scripting class

Don't know if this is the right thread, but i've noticed there is a lack of scripting classes. I am looking to learn scripting, and have no programing background
=( so i would need to leardn the basic of the basic in scripting.

Anyone willing to help? teach a classes and tell me?

IM me in world

Sydney -

I have high hopes for starting a Building & Scripting class within the next week or two. I've only been in-game for 3 weeks; but I've got a lot of experience in the past with level-editing & modelling for FPS-type games - and running tutorial websites teaching others how to do so (one was even printed in the Half-Life manual).

I'd offer to start right today; but to be honest, I haven't event begun to use LSL yet. I need to get up to speed first, so I can give out meaningful help/advice.

When I do, though, it will be oriented towards people who have never programmed before. I love a good challenge!

Take care,

I'd be interested in a class like this, too!
I have moderate experience in other scripting languages, but SL is a new breed.

Thanks!

Me too, some ingame live script classes would be great, i would pay for them. So if anyone interested, please contact me.

thank u.

..Of course linden paid free classes would be better hehe

I would love to be included in the classes you hope to offer. I keep trying, but never get too far in the ones I have tried in the past.

Alternately, I'm always willing to help someone solve a scripting problem, so long as I'm logged in world at the time and it doesn't involve something that I deem harmful. So, if you see me online, feel free to ask away.

... just don't spam my inbox if I'm not logged in.

I have been toying with the idea of holding some building and scripting classes. I've been around SL for well over a year now and have a great deal of experience in both. I present my land in Celadonia as my resume. (All the snow-covered part, about half of the sim.) My first major was in (Early Childhood) Education, later changed to Computer Science. All that is far in the past of course, but I thought I'd mention I've had a smidgen of formal training in teaching. I'm also a professional programer with a large computer games company. I gave a quick freebie Intro To Building in a one-on-one the other day and was told I was a good teacher... But I think that was more that she was an excellent student.

Now, I've been thinking about trying out the Event Ticket system that Linden Labs installed ages ago (that no one really uses) to do this. Yes, I could hold the classes for free and take subsidy money from LL for holding an "educational" class... But I believe it is the intent of LL to (eventually) do away with that system and see us operate more like the real world where knowledge and effort spent is paid for, as well as goods and services.

So, I'll give it a try. This weekend, I'll hold a pay-to-attend event in my private sandbox in Celadon (inside the loopy green fence) to teach a combo course on building and scripting, mostly scripting.

This will be as much an experiment in self-supporting events as it will be a class, though the teaching will not be compromised at all. If the fee to attend turns some players away, that's all the more personal attention for those that come.

Pricing is a bit harder to decide on. Too low and the class will likely be swamped with people. Too high and no one will attend. The knowledge gained by the students will allow them to create goods that will earn them their own money in time, so it can be considered an investment. But, hmmm...

A RL guest lecturer's fee might be from US$50 - US$100 an hour, or more. That would equate to a rediculous amout of L$s however. US$5 an hour for a 2-hour class would be more reasonable. Hmmm... *calculates* Still too much. Okay...

Let's call it L$500 per student (that's US$2 or so) and it will cover additional help over the next week or two to boot. Sound reasonable? I will, of course, refund if anyone isn't satisfied with me as a teacher.

If you want or need a complete one-on-one class, contact me and we'll work out a cost.


Having said all that, I DO want to point out that there ARE quite a number of libraries and university-like locations in Second Life that will teach all this for free, either in classes listed in the events, or with self-walking tours and examples. There are also numerous people (myself included) that will be glad to help with any particular problem you have. Many of us old-timers are self-taught, so that's a valid route. I'm just ofering a structured class, and doing so in a way that won't add newly printed money to the SL economy. (The sort of thing that caused all the recent changes.)

Please let me know here if you or people you know in-world are interested so I can plan for the correct number of attendees.

I guess no one is interested.

Tiger - sorry to hear it. I got some responses to my reply; I think people stopped checking the thread after that.

I'm working on a game-project at the moment - its useful for getting up to speed on a lot of bits of LSL. That should be done in a couple of days; after which I'll start looking at hosting classes for real.

Anyone interested in learning from Tiger or Myself?

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)

Hey Tiger

Too bad about the turnout to your event.

I think you are on the right track re: using the ticket pay system, and your rational behind it.

Ths only thing I would point out as a fairly new arrival is that 500 $L is quite a lot for somone new to this world. ie: My weekly stipend is not only 325 L$. (Maybe my own fault - i didn't rate ho the last night of 1$ ratings - but anyhoo). If you are only targetting premium users, well, then I suppose that is a different story.

Maybe you should do a cheaper event with a more nominal fee, with the idea that people will come back for more intermediate and advanced stuff as they progress/learn?

Just a thought.

Max Case
The Doctor is IN

I am planning to hold some regular (maybe once/twice a week as my schedule allows) scripting and perhaps building classes of the Linden Instructor Group- Scripting 101 kind. So of course they will be free and open to all (who want to learn). Look out on the events calendar on the weekends as this seems the best time for me to hold them (at least at first).

If anyone wants a more adcanced or even jsut a 1-on-1 lesson (any programmers not yet had a look at LSL for eg) just drop me an IM.

people contact me one in a while, looking to take lessons. But none of them seems intrested after a mention charging them money for my time.

I would be very interested in classes....although 500L is quite a bit for most i think. I don't mind paying for classes at all though. I'm not totally new, but have just really started the land ownership/premium acct thing, and want to learn more about the world i "live" in. I have so many ideas going through my head, and its frustrating to me, not knowing the first thing about how to express them!
I'll look for posts of classes coming up...all the ones I've found in the past are too early in the day for me, and i cannot attend ( as rl work has me chained until 4pm sl time)

Thanks for offering help and classes to others , it's what helps improve our world!

~Alexxa Rutledge

I answer questions and help with peoples' scripts (even write little ones for friends) all the time. I planed to charge more than a token fee because I want to really do in-depth classes. Something people can consider an investment. One thing I planed to do is suggest every student picks a simple project as their first goal, and I'll help them reach that goal and learn to wright good LSL code in the process.

Also, there are a lot of people in here that are very good at LSL and are willing to teach the basics for free (or for LL support payments at least) and I don't want to take their business away from them. I don't mind teaching the basics too, but that L$500 will take you much farther with me that L$0 would in a free class. At least I'd like to think so, and will refund your money if it doesn't.

It's almost as much a detterent for the unmotavated as it is payment for my time, too.

And I hadn't scheduled an event yet, and probably wont. As much as I'd like to see the access ticket system start to be used, lessons aren't really the right forum to try it out on. At least, not lessons like I plan to run them. I suggest people that are interested just look me up in-world and we'll work out times.

I wonder if it would sell better if people didn't ask for money in lindons, but instead straight out asked to be payed in us dollars through paypal.

monolog:
guy: hay can you teach me how to script?
teacher: sure, but it'll cost 50 cents an hour.
guy: oh , never mind, that seems kind fo expensive.
lol

I am currently holding weekly scripting classes at 2pm on saturdays. I am pretty much open to any topic to cover so if someone has something specific drop me an IM and I'll see about cooking up a class.. Classes will tend to be a bit more mid level, with the assumption you've already learned the basics of LSL (variables, conditionals, states). If you would like a class on a more basic subject let me know. There is a slim chance one will not occur this weekend if work sends me out of town, but generally I will be holding these weekly.

One thing you need to know, if you are < 30 days in account age you WILL NOT receive any sponsorship for your class from linden. I am currently < 30 days and have been informed that I'm basically doing my classes for free till my born on date gets past the 30 day mark. No biggie for me but if you're in this for the loot please keep it in mind.

I would pay for advanced lsl classes, I would pay 500 l for it in fact, quite happily!

I have been to three scripting classes all of which were ... to me... very basic. It's great that those types of classes are being held because a lot of people need those!

My problem is this, I have having trouble making the paradigm shift to event / state driven programming because I do not do windows programming at all. I have quite a bit of real world programming experience though.

1. How I have overcome this with LSL is to use global variable which is very poor design on my part, my trouble is conceptualizing the problem and breaking it down into "states." I tend to make my design more algorithmic in nature.

2. I would like a more thorough understanding of the particle system. I can generally get close to what I am looking for by toying with the variables, but with some of the variables I really don't understand exactly what I am playing with.

Advanced LSL lessons.... 500L too much? No way.

Tell me when, and where, and I am there.

Jessica -

Don't feel bad. I'm a very experienced ASP & PHP programmer; and an amateur DirectX / C++ / C# programmer... I've just started with LSL and its not the easiest language to deal with!

It does have some of the concepts of an object-oriented language - but it is really still a procedural language.

Variables cannot be defined inside of states - they must be globally-defined, or specific to a function. That means that any information you want to keep and track throughout an entire state, must be global.

Multiple states are useful for re-defining a behavior to suit different situations. For example, when you want a "touch" to do very different things at different times. Or if your object needs to change the entire way it functions (i.e. have different "modes" of operation). But for general tasks that remain the same through multiple executions, states are not the way to go.

The paradigm I've gone to, is to split my scripts up into sensible pieces; and use llMessageLinked() to communicate between them. If I have 1 function that needs to "call out" (via llSay or llMessageLinked) for some external data in the middle of running, I split the 1 function into 2 functions. I design my communications so that the response comes back with a message that tells my script where to "pick back up" (i.e. it executes the 2nd function). The key is to set up a consistent way of passing data and information - usually by parsing strings with the Say, Whisper, and MessageLinked function calls & events. If you put together a string like "do_function_a|99" - you can split that up with llParseString2List(), use an "if" statement to execute some function based on the first part of the string, and pass "99" as a parameter to the function. There are examples of how to do this on the LSL Wiki .

FYI, the Wiki also has pretty good info on the Particle System commands. Its a complex system - but like all programming, becomes easier if you take it one tiny piece at a time; and don't worry about the "whole", only worry about each piece as you get to it.

I'll be starting with very basic classes, but will work up to the advanced subjects! I've only been in-game for a little under 3 weeks, so I want to make sure I've got things down pat before I start giving too much advice.

Take care,

--Noel "HB" Wade
(Tread Whiplash)

Regarding Jessica and Tread's posts if anyone who knows programming, but just not LSL wants a private class I'm more than happy to give you one for free. I've done a few before and it usually doesn't take long at all. Just send me an IM, and we can pick a time.

I'm not an experienced programmer RL (LSL was my first) but I have been in SL for a year and have been scripting that long, so if nothing else I have a pretty good grasp of LSL.


The main problem I've seen experienced programmers have with LSL is that the flow of LSL scripts can be rather illogical at times (or at least it seems that way at first) and also since it's mainly event driven.

I find using States can immensely help the flow of a script, but in alot of cases you can accomplish the same results with 1 state and global variables. However making a script more readable never hurt anyone .

Readability is ALWAYS important. Most programmers never use the "//" comment line - and that's a dirty rotten shame. IMHO, the ONLY way to keep track of what you are doing at any moment in the code, is to comment it! Do so in a fairly complete sentence, and have at least one thorough comment describing each function/state as a bare, bare minimum. I also put a comment on just about every line of code that entails multiple function-calls or complex math; so I can glance at the code and know what its goal is.

Without frequent commenting, someone else who has to work with your code will be lost. OR, When you take a break for a week or two (or a month or two), and come back to your project - that lost person will be you!

There are similar arguments for using full words (not abbreviations) when coming up with variable-names and function-names.

...OK, back to the topic at hand:

Rysidian -

True, states have their uses; but if you're scripting something simple and just need to change one or two lines of code because the item was touched, or an Avatar walked within range (or something simple) - then it is far more effiicient to do that all in one state. Why? First off, there's less code to write, if you only have 1 state. Second, its far less prone to Listen and Timer bugs, when you only have 1 state. Third, and most important - every call to a function or a state adds to the load on the script & takes time. For simple variables like an integer, its far faster (computationally-speaking) to retrieve that one global variable and perform an "if" test on it; rather than to call a function and deal with its return value. Its even more "expensive" (in terms of time) to call a state change - because the script has to process the "state_exit()" call from your current state; and the "state_entry()" call on the new state. Now, we're probably talking on the order of a few hundredths of a second difference; but that can add up over many scripts or many calls to the same script. Since LSL is an interpretted language, performance and scalability are important to keep in mind.

I just want to demonstrate that there are plusses and minuses to every approach. Obviously using only global variables with 1 state on a very complex script is a BadThing(tm) because of how tangled and un-readable it could get; but by the same token, there are times when its more efficient and simpler to use global variables and 1 state.

I am willing to help out to reduce the costs in these classes. I only wished there was something like this availble to me when I started. By no means I'm a programmer in RL it took a lot of hacking pasting to learn LSL. Starting to get the hang of it Please IM me if you have some set plans and maybe we can work something out.

Hi Tiger,
what you say sounds interesting... I'm talking about your own LSL classes.. keep me posted on that!

Also... where are these libraries and university-like locations in Second Life that will teach all this for free, either in classes listed in the events, or with self-walking tours and examples?

So far the only type of library I found was the Ivory tower with basic lessons on prim building. I would like to have a look at those library as the more reference/example material is at hand the better it will be

i wasd also thinkign to do some lsl classes in Beverly Hills, just not really sure of the level

Where? I have tried using the find feature and never found them.
What I have done so far is found every free script I can find and trace through them to see what they are doing and have learned a lot that way. By Adding comments (standard debugging techniques) into the code and executing it and stepping through the source of the code to identify where it is executing and why I have learned a lot.

Could you throw me a landmark or two?

Thanks so much,
Jess

Hmmm... I'd have to go searching myself for the various libraries and such. I don't use their services myself, obviously.

On comments, I tell people to use just as many comments as THEY need, no more no less. (Unless they are writting specificly for someone else to work with the code.) For my classes, as my best teachers in the past have done, I'll provide sample scripts that have no comments at all. This is a good thing when you are learning a computer language... You need to learn to actually read the code, and not the comments. I won't throw multi-page scripts at someone just starting to learn LSL, no more than a spoken language teacher w(sh)ould hand you an entire novel to read on day one.

For "vocabulary", the wiki is your dictionary and never be afraid/ashamed to consult it. There are tons of functions I hardly ever use, and will jump right to looking them up when I need to. I've written a lot of scripts durring my stay in Second Life, and I'll be applying that to my classes, and that will make a difference. I know which functions and structures I have used the most, and those are the same ones you'll be needing most as well. I'll start my focus there and expand in whatever directions my students wish to go. I also know the major pitfalls of LSL and what little can be done to work around them. (Can everyone say "non-volitile storage"?)

But, as I said, I'm not going to prep for random people and register an event. I'd rather customize the classes to the student(s). So if interested, IM me in game (off-line IMs are fine, I get them in email) and we'll figure out the best course for you. I'll combine students when they seem to have the same starting place and goals.