantime, what Alex does, giving the options of copy/no trans or trans/no copy is the best way and I would return to any seller who gives that option to their customers.

I've been debating with myself as to whether I should offer things no-copy/trans - at the moment they're almost all copy/no-trans. For vehicles, you really have to have copy turned on, because there are loads of ways one can lose a vehicle by accident. However, for attachments like the guns I sell... it may be the case that no-copy/trans is better. I don't know.

If somebody asked me specially for a trans version of an item I'd certainly sell them one. I've done that before.

Spend L$1000 on a dress. Decide it's the wrong color. It's copy/no transfer. You can't sell it to your girlfriend who adores the dress. You are out $L1000. (I've done this myself. It looked great in the sales pic, but was a bad choice against my skin or fur.)

Spend L$1000 on a dress. Decide it's the wrong color. It's no copy/transfer OK. You can sell it to your girlfriend who adores the dress. Your friend loves her new dress, and you have your $L1000 back to buy something else.

As I said before, if you see a no copy/transfer OK dress that you would rather have as copy/no transfer, try asking the designer. Most of us woule be glad to help.

I don't know about clothing but with vehicles I always sell Copy only. No Mod, No Transfer.
It's for security reasons.
There are so many scripts out there that could take a modable, no copy, vehicle and copy it prim by prim. If effect making it a copy when it wasn't supposed to be.

Or selling a copy, modify, with no transfer, lets anyone take your build, copy it with scripts, add to it, and resell it as many times as they like for less. Or more.
Because the "copied" prims are their own. As if they created it.

Any time I spend money on a dress I take the chance it will look awful on my avie, that is a fact of SL life, no matter what the price. However, if I love this dress and want wear it with different outfits, I'm in a bad mood because I don't want to have to memorize every item in my inventory so I can find what folder I put it in last. What would be best is to allow the customer to choose. For some, the idea of a dress that they can't even give away is unacceptable. For me, a careful shopper, I like most of my clothes and just want to be able to wear them with different outfits without loosing my mind, lol.

Well, if you check the Proposal Voting area of this site, there is a Feature Proposal for allowing an 'alias' for no-copy items to appear in multiple inventory folders. You would still only own one dress of that type, but you could include aliases to it in several outfits. Transfer it to someone else, and you'd lose the original, with all aliases vanishing as well. If they get enough votes and implement something like that, you'll get your wish!

I have much the same issue with many hairstyles. Some of my favorite ones are no-copy, so I have to add them after I add an outfit.

Goody!

(the hair I can manage, I don't have that much hair, but clothes... man, that is a bitch to keep track of)

Dearly Darling,

Or even worse discovering a design flaw for your avatar body type...flesh a hangin' out at the waist for example. You can't give it away...and you can't fix it. The only designer who has ever returned my purchase price was Nonna Hedges. Lovely gowns.

Ever Yours,

Mrs. Showdog Tiger

Yes, fitting an odd body type can be a pain. Most items are made for near-perfect figures. (Much like most Desiger fashions in RL...). I was trying to buy a dress to fit a 'tiny' avatar - a toddler-sized fox. Saw a cute jumper for a Tiny rabbit. Bought it and discovered the outfit won't work with the tiny fox avvie that I own. A large invisiprim around the lower part of the lil' fox hides the prim skirt. *sigh* Can't find a little fox form another vendor that the dress will work with, and don't know anyone who has a Tiny avvie that I could sell the dress to...

BTW - What kind of dogs do you show, dear Lady? I have friends who have been on the show dog circuit in the South Central USA region.

I have different permissions depending on the items. Jewelry is mod / no copy / trans - it seems to be popular as a gift item so transfer is a must, also mod so that people can adjust the size if needed. I know that mod without copy can be problematic since there's no backup copy if one messes up while modding the jewelry, but I'll gladly send the person a new, un-broken copy if they send me their messed-up copy. Also it's a bit on the expensive side, and I want people to be able to give it away when they don't want to wear a particular set anymore. Shoes I sell no mod / copy / no trans, since people are likely to use them in multiple outfits (or so I hope), and since the shoes are no-mod, I offer demos for 0L$, so no-one has to second-guess how well it would fit.

For me as a seller, the great advantage of trans / no copy is that I can do refunds / exchanges without relying on trust. Also I get a lot more people asking for gift delivery of copy / no trans items, than I get people asking for copy / no trans on the jewelry. Both sets of perms have their advantages and problems; I personally lean more towards no-copy / trans both as shop-keeper and as (avid) shopper.

I used to make all my things copy and no transfer, but people would get extremely pissy when they bought an item as a gift, even though there were signs all over the place stating to contact me if you wish to send something as a gift. It got so that it drove me nuts. I then made all my stuff no copy, transfer. people have not complained that my things are transfer and no copy. I would if requested reverse this of course.

Yes, I also disagree with that. All my items are copy okay even though they're phyical objects, except in very rare cases like boxed sets. I generally feel copy is also totally essential if you plan on having any mod abilities granted on an object.

I had one lUser attempt to give me a song and dance on how an item of mine broke because the script "came out" and how he had to buy a new one (no you didn't I get sales logs) , and of course how he wanted his money back but quickly had to shut up when I pointed out the item was fully copiable and short of intentionally deleting it from his inventory, he would always have another to use. Not my problem, bud, please try your scam with someone else.



Really? I had no idea. Hmmm...
Maybe I'll have to rethink my position then.

Well I learned a few things there. Who'da thought it after a whole week in the game!

I realise I generalised a little about non-wearables often being 'no copy' because my main experience with that has been with furniture. It's good to know that people have thought ahead and like Sean make their vehicles copy-able (although I'm wondering how you lose a vehicle!).

I had thought of aliases/links/shortcuts/pointers/call-it-what-you-will for inventory management but forgot to mention it. I'll be voting on that proposal right away!!

I'll definately be contacting a designer or two about getting copy/no-transfer versions of a couple of things I use a lot! Hadn't thought of that!

No transfer, np,
but no copy is a pain, worse is clothing/wearables w/ objects that are no mod *ergh*

Not everyone is the makers' or default size ... Hi!

I appreciate the hair that is copy/modify/no transfer since it almost always needs tweaking and inevitably I can destroy it! At least NOW I know to make a backup copy before attempting to tweak.

And I really appreciate clothes that are no copy/modify/transfer as I can pass them on when I grow weary of them. Rarely have items of clothing self-destructed.

Yes, aliases would be nice to make outfits...but I absolutely hate when items get moved from their nice, neat, somewhat logical folders that I've created.