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Am I wrong? (Do Particles cause collision events?)
Whyzard Lightworker
Registered User
Join date: 3 Dec 2005
Posts: 14
05-23-2006 16:52
[removed]: Hello there, can you please stop running all particle scripts while camping here as it causes us problems
Whyzard Lightworker: I will do as you ask, even if you are in-correct.
[removed]: no. i am not incorrect, it causes script collisions with the camping chairs
[removed]: which , in turn, causes the sim to lag
Whyzard Lightworker: Your own particles cause more lag because they are consistant.
[removed]: if you are unhappy with this please feel free to camp elsewhere
Whyzard Lightworker: Particles do NOT cause collision events. I am not unhappy, I was just pointing out that you are wrong is all.
Whyzard Lightworker: I am enough of a scripter to know the stuff I created. There are no timers, listens, etc. Particles are phantom so can not cause server lag in any way.
[removed]: if you are sitting on a camping chair and the scripts collide they cause problems. I have no wish to argue with you but I feel you should camp elsewhere pls
Whyzard Lightworker: But, I would rather make YOU happy.
Whyzard Lightworker: The particles were removed as soon as you asked.


Can Particles cause script collision events?
Jillian Callahan
Rotary-winged Neko Girl
Join date: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,766
05-23-2006 16:57
From: Whyzard Lightworker
[removed]: Hello there, can you please stop running all particle scripts while camping here as it causes us problems
Whyzard Lightworker: I will do as you ask, even if you are in-correct.
[removed]: no. i am not incorrect, it causes script collisions with the camping chairs
[removed]: which , in turn, causes the sim to lag
Whyzard Lightworker: Your own particles cause more lag because they are consistant.
[removed]: if you are unhappy with this please feel free to camp elsewhere
Whyzard Lightworker: Particles do NOT cause collision events. I am not unhappy, I was just pointing out that you are wrong is all.
Whyzard Lightworker: I am enough of a scripter to know the stuff I created. There are no timers, listens, etc. Particles are phantom so can not cause server lag in any way.
[removed]: if you are sitting on a camping chair and the scripts collide they cause problems. I have no wish to argue with you but I feel you should camp elsewhere pls
Whyzard Lightworker: But, I would rather make YOU happy.
Whyzard Lightworker: The particles were removed as soon as you asked.


Can Particles cause script collision events?
I wish they could. That'd be useful.

Once your script has set the particle parameter of the prim, the script just sits there. Turning off the particles has the same server-side effect.

Particles do, however, cause client-side FPS slowdowns - often called lag. If you're gonna be a-campin' it's better to avoid consuming any resources while you do - server or client side.

The policy is a good one, just based on false ideas.
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Laukosargas Svarog
Angel ?
Join date: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,304
05-23-2006 17:06
heheh, lmao!

That is so hilarious in so many ways ! :D
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Whyzard Lightworker
Registered User
Join date: 3 Dec 2005
Posts: 14
05-23-2006 17:18
I understand particles can cause client lag, but I was concerned exclusively with server lag, which the sim owner claimed was a result of me.

People on lagtops and low end K-mart specials will always complain about lag caused by particles.

Thank you for your time. Its not worth arguing with her but I needed verification for myself.

(You should not argue with someone giving you money, even if they don't know what they are talking about... AKA most RL bosses.)
Jillian Callahan
Rotary-winged Neko Girl
Join date: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,766
05-23-2006 17:28
From: Whyzard Lightworker
I understand particles can cause client lag, but I was concerned exclusively with server lag, which the sim owner claimed was a result of me.

People on lagtops and low end K-mart specials will always complain about lag caused by particles.

Thank you for your time. Its not worth arguing with her but I needed verification for myself.
And you handled that with aplomb and maturity. Kudos.
From: Whyzard Lightworker
(You should not argue with someone giving you money, even if they don't know what they are talking about... AKA most RL bosses.)
Oh my... the horrid, terrible truth of that.
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Kairen Overdrive
Registered User
Join date: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 38
05-23-2006 17:29
People shouldn't complain about particle lag, because its their lazy fault to set the particle max amount in their preference options. ( ctrl+p -> advanced graphics -> particle max count)


And particles are completely client side. The only thing sent is the information about the particle parameters from server to client about a prim.
Keknehv Psaltery
Hacker
Join date: 11 Apr 2005
Posts: 1,185
05-23-2006 18:03
"Script collisions"?

That's great-- thanks for sharing :D
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Bitzer Balderdash
Dazed and Confused
Join date: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 246
05-24-2006 01:22
Can anyone tell me where I can buy a script-shield - I wanna armor my scripts against people firing particles at them! O.o

I'm sure that is what is causing them to not work all the time...
Deneb Rosewood
Registered User
Join date: 2 Feb 2006
Posts: 15
05-24-2006 01:47
Hehehe, I *rofl*ed at this. I'm a scripter specializing in particles, not that it makes me any better a source for facts on them really, but technicly particles don't even exist. You can't click on them, they're completely 2d, and fire 'em at any wall with any settings reguardless of any creative attempt a pro scripter/builder may attempt; they'll pass threw the wall touching nothing every time.

Furthermore...
View > Beacons > Hide Particles
It's just that easy. Not that I'm saying they shouldn't have been turned off, but pass that along to the next person to complain at you about particles.

Seriously... anything you can 'turn off' can't possably be used to make collisions, can you emagin the newbie confusion that would cause? Not to mention the server lag that would come from tens of thousends of temporary thingies with physics enabled, or how if you send off one particle in a random dirrection; no two people will see it moving the same as anyone else."You hit me!" "Nuh uh! I shot that way!" XP amusing subject.
Laukosargas Svarog
Angel ?
Join date: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,304
05-24-2006 04:24
Laukosargas Svarog just hit you with a scripted particle. Would you like to file an Abuse Report ?

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Bitzer Balderdash
Dazed and Confused
Join date: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 246
05-24-2006 04:26
From: Laukosargas Svarog
Laukosargas Svarog just hit you with a scripted particle. Would you like to file an Abuse Report ?



A scripted particle? Now that would be cool!

Hey - maybe we can get ones with html rendered on the side of them? *giggles*
Thraxis Epsilon
Registered User
Join date: 31 Aug 2005
Posts: 211
05-24-2006 07:41
This reminds me of a story one of my friends told me. He likes to use campling chairs himself, especially when he's doing work on his second PC. So one day I get an IM from him and he's tells me he doesn't know if he should be pissed or rolling on the floor laughing.

Seems he got banned from a SIM because he was .. get this.... camping too long on their camping chairs.

Yes that's right... they banned him for using a camping chair for too long. Seems it was a Casino and they had some rules about "2 hour limit on Camping, and you must play the casino games". He said there were at least 4 other people around who had been camping longer then he had and never played the slots either.... his best guess was that his attire got the attention of the sim owner, as he likes to run around in newbie clothes.
Jopsy Pendragon
Perpetual Outsider
Join date: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,906
05-24-2006 07:52
*chuckle* Script collisions.

You don't, perhaps, have some sort of animation overrider on you?

Your ill-informed host may have had Show Updates turned on and saw a lot of activity around you for some completely unrelated reason. :)
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Kokoro Fasching
Pixie Dust and Sugar
Join date: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 949
05-24-2006 09:17
From: Bitzer Balderdash
Can anyone tell me where I can buy a script-shield - I wanna armor my scripts against people firing particles at them! O.o

I'm sure that is what is causing them to not work all the time...



Particle rays affect satellite scripts and ground-based script systems at high altitudes -- see Terrestrial Particle Rays and Soft Errors, LL experiments in soft fails in computer electronics, LL Journal, Vol. 40, 1996. Engineers can find useful information about soft errors in electronics from Particle rays on the Particle Interactions with Matter website. The high energy particles affect winged scripts -- the LL-FAA has an online Particle ray flight profile calculation available. These effects are especially augmented during large Torley particle events. During these times, polar flights are generally diverted to lower latitude flight paths.
Laukosargas Svarog
Angel ?
Join date: 18 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,304
05-24-2006 09:43
From: Kokoro Fasching
Particle rays affect satellite scripts and ground-based script systems at high altitudes -- see Terrestrial Particle Rays and Soft Errors, LL experiments in soft fails in computer electronics, LL Journal, Vol. 40, 1996. Engineers can find useful information about soft errors in electronics from Particle rays on the Particle Interactions with Matter website. The high energy particles affect winged scripts -- the LL-FAA has an online Particle ray flight profile calculation available. These effects are especially augmented during large Torley particle events. During these times, polar flights are generally diverted to lower latitude flight paths.


lawd! seems you've studied the phenomena ! I only saw it on TV.
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Geometry is music frozen...
Androclese Antonelli
Org. B-Day: 05/11/04
Join date: 25 Apr 2006
Posts: 96
05-24-2006 09:46
From: Kokoro Fasching
Particle rays affect satellite scripts and ground-based script systems at high altitudes -- see Terrestrial Particle Rays and Soft Errors, LL experiments in soft fails in computer electronics, LL Journal, Vol. 40, 1996. Engineers can find useful information about soft errors in electronics from Particle rays on the Particle Interactions with Matter website. The high energy particles affect winged scripts -- the LL-FAA has an online Particle ray flight profile calculation available. These effects are especially augmented during large Torley particle events. During these times, polar flights are generally diverted to lower latitude flight paths.


Are you sure it's not just swamp gas or a weather baloon?
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Lillani Lowell
Registered User
Join date: 5 Apr 2006
Posts: 171
05-24-2006 09:51
I'm really surprised nobody ever made a "camp-chair" center, with 100s of camping chairs and nothing else in the one plot. The members of the camping group sit and camp, then instead of having the camping chairs paying out just a fraction of the dwell income, divide the entire property's dwell profits equally among the active camp chair group members (minus the fee for land use).

With such a mechanism, it would have attracted a lot of members, a lot of camping, and I'd say a whole lot of L$ for everyone involved.
Kokoro Fasching
Pixie Dust and Sugar
Join date: 23 Dec 2005
Posts: 949
05-24-2006 10:54
From: Androclese Antonelli
Are you sure it's not just swamp gas or a weather baloon?



You must be confusing the research with what http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Allen_Hynek J Allen Hynek was working on. His field was entirely outside the scripting field.

Thank you for your participation though.









:P
Eloise Pasteur
Curious Individual
Join date: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,952
05-24-2006 11:40
Whilst I'm far from a devotee of camping chairs, there does seem to be a move to time limited chairs - There was one on SLEx proudly boasting "Defeats all anti-idle scripts" (you'd have thought adding a timer count and llUnsit() wasn't the hardest of amendments wouldn't you??).
Draco18s Majestic
Registered User
Join date: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 2,744
05-24-2006 12:14
From: Lillani Lowell
I'm really surprised nobody ever made a "camp-chair" center, with 100s of camping chairs and nothing else in the one plot. The members of the camping group sit and camp, then instead of having the camping chairs paying out just a fraction of the dwell income, divide the entire property's dwell profits equally among the active camp chair group members (minus the fee for land use).

With such a mechanism, it would have attracted a lot of members, a lot of camping, and I'd say a whole lot of L$ for everyone involved.


Perhaps.
*Ponders*
Might take this idea up with someone, test it out.

From: Eloise Pasteur
Whilst I'm far from a devotee of camping chairs, there does seem to be a move to time limited chairs - There was one on SLEx proudly boasting "Defeats all anti-idle scripts" (you'd have thought adding a timer count and llUnsit() wasn't the hardest of amendments wouldn't you??).


You'd think.
CODE

...
timer()
{
    ++earned;
    if(eared >= MAX_PAYOUT)
    {
        llUnSit(llAvatarOnSitTarget());
    }
}
...
Jopsy Pendragon
Perpetual Outsider
Join date: 15 Jan 2004
Posts: 1,906
05-24-2006 13:35
From: Draco18s Majestic
Perhaps.
*Ponders*
Might take this idea up with someone, test it out.



Baha... I think I'd prefer...
CODE

    ...
    timer() {
 	  // ++earned;
 	// if(eared >=  0) {
 		  llWhisper("Your payout is very important to us, please stand by.");
 		  state hang_on;
 	      // }
    }
   
   state hang_on {
   	state_entry() {
   		  llSetTimerEvent(5*60);
   	}
   	
   	timer() {
    		  llWhisper("Attempting to process next payment... one moment please.");
   	}
   }
    ...
Eloise Pasteur
Curious Individual
Join date: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,952
05-24-2006 15:33
Draco's script fulfills the function as described. I prefer Jopsy's.

Reminds me of "Please go to stores for a long weight (or wait)", "Go get a left-handed screwdriver" etc....
DolphPun Somme
The Pun is its own reword
Join date: 18 Nov 2005
Posts: 309
Rofl
05-26-2006 00:30
Particles are probably the most misunderstood part of SL. Running RainbowTower (a huge particle display) I get so many misconceptions about particles.

My favorite one is those that claim they teleport.

Experimentation has shown me that they stay in your personal "matrix" which changes as you fly from one sim to the other. If you fly really fast, the particles appear in the next sim, and the next... They are just rezzed in your "matrix" until they spend their energy (about 30 seconds)

BTW, does anyone know what is the proper term for what I am calling your "matrix"? (the world is really only 256 square M and you just fly out one side and back in the other and they shuffle the scenery. :P )
Sator Canetti
Frustrated Catgirl
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 130
05-26-2006 10:04
maybe "sphere of influence"

It's possible that maybe the client is shifting borders too quick to process the change in the status of the particle emitter *it's not there anymore*

Another possibility is the fact that particles can be fired across sim borders. With enough speed, and a long enough life, they could theoretically cross the mainland.
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Eloise Pasteur
Curious Individual
Join date: 14 Jul 2004
Posts: 1,952
05-26-2006 10:35
I think it might be a bug, it's worth reporting.

That said I'm not entirely surprised. Particles are client side. Your client gets told what to draw and how, and for how long, until it's updated or it knows it's gone away. If you move away by flying in a way that doesn't make the client realise it shouldn't still be drawing the particles it will continue until they've had their normal life (max 30s) before it stops drawing them.
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