SL "Superheroes"

I, "though a 'registered yet free account right now'", have made my Sim into a "Superhero" of sorts, with plans to just help folks in general, I am concentrating on learning more about combatting griefers, by using means WITHIN the terms of Service.

Of course, as many have pointed out, all- out Griefers have little to lose, given that they are usually all unregistered alt accounts, except for maybe the leader of a Group that centers around griefing, that member usually uses Alts to do his/her griefing, and thier Paid account as a "Figure-Head"/placeholder.

In my short time on SL, I have already heard tale of a fascist militia springing up and trying to drive the hotel next to thier headquarters out of business...tales about "extremist" right-wing racist griefers, and other, more offensive scenarios.

Given that I still have a lot to learn...what are some tips that you more experienced residents (particularly shop-owners) could give to aspiring "second-life crimefighters"?

LL is obviously under-staffed as far as personnel to respond to reports. Once I am "in full swing", I plan to start a Group/Team of heros compased of more "full-time" 'Crime-Fighters' and volunteer part-time supporters, such as business owners, and others interested in keeping PvP where it BELONGS. In Sandboxes and Combat Zones.

Any Insight would be appreciated.

The best advice I can give you is to file abuse reports when they're warranted and let the Lindens handle the rest. If you do much of anything else (use guns, push and cage people, harass) then you're just as likely to end up being AR'd and banned as the griefers. You might want to think about getting a bunch of likeminded people and set up a kind of cops and robbers roleplay where all the participants are willing. SL isn't really set up to allow for vigilante justice and that's more or less a good thing.

AR, Banlist, Ignore button.

Those are really the only "superpowers" you can posses.

Good luck.

In short... AR then ignore them.


Outside of a combat sim or combat parcel, anything you or your group does against the griefers, is also a TOS violation. Yes, griefers have rights too.

Giving you the benefit of the doubt for the moment. Many griefers act obnoxious and annoying just hoping that you will strike first, so they can AR.... YOU. You suffering a ban or warning, isn't worth it. And they won't just head off to a combat sim because you ask them nicely.

some alternative suggestions for you:
Just sit. They get bored and go away.

Recommend they go to Raush or Jessie. They can shoot to their heart's content (and be shot back at). That's a win-win. Comment openly that you sympathize with their cowardice when they refuse to go, that you are afraid of going there too (griefers are way too macho for their own good, kind of like pre-pubescent teens).

Call a Linden. I know one who dresses up as a cutesy childrens TV robot just so she can hunt griefers in that AV (I had to ask her why). Don't think that they ignore griefing in progress... they don't.

Whatever you do, don't stoop to the level of a griefer, to "fight" them. They're not worth it. My appologies if I misunderstood your request to "learn more about combatting griefers".

I'd cut this guy some slack. It's very obvious that he isn't on a power trip, he just wants to find a way to help without breaking the rules to do it. There have been a lot of posts lately about armed security groups and armies and things to take on griefers, and we know how those discussions go. But go back and read this guy's post. He's not suggesting any of those things, so let's not be hasty to judge.

Fortunately, there are lots of really great and effective ways to do that. Filing abuse reports, sharing information with others on known griefers and helping people learn how not to be victims are all good ways to help the SL community, and they have a far stronger effect than most people realize. You just have to give them a chance to work.

Also, if you're interested in this general approach, know that there are like-minded individuals already organized. Contact me in-game for more information. I'd love to speak with you.

That was definitely the impression that I got too.

Lest we forget, setting land to "no push" and "scripts disabled" and restricting parcel access to not allow unverified accounts

/me

Lew is now too distracted by Tamii's presence to get any more work done today...

Try getting in touch with the Green Lantern Core in world. They have a lot of members and are very good at working within the system to deal with griefing--much like you are proposing.

Just an opinion here....

If players of SL (otherwise known as paying customers) feel compelled to organize themselves to combat griefing, I submit that someone in customer service is not doing their job. Or at least not doing it very well.

Greifers can create an alt and get it in in 5 min, therefore LL is SWAMPED with ARs on throwaway greif accounts.
Ban, Ignore, Report are my suggestions.
As to the person who suggested banning unverifieds, not if you want to do buisness in SL.
SL BanLink looks like a good system as well.

The fact of the matter is that they're completely swamped. Even allowing for a staff large enough to put 100 Liaisons online at once (and we know there aren't any where near that many), that would still be only one rep per 120 citizens online at any given moment. The actual ratio is probably closer to one rep per thousand citizens.

The other factor is that they have other things they're responsible for besides being a police force - they go from sim to sim and help debug the sim software, maintain the roads and landscape, manage real estate parceling and sales, and dozens of other things that don't even occur to most people as even being required.

The Green Lantern Core and the Justice League Unlimited groups both follow the Terms of Service to the letter, and yet still manage to perform in the public service in an effective manner. There are also coalitions of landowners which share ban lists and record griefer incidents, one such being SLBANLINK.COM.

These aren't vigilante groups - they're concerned citizens banding together to try to make a difference within the rules and guidelines laid out for them by Linden Labs. There is certainly room in the virtual society for such groups. Torley Linden once stated in a town hall meeting that citizen groups like this were springing up because the need was there, and that they hoped we would be able to find some effective means of using peer pressure and cooperative sharing of information to help control the problem, and that's exactly what's happening.

Not to sound cliche... but "them's fighting words".

The best way to stop griefers is to recognize potential griefers BEFORE they start griefing and make them feel welcome... or at least respected.

Why? Because obviously your welcome or respect is the first thing that they will lose the moment they start griefing. They may not be clever enough to understand that at first, and act up anyway... point out, unconfrontationally that their shooting you (or whatever) is kind of distracting, could they hold off for a while until you're ready for that kind of rough play? You lose nothing by being polite, and by being more reasonable, they will lose face by being unreasonable.

No, of course it won't stop someone who is a confirmed griefer, but it will defuse many newbies who are bored, lost, confused, frustrated with feeling stupid and clumsey or just not engaged in SL enough to respect it's inhabitants.

The only way to dissuade a confirmed griefer is to not engage or acknowledge them. Period. Silently AR them and ignore them, don't talk about them outloud, say anything that could be about them, talk via IM's to the people around you instead of outloud and relocate for a while, if you have to.

Fighting? Moderating? Swooping in to save the day? Nothing makes an arch-villain more dedicated to malice than an ineffective goody-goody trying to stop them. Seriously.



I don't believe sandboxes are approved for combat...
I could be wrong... but ...

--
Griefers. In a nutshell:

Do what you can to prevent undecideds from joining their ranks.

When confronted with a determined griefer... bore them.

For the land owners, there is also the freeze option. Well, since we can't waterboard em' its the next best thing.

I admire Your Intent, But i've seen too many self styled Police forces spring up, and the question ALWAYS arises, who's policing the Police? Too many get in, the group grows so large the "Leaders" can no longer monitor or verify who is getting in, or what they are doing once they do, and in the end, they end up Booted and Banned from sims just as Fast as the griefers they once professed to Fight Simply because they begin thinking of themselves as the Sole arbitor of what SHOULD be allowed in SL.

In the end, i would be forced to ask you the same question i would ask Batman if such a Person existed, "Who the Hell asked you?". Linden Labs Has the Tools in place, (Boot, Ban, Mute, AR, Etc.) AND they have Liasons In Game to enforce TOS and answer the citizens Calls for help. IF you want to Police SL, do what they did, and EARN the position of being a Linden Liason, and Stop trying to short-Cut yourself. You are new, you may THINK you know better than the Lindens how to Police things, but I'm doubtful that you in fact do.

My words May seem a little harsh, but trust me, Vigilantism Never acheives anything but your Own Ban from the Game.

Angel.

Hey um...PvP doesn't belong in sandboxes, either. Sandboxes are for /building/, inntit? Ask Troy Vogel for tips on patrolling sandboxes.

Follow these steps:

1.Find Griefers
2.Socialize with them
3.teleport them to your sim/plot
4.enable damage
5.orbit them

Thanks, Kalel...I'll do that

Yes, as Kalel and Chip pointed out (also in my first sentence...) :

"I... have made my Sim into a "Superhero" of sorts, with plans to just help folks in general, I am concentrating on learning more about combatting griefers, by using means WITHIN the terms of Service.".

I own shields and Anti-Push devices right now...and I know that caging, and attacking ANY players including griefers outside of designated Combat Zones is illegal in the world of SL. (Unfortunate for the business owners...) I have never attacked another Sim, though I have been pushed by idiots twice (yes only twice!) in the 2 weeks or so that I have been exploring the world of SL. In cases where I was pushed, I found that words were enough to confuse/disinterest the person doing the pushing.



I love this guy! Another thing about starting a VIGILANTE group, or being even one solo... SL, though abstract by our RL standards, IS realistic enough that nobody could be "The Punisher" and get away with it without being a "30 Free Account per month Griefer" themselves. They would be banned every time they turned around, and by the time they got back online, the griefer would be back too...both grabbing weapons from the freebie warehouse. NOT effective.



Another paramount of constructive advice ^^...

Thanks!



Hmm...I can see where too many members could be a problem alright, thanks for pointing that out. As far as deciding what is allowed, and what isn't...my PERSONAL view is that LL has already done that much. THOSE are the rules! Shouldn't be any problems there



If planned to be an SL "VIGILANTE", I never would have posted asking the community for advice. ESPECIALLY after skimming through the huge arguments such as; horror-stories of landowners who ended up taking the "Law into thier own hands", just to protect thier Hotel customers, or what have you. So many guns are sold in SL...why don't you ask Carducci's: "Who asked you to make all these guns?".



Will do...thanks for clarifyin that Matt



LOL... I'm havin a drink in your honor

Thanks for all of your responses...I'm looking at my character this way: SL is his "real world"...if he breaks the laws of that world, then he also becomes a criminal (griefer)...much like "The Punisher" would be a mass-murderer. You can't be a "super-hero" by breaking the law. All I can do is try, wish me luck, and I'll be talking to some of you on-line.

I can see and understand your good meanings.

Apart from the fact I am very well capable of handling griefers myself (by name methodes as banlists and alike), I would like to give you one well meant advice.

Even with all your good meanings, don't push yourself up to people. If someone makes you clear that your help is not welcome or needed, let it be that way.

And above everything, respect peoples privacy. Even for a super-hero it is not polite to enter houses unasked. Well, I think you know what I mean... *giggles* Else a super-hero may face forces even he/she can not fight

Morwen.

Thanks Morwen LOL...

and you're right about "forcing help onto people". Luckily for me, I learned that lesson early on, when I was 15 and tried to intervene in an outdoor violent domestic dispute. Battered as she was, the wife turned on ME!

I'm just here to have fun, and help when I can...oh yeah, and to party

An earlier poster asks the valid question, "Who the hell ASKED you?"

I wish I could say I and my group wasn't asked almost right away for help with griefer incidents as soon as the group was founded, but we were, and we have been on an almost continuous basis.

A griefer forces you to participate in his behavior whether you want to or not - but when somebody comes to you without being solicited or pressured in any way to do so and asks for your help, do you turn away?

The important difference between a vigilante and a public servant is that the public servant is asked for help and works within society's rules, while the vigilante is acting completely on his own and often sidesteps or ignores society's rules. Just because Kid Kaufman wants to help, doesn't automatically make him either a griefer himself, or a vigilante.

You seem like a nice enough chap, Kid, and if you want to help people, there are plenty of new residents around who don't understand how things work in SL and don't know how to most effectively react when they're confronted with some idiot shooting cageguns around.

If I was minded to be a superhero I'd wander around welcome areas and newbie clubs handing out notecards and anti-griefing devices, and being prepared to shout advice if anything actually happened - "everyone sit on a prim! right, now AR the guy! here's how you do it..." Or, if somebody's being personally harassed, let them know that they can report someone who's poking their prim dong at them to both Lindens and landowners. Get familiar with the people who own the newbie hangouts and get their advice on what's best to do.

This is off-topic, but I just want to point out that the word you want is "av" (as in avatar.) "Sim" (as in simulator) refers to the area you are in.

Nice - very creative! =D

This thread did get me thinking ...

Who is it... the "Freedom Riders" that show up at veteran funerals to position themselves supportively between the Rev. Phelps nutcases and the mourning family members?

An amusing form of 'griefer deterrent' would be to have a group of "freedom riders" show up at an event in progress, bringing a sim's population to 40, preventing any griefers from actually getting in.

If somone present wants to bring in someone new... one of the freedom riders could be relieved from duty to free up space for an incoming person.

(all this is presuming the event it is taking place somewhere where the host/members don't have access to parcel or estate management tools.)