best animation program?

what is the most complete animation program that is sl-compatible? what i have in mind are complex animations i would like to design for second life, like sports or combat movements. how difficult/feasible is it to create true-to-life athletic motions for second life, say for instance, a tennis serve or a kung-fu flying kick that look as good as pete sampras or jet li?
many thanks for your help.
bp

That depends on your definition of "complete". The most commonly used program for SL animations is Poser (or its free alternative, DAZ Studio). It's "complete" in the sense that it's a specialty application strictly for character animation, and it will produce the type of BVH files that SL requires right out of the box. It's however extremely "incomplete" in the sense that it can't do anything else, and its toolset and workflow are very dumbed down by professional standards.

In contrast, Maya, the program I use every day, is incredibly complete in that it's more acurately described as a full blown platform than a just a program. It can do just about anything. Did you see Lord of the Rings? All those creatures were done in Maya. So if that's what you mean by "complete", and you have US$6000 to spend, Maya is widely considered to be the most full-featured 3D application on the market. Be prepared to spend considerable time learning to use it. Orion Neville was kind enough to make a free SL rig for it, which will save you from having to make your own.

There are also many resident created avatar animation programs, which you can find on this forum. Depending on what you mean by complete, any of them might suit your needs.


Now you've stepped away from the question of tool choice, and into the realm of the skill of the user. For an animation to "look as good as sampras or jet li" requires the talents of a good animator. Whatever program is being used is almost completely irrelevant by comparison. If you're such an animator, you'll be able to pull it off. If not, you won't.

Just so you know, animations like the kind you're talking about are most often motion-captured. If you want to duplicate Jet Li's movements, the best way to do it is to put Jet in a mocap suit, and record his kung fu precisely. Then feed that data to a well-rigged model, and the model will move like Jet.

It can be done by hand, of course, but generally speaking, it takes a team of top-notch professional animators to get professional results. If you intend to hand-make animations on your own that are pro quality, be prepared to spend SERIOUS time at it. To give you an idea, pro animators working at places like Pixar are generally expected to produce about 10 seconds worth of quality animation in an 8-hour work day.

I don't mean to sound discouraging. Obviously, SL animators work relatively quickly, but you did imply you were interested in professional results. No doubt you've noticed that most SL animations don't look all that great. Now you know why.

If you think you can do it, go for it, but just be prepared for the fact that quality animation takes loads of time to produce, and there's simply no way around that. If you've got access to a motion capture suit and some good physical actors to wear it, you can save a lot of time, but working by hand well never ever be quick if you want the results to look real.

Poser, DAZ, and Avimator are the best that I've worked with. (I'm not even going to touch Maya... I'm willing to bet that 90% of the people in SL that are active can't afford to drop 6k on a program just for SL animations. Nor do that many just happen to know someone or have it lying around... If you've got it great! Use the rig.) Many programs are compatible with bvh files, but to ask which the best is... that really depends on what you like to work with. There are several programs (In "the list" which is posted here.) that you can try out.

From a starting point: As for professional animations, you can do it. But you have to have time and patience. Also be willing to put up with a lot of trial & error. For the most part the animations look good in the editor/program but might look a little off inworld. Also learn your priorities.

If you're new to making animations and don't happen to have a major studio in your home with the motion capture suits... (Or even with a studio and suit but happen to have all types of furniture in the way... ) And example would be knowing how the mechanics of the body work while doing those actions helps. Anyone can make a jump flying side kick; but those who tend to know how the body is supposed to move are more likely to make a better/more accurate/more realistic looking kick.

Again: Time, patience, and practice are the keys.

Thanks folks for your detailed and sound replies - they're quite encouraging (it is doable!) and gave me a perfect overview of the issues. Avimotion would seem like a logical place to start. The main problem as both of you say is time, which I don't have much of at the moment. But I definitely will have a go at trying to create good animations. Should be fun!

Ok i will point some things out about limitations of SL animations here. First off you wont be able to get them to look as good as Jet Li or this other fellow because of the limitations on the body of the sl model. For starters the hand is one piece you cant move the fingers , nor the toes individually. You can get the animations close but they are never going to be super realistic because the SL model doesnt have alot of joints/bone structures that a normal human would. You can get them close but the constraints just prevent some things like i stated. With daz make sure you move on the animation window so that it doesnt use frame 0 you have to set it to use 1- whatever because otherwise it wont work!! Poser works good but is a little bit of a load and costs a bit for something just for SL as well its over a hundred dollars. Daz can do most of what poser can anyways and can use poser models so *shrugs*.

Avimator is specifcially designed for Sl its not bad its a bit rough but its likely easier to get used to. I'd use one of the user made programs out there where its not near as confusing due to extra feature build ups meant for more complex models .

I only have experience with Avimator so far, and however nice, it seriously lacks some features. The main drawback being the inability to incorporate bezier curves (animating will take ten times as long or you will have to settle for clunky movements). I assume Poser has it, i know Maya does.

The problem i see with avimator is its a bit rough. If you bend the waist you dont see it bend there is rather just a gap there so you kind of cant tell. Daz works the same as poser and is a bit friendlier on your system both size and resource wise. Daz's models are actually also a bit nicer and there is alot more content for daz that one could purchase. Daz is also a bit more confusing to see the keyframe/frame window right away you gotta look around a little to find it and im still not 100% sure how to get the SL model to work with it.....

My experience:

The best is poser (you can call their tech support).
The cheapest and best is DAZ (free, but has bugs, so will cost you time).
The simplest and best is Avimator (free, does a good job, but is limited in some features).

As ever, you get what you pay for in either, or both of, your money or your time.

My 2c.

/es

I just want to say thanks to everybody here. I'm new to SL.

Alot of people dont have the money to go out and buy poser sadly... Daz is a good alternative if you still want alot of the same functionality. The bugs come from the fact that it only recently has been able to read out to BVH files and that is likely the problem. Poser is a 200+ dollar program (not sure cuz of the summer special thing)..... vs daz. Daz's models are actually a bit better to a degree as well.... Well the purchased ones anyways hehe...Avimator is ok.... its a bit simplistic and has its limits. (note my reference to the stomache/waist issue.....)