Misleaded Land Purchase

Hi,

I joinend secondlife the 1st week of january, and saw endless possibilities.
So i explored the land finding a nice place to start my new adventure, after visiting many many pieces of land i found a nice piece near a sim-edge.
I was looking for a oceanside sim, with roads, when i found it, although i found the price of approx. 24000 lindens high for 1024ft piece, i payed it because of its location.

the neighbouring sim, had a water-landscape, and made a nice boardwalk accross the ocean border, the region-owner, had complemented it with a nice lighthouse.

Last week he removed his lighthouse and sold the almost last piece of the region, i re-decorated my land, and spend many! hours buiding a advanced lighthouse running the linden-day-time script, i was still working on it.

Yesterday i found the ocean had gone !!?!?!?!?, and was filled with new land "Ranchero", which has been put up for action today, i used the [Linden Land] support option, but did not get any response yet.

I was wondering how many other SL'rs , have been tricked into buying a piece of land this way, to loose there ambiance within a few weeks !??!

why would i pay 90 US$!!!! , for a piece of virtualland that has no real advantage to regular pieces !!?!??!

Can landowners just mislead potential customers without penalty ?!?!
**it's bad enough, they can make use of the 1st-land bot strategy, something i just learned of**

Caveat emptor

To be honest the previous owner may not have known the waterfront was going to vanish. Although, if you'd asked me or Rockwell or just about any well known land trader they could have told you it was highly likely.

It's a shame but even sims that have stood for months as ocean front or protected have suddenly found themselves in the middle of a grass plain or worse.

*edit: For f's sake, bots have never been used to buy first land, any idiot can do that manually.

I've seen a lot of land advertised as waterfront in the listings when it really just backs up to an empty sim or the edge of the 'world', or the water is man-made by another owner who can eliminate it at any time. It's not very nice for sellers to take advantage of new buyers this way, but people do it, and 'technically' it is waterfront at the time of the sale. Remember to do your research before buying any piece of land. ALWAYS check to make sure (if you're buying on mainland) that the water adjoining your land is owned by Governor Linden and set to "Maintenance". And if you're on the edge of the world - expect that there WILL be a new land sim next to you shortly.

Looking at the location, it was never "protected" and you were misled by a dishonest seller. The only bits that really "protected" are sims that have a natural shoreline (won't stop another sim from popping up next to it, but you'll always have your shoreline and some water at least) or next to a Linden road.

When buying land, remember that the seller is looking for a quick buck, they generally have their own interests at heart, not yours. If you're unsure about what you're getting promised, run it by a trusted friend to make sure you're not being lied to.

I've seen water parcels with claims of "protected waterway" which is in fact just a strip of water that the vendor themselves owns and has left as buffer space, and could be sold to MLGHK at any time.

Never buy "ocean front" on a straight edge of a sim.

There is only one way to buy "waterfront property" and be absolutely CERTAIN that it will remain waterfront. That is to purchase your own sim and 4 to 8 OpenSpaces sims, and ensure that your desired coastline is buffered by at least one ring of Openspaces water. Then you are certain to have at least 256 Meters of open water between your coastline and the nearest land mass, for as long as you pay the maintenance fees on your sims.

The next best bet is to purchase land from a reputable private sim owner who is using the above tactic to ensure they retain coastline. There, of course, you're still subject to the possibility that the sim owner could change their mind and do something else with the sims, or could sell them to someone else who might change it.

With anything else, mainland or private sim, it could literally change at any minute. A new sim or one that is being moved could be assigned to the space right next to the open "edge" of the sim that you found so attractive, even if you have a nice sculpted coastline and not just a raw sim edge fronting on void. The Lindens themselves have added sims to the edges of continents, making what was once coastline into inland property.

I've lost waterfront access several times, because of sim changes. It is an unfortunate aspect of a world where people can create and terraform and move land masses at will.

This caveat doesn't just apply to coastline property. Any parcel in any sim that you don't fully control could have the parcels bounding on it change at any instant. And whatever lies just beyond what you control could change at any instant. What was once a lovely wooded hillside might be a casino tomorrow, or a Gorean slave pen, or a brothel, or a playground filled with noisy children...

You say that like it's a bad thing...

Not at all. If you look at the list, they were a variety of things that might be appealing to some people, but apalling to others. It could equally well become a flock of flaming flamingos scripted to shout bad poetry, which surely would only be placed there to annoy the neighbors...

The point is, if you don't own everything you can see, you don't control it, and it is subject to change, without notice, and without regard for your aesthetics, values, or property value. And no one at Linden Lab will do anything about that, so long as the offensive stuff is on someone else's land. Anarchy rules.

I was just being facetious

But if someone does want some waterfront that will remain waterfront - TP over to my island, Kush. The residents are very happy there.

I think if you just want the appearance of waterfront (but not the ability to actually enter the water), then just having an island on its own is enough, since it's not possible to place an island directly next to someone else's - and even if it is technically possible to locate it there, it wouldn't be rendered. (As far as I understand anyway..)

Actually, no.

I used to have land on Wailele Isle - a privately owned sim. It had water on three sides (void sims), and another island owned by the same owner on the other side.

Both sims were sold, and the new owner moved them, placing them apart from one another, and both 'islands' now have other 'lslands' within 10 M of their coastlines, on all sides.

Now, it is my understanding that usually, the Lindens won't place one private sim immediatly adjacent to a sim owned by someone else, unless the existing sim owner agrees. But there is no certanty on that, and one can reserve space right next to someone else's sim.

A sim owner can choose not to allow their own sim to rez for people outside that sim. It is not the default behavior. But I don't believe you have the option to not see the sims that are next to yours, if the owner of those sims allow them to be visible.

i think i was easy targetted prey (noobstyle), but also i feel there should be some more warnings included in the land-purchase section of the Linden Secondlife Main-site.


i could create some sort of land-owner rating system, perhaps that will help filter out, the "reckless" ones ?
Caveat Venditor?

Yes but a bot can search for first land every second of every day of every week until it finds some then buy it within seconds. Aside from scruples, why would a wannabe-land-baron NOT do this?

Because you would have to setup new alt accounts with funding sources for every piece of first land you are trying to get with your magical land bot. And Elan's too lazy for that.

I bought land in Dreamland on an island and there was a cove with water between my 4096 sqm parcel of land and another resident who owns most of the island. When I put the property up for sale the beginning of this month, Dreamland raised the land out of the water filling in the cove and placing a new parcel of land on the island between me and my neighbor. Not only that but they then priced it way below what i was asking for my parcel for a larger piece. I still sold my piece, but the man who has owned most of that island for more than a year now has a patch of land over 5 K sq m between one of his buildings and another where there used to be water.

I have learned in Sl t expect constant and continual change. It is not just that the buildings beside you can change overnight but so can the terrain.

Ok, the Vendor sold the Last of his land last week, WAS it the land that was once ocean, or did that land belong to a third Party?
In any event, the vendor had no way of Knowing the fate of the lands he sold AFTER he sold them, that was the decision of the New owner.

Be Fair, and Be Reasonable before you begin calling "Cheat!".

As for Land Buying, In RL, when one buys a home, one does Not simply look at the plot of land they are buying, they ALSO check out the neighborhood. Doing the equivalent in SL, to me at least, seems only simple sense (I don't say "Common sense" because it seems illogical to me to dub the rarest commodity in the univers as "Common" A house, or Plot of Land can look wonderful, but it can lose it's charm rapidly when you discover it's at the foot of an airport Runway or Next to a Hog Rendering Plant, or the lake you love so much is about to become a Land Fill. Research a Little before Putting your money on the Table.

"Act in haste, Repent in lesiure"

Angel.

I hate to say it but i doubt the land owner who sold that land would have known either. Everyone runs this risk of not having water near them etc as linden labs puts up more and more sims. They have been moving sims around the grid since christmas time actualy in preparation for something. My sim was moved and offline for about 2 days as a huge group of islands and sims got shuffled around the map.

That is something no one can control and one reason not to pay a huge price for you land.

Wise words..............for real life. But when one buys land in real life that person has some protection from fraud since there are enforcible real estate laws that must be obeyed by both the seller and buyer. There's none of that in SL............it's every man for himself and the least honest will win every time. How do you "research" the land before you buy? Ask friends? Check the seller's profile? Request help from a Linden? Go to the Knowledge Base? Check the license of the "realitor"? Someone mentioned it's anarchy.......and that discribes it perfectly. You get cheated or robbed and it's just part of the "game". I'm not sure many honest people in SL want that. Maybe the less honest like it because they have a huge supply of members who just want to play nicely and have fun.

And there is no recourse...........just tough luck.

If you are upset with the purchase you made, put your land up for sale. Look for a nice new place to relocate to which is next to linden "protected" land. Then you'll have a much better chance of that river/lake/ocean not disappearing. And otherwise, just eat your costs.. $100 USD is not the end of the world for you... if it is, you really shouldn't be playing, let alone owning a computer with specs to handle SL. Consider it a lesson learned and move on.

Actually, Rockwell, the south shoreline of Kush now has a sim (Times Square) against it. Fortunately, at this time, it is landscaped with a small water cove and sandy terrain, so it is not an eyesore. Hopefully that will not change. But, the southern edge of Kush is no longer waterfront. The current landowner (not you) of some Kush plots there has the land for sale as unblockable waterfront. Obviously that is no longer the case. And unfortunately adjacent to Times Square are two more sims (South Beach - a casino/strip club, and Coconut Grove - currently undeveloped). Those three sims were not there a few weeks ago when I bought property in Kush. It has been a lesson for me in how quickly things can change in SL! That said, Kush is a nice community, and I do enjoy living there. But it just goes to show that even when an estate owner thinks he has waterfront property, it does not necessarily stay that way.

Princess Ivory

When a new sim is created at the edge of nowere, that edge will appear to be water; however, as further sims are created, that water gets filled in.

To be sure your water will remain, you could make sure you have an actual coastline within the sim. Then, even if the next sim over becomes land, you'll at least have a river next to you. The problem here is that someone could own the water "land" in the river and build something unsightly, or build in front of you blocking your view.

To be sure of having "unblockable" view of water, then, buy land that is adjacent to Linden-owned "protected" water (usually a strip that runs down the channel) or buy the water "land" yourself. Linden-owned land is not necessarily intended to be Linden-owned protected land; it could simply be land that is set for sale, or a sim that is not yet bought.

you dont mean 2400l right? 24,000 OMG thats crasy!!!!!!!

argeed, I am planning to get sims mayself with fair prices of renting, making me little profit but it will make my rentors happy over time slowly decease the price hehe

This being the Case, then one should check even more closely, shouldn't one? Tell me, What is Wrong with Asking Friends for example? It strikes me Networking with people you Know would be the first best step to locating a reliable Land Deal, but you present it as a Ludicrous option. If you Don't use your head The other option is simply "Don't Buy Land", But because people WANT land, and they don't want to take thier chances waiting for Linden sales, Using a little more sense that the usual seems the wise course here. If no one is going to Babysit for you, You have to do it Yourself.

Angel.

Angel.