Do Natural Monopolies Need Virtual Regulation?
|
Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
|
06-21-2007 09:43
From: Jessica Elytis Called "choice". If anyone has a monoploly in SL, it is due to the fact of the idea being born in thier heads or of superior skills in manufacturing a product that none can copy. At that point, I would call it "patent" more than "monoply" even though patents don't recognise IP. I use the word here for reference. If they can make a product, and you can't, you are forced to buy it from them if you want it. If you make a product that they can't, they are forced to buy it from you if they want it.
Well, no, the OP has a fair point - as I mentioned above, network effect can create a monopoly and doesn't match either of those. It's similar to something that came up on another thread, essentially in SL you have two types of product, the "generic" type which can apply to anyone (flight assists, casual wear, etc) and the "community" type which are specific to particular communities. Competing with a "community" product right now is very hard because almost everyone already in the community will be referring newcomers to your competitor's existing product that they are familiar with. Relatively few people are shopping around, and that can be fairly devastating when you're trying to get started. I know that many of the existing well-known makers were underdogs at one point, but the people they displaced weren't entrenched for as long as the current makers have been now, and moreover most of the early products were lacking some relatively easy functionality or properties that people in the community cared about. That's no longer the case - so you have to be careful, since it's great to add new ideas, but you have to take care that you aren't just adding extra things which nobody will care about. And that itself is difficult because most of the things which people care about, the existing makers already did, so you may well wind up having to sell your new ideas to the community as well as counting on them to sell your product..
|
Watermelon Tokyo
Square
Join date: 20 Nov 2006
Posts: 93
|
06-21-2007 09:52
From: Chip Midnight Now that we have sculpties and they can be animated I figure pretty soon the aforementioned "parts" will actually start mouthing the cliches instead of just texting them. Wow that's some imagery I didn't need.... Seriously though, back to the OP... regulation just isn't gonna happen anytime soon. I think we can all agree on that. As to the monopoly situation ... befiore kicking up a fuss about interoperability, why don't all you aspriring dong makers come up with an open standard, form a consortium and have a go at it.
_____________________
Free eyes and prim sunglasses at the new Second Eyes main store in Plush Theta!
|
Qie Niangao
Coin-operated
Join date: 24 May 2006
Posts: 7,138
|
06-21-2007 10:01
From: Jessica Elytis To be competative, no matter how much the market is flooded with a certain company's product, on only needs to make a better product. But not if there's an overwhelming disincentive to use a better product because it can't interoperate with the huge existing market base of the inferior product. Another poster pointed out that a superior product in fact exists... but compare dwell at Competitor A's shop and Maker X's shop: in reality, Competitor A couldn't give away enough L$s with each free copy of their superior product to attract substantial market from Maker X. From: Jessica Elytis [...] If anyone has a monoploly in SL, it is due to the fact of the idea being born in thier heads or of superior skills in manufacturing a product that none can copy. At that point, I would call it "patent" more than "monoply" even though patents don't recognise IP. I use the word here for reference. If they can make a product, and you can't, you are forced to buy it from them if you want it. If you make a product that they can't, they are forced to buy it from you if they want it. Perhaps ironically, it was "patents" that got me thinking about this, while reading another thread about "copycats." At least in the US, patents exist to encourage innovation (or anyway that was Franklin's stated intent). It was essentially the same motivation that passed the Sherman Anti-Trust act during a Republican-dominated era. To be honest, I can't imagine a regulatory framework in Second Life as it currently exists, but eventually one would expect that a virtual economy would have to adopt some of the safeguards to free trade that RL economies have been forced to adopt.
|
Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
|
06-21-2007 10:19
From: Qie Niangao But not if there's an overwhelming disincentive to use a better product because it can't interoperate with the huge existing market base of the inferior product. Another poster pointed out that a superior product in fact exists... but compare dwell at Competitor A's shop and Maker X's shop: in reality, Competitor A couldn't give away enough L$s with each free copy of their superior product to attract substantial market from Maker X. To be fair, I should point out that it was not clear that the product described was _superior_, only that it was _more complicated_. The difference between these has been driven very hard into my head in a manner involving a product that took several months to produce. Yes, the well-known prim naughty bits are quite simple, but do we really want to simulate not knowing what to do to please your partner best and thus risking doing the wrong thing and getting no reaction? I mean, whatever next - checking the bounding boxes on avatars to see if you banged your elbow on the wall...
|
Isablan Neva
Mystic
Join date: 27 Nov 2004
Posts: 2,907
|
06-21-2007 10:32
The naughty bits market in SL has gone through several major evolutions where differing creators came out "on top" as it were (wink, wink, nudge, nudge.) Eventually, some enterprising soul will come out with something that surpases the current market leader, steals the business and then he/she gets to be king of the naughty bits market until the process repeats itself.... One has to keep in the mind the "churn" of the SL resident population, it is always possible for someone new to break in and cater to those who are just starting out and aren't ready to spend big bucks. A smart competitor would have have a freebie line with limited features and an upgrade package to build brand loyalty among new users....
_____________________
 http://slurl.com/secondlife/TheBotanicalGardens/207/30/420/
|
Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
|
06-21-2007 10:36
From: Isablan Neva A smart competitor would have have a freebie line with limited features and an upgrade package to build brand loyalty among new users.... Oh, Isablan.. I am going to be stifling laughter and blushing for the rest of the day now 
|
Ann Launay
Neko-licious™
Join date: 8 Aug 2006
Posts: 7,893
|
06-21-2007 10:41
From: Yumi Murakami To be fair, I should point out that it was not clear that the product described was _superior_, only that it was _more complicated_.
Are we talking about the one I mentioned? It has the same basic functionality as the 'big guy,' and you can just stick with that if you like, while also allowing you the option to do more...it's just an opinion, but that seems superior to me. 
_____________________
~Now Trout Re-Re-Re-Certified!~ From: someone I am bumping you to an 8.5 on the Official Trout Measuring Instrument of Sluttiness. You are an enigma - on the one hand a sweet, gentle, intelligent woman who we would like to wrap up in our arms and protect, and on the other, a temptress to whom we would like to do all sorts of unmentionable things.
Congratulations and shame on you! You are a bit of a slut.
|
Zaphod Kotobide
zOMGWTFPME!
Join date: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 2,087
|
06-21-2007 10:51
Uh, Chip? That's just.. ermm.. creepy. From: Chip Midnight Now that we have sculpties and they can be animated I figure pretty soon the aforementioned "parts" will actually start mouthing the cliches instead of just texting them.
_____________________
From: Albert Einstein Problems cannot be solved at the same level of awareness that created them.
|
SqueezeOne Pow
World Changer
Join date: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 1,437
|
06-21-2007 10:54
From: Qie Niangao A very large vendor of avatar body parts and accessories--well, "private parts," mostly--has almost absolute market control, stemming from the extreme benefit of interoperability of those parts, for both different parts on the same avatar and across avatars.
This seems like a natural monopoly, which in RL would be subject to regulation of some sort. Microsoft, for example, is required to expose some interfaces and provide advance notice of changes to those interfaces, and forbidden from bundling certain features. It was pretty much either this, or being broken into a bunch of "Baby Bills" on the model of the AT&T divestiture.
The question is whether some form of pro-competition remedy (e.g., enforced open protocols) would be appropriate for our virtual economy, in this case or any other.
(One aspect that clouds this is licensing of closed protocols. The criteria for licensing in-world seem linked to the ability of the licensee to increase demand for the licensor's products; it's unclear the degree to which this remedies the anti-competitive situation.) If this attachment made it so you couldn't wear anything that that guy didn't make and he bought out every shop that was competition then it would be a monopoly. Dominating a market because your product is superior doesn't equal a monopoly. Dominating a market through actively attempting to block or obsorb competitive companies is a monopoly.
_____________________
Semper Fly -S1. Pow
"Violence is Art by another means"
Visit Squeeze One Plaza in Osteria. Come for the robots, stay for the view!http://slurl.com/secondlife/Osteria/160.331/203.881
|
Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
|
06-21-2007 11:56
From: Zaphod Kotobide Uh, Chip? That's just.. ermm.. creepy. So are naughty bits that text cliches when you click on them 
_____________________
 My other hobby: www.live365.com/stations/chip_midnight
|
Aleister Montgomery
Minding the gap
Join date: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 846
|
06-21-2007 12:14
I partially agree with the thread starter. I think if the product was really superior, no one would complain  but as it is, it only sells due to the misleading message "you need this to be compatible, no matter how crappy it looks. If you wear another product, you're sexually incompatible to 90% of all SL women and the majority of sex toys on the market". Where I disagree though is that X has a true monopol and that it would be impossible to break the monopol with a better product. Many customers dislike an attachment that doesn't do what they want when they want, has a mind of its own that decides to stay limp when the roleplayer wants it to be ready for use, can't be timed with... climactic RL events and, above all, spams annoying green text in rather peculiar English. The same texts all over again, each time the product is used. For that reason, there are enough customers who value functionality, a realistic look and good particle effects over mediocre design that is only accepted for the sake of so-called "compatibility". Compatibility meaning sims getting lagged due to countless listeners in X products and X-enabled toys plus lots of spam texts. I wonder how much of the lag problem in SL is caused by X; that's why I don't only sell better attachments but also refuse to make my adult toys X-compatible, in order to keep them as performant and lagless as possible. Competing with X is the same as opening a gourmet restaurant next to a McD fastfood temple. Everyone knows their food is unhealthy, but everyone eats there. Nonetheless, McD doesn't have a food monopol and a gourmet restaurant can still make a decent revenue.
|
Darien Caldwell
Registered User
Join date: 12 Oct 2006
Posts: 3,127
|
06-21-2007 12:26
I find this thread rather xciting, but i'm getting distinct sensations that indicate it's much ado about nothing. Build a better twiddlehopper, and the virtual world will beat a path to your door. (just have a mop handy.)
|
SqueezeOne Pow
World Changer
Join date: 21 Dec 2005
Posts: 1,437
|
06-21-2007 12:28
From: Darien Caldwell I find this thread rather xciting, but i getting distinct sensations that indicate it's much ado about nothing. Build a better twiddlehopper, and the virtual world will beat a path to your door. (just have a mop handy.) HAHA! That was broadly offensive. I loved it!!
_____________________
Semper Fly -S1. Pow
"Violence is Art by another means"
Visit Squeeze One Plaza in Osteria. Come for the robots, stay for the view!http://slurl.com/secondlife/Osteria/160.331/203.881
|
Gordon Wendt
404 - User not found
Join date: 10 May 2006
Posts: 1,024
|
06-21-2007 12:41
Well in their defense this unnamed company's products do Xcite  all their customers
_____________________
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/GWendt Plurk: http://www.plurk.com/GordonWendt GW Designs: XStreetSL
|
Ann Launay
Neko-licious™
Join date: 8 Aug 2006
Posts: 7,893
|
06-21-2007 12:49
From: Chip Midnight So are naughty bits that text cliches when you click on them  They don't have to be cliches if you're willing to work on your notecards a bit. 
_____________________
~Now Trout Re-Re-Re-Certified!~ From: someone I am bumping you to an 8.5 on the Official Trout Measuring Instrument of Sluttiness. You are an enigma - on the one hand a sweet, gentle, intelligent woman who we would like to wrap up in our arms and protect, and on the other, a temptress to whom we would like to do all sorts of unmentionable things.
Congratulations and shame on you! You are a bit of a slut.
|
Isablan Neva
Mystic
Join date: 27 Nov 2004
Posts: 2,907
|
06-21-2007 13:45
Ya know, we just had a hair show; a jewelry show is coming up...why isn't some budding entrepreneur putting together PassionCon '07? (just be quick about it before age verification deploys...)
_____________________
 http://slurl.com/secondlife/TheBotanicalGardens/207/30/420/
|
Colette Meiji
Registered User
Join date: 25 Mar 2005
Posts: 15,556
|
06-21-2007 13:58
I never thought Xcite was all that great anyhow.
I much prefer to type in the heat of the moment.
Typos and pauses are part of the indication you are suceeding at something, after all.
Plus when it comes to cybering men, having to keep clicking them to keep them "interested" is a major annoyance.
|
Learjeff Innis
musician & coder
Join date: 27 Nov 2006
Posts: 817
|
06-21-2007 14:22
Bingo Collette.
Compatibility isn't really so important anyway. The leader here has a substantial lead, but there are areas for improvement and they can easily lose that lead.
IMHO, we don't need any silly regulations to fix this "problem". Where would it end? Let's not punish the market leader for being successful.
I would like to see more products from various vendors support the Sensations open communication standard. Also, a little marketing (like giving out good items as freebies!) would go a LONG way in this regard.
I really believe that this is a sitation that some seriously good entrepeneurship and marketing skills could change quite radically. I've been tempted myself, but I don't want to go into permanent customer support mode!
|
Zaphod Kotobide
zOMGWTFPME!
Join date: 19 Oct 2006
Posts: 2,087
|
06-21-2007 15:33
"Hold that pose honey, I'm going to edit in a few changes to the notecard here. No genital clicking while I'm editing!" From: Colette Meiji I never thought Xcite was all that great anyhow. I much prefer to type in the heat of the moment. Typos and pauses are part of the indication you are suceeding at something, after all. Plus when it comes to cybering men, having to keep clicking them to keep them "interested" is a major annoyance.
_____________________
From: Albert Einstein Problems cannot be solved at the same level of awareness that created them.
|
Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
|
06-21-2007 16:13
From: Ann Launay Are we talking about the one I mentioned? It has the same basic functionality as the 'big guy,' and you can just stick with that if you like, while also allowing you the option to do more...it's just an opinion, but that seems superior to me.  It might seem that way, but in market reality it isn't superior unless it actually adds new functionality _that people use_. If people don't care about the new features, they might as well not exist. Again, a lesson I've learned painfully. And I have to reiterate: via Microsoft, there's a case that making a good product in a market with network effect _can_ be considered a monopoly.
|
Ann Launay
Neko-licious™
Join date: 8 Aug 2006
Posts: 7,893
|
06-21-2007 17:09
From: Zaphod Kotobide "Hold that pose honey, I'm going to edit in a few changes to the notecard here. No genital clicking while I'm editing!" lol, plan ahead. 
_____________________
~Now Trout Re-Re-Re-Certified!~ From: someone I am bumping you to an 8.5 on the Official Trout Measuring Instrument of Sluttiness. You are an enigma - on the one hand a sweet, gentle, intelligent woman who we would like to wrap up in our arms and protect, and on the other, a temptress to whom we would like to do all sorts of unmentionable things.
Congratulations and shame on you! You are a bit of a slut.
|
Strife Onizuka
Moonchild
Join date: 3 Mar 2004
Posts: 5,887
|
06-22-2007 02:23
I'm going to lock this thread for naming names and being off-topic. From: Wikipedia: Primary characteristics of a monopoly * Single Seller: For a pure monopoly to take place, only one company can be selling the good. A company can have a monopoly on certain goods and not on other goods. * Significant Barrier of Entry: In a monopoly, it is usually harder for other firms to get into the industry to provide the same goods or services as the company who is already the dominant firm of the industry. * No close substitutes: Monopoly is not merely the state of having a unique or recognizable product, but also that there are no close substitutes available for the function the good fills. * Price maker: Because a single firm controls the total supply in a pure monopoly, it is able to exert a significant degree of control over the price by changing the quantity supplied.
There are many companies in the private part industry and they selling a diverse variety of products. There are no costs (besides that of upload) to entering the content industry in SL. Supplies in SL are infinite, very few producers in SL restrict the number of models of a product sold. It would be hard to ague that anyone other then LL is a monopoly in SL.
_____________________
Truth is a river that is always splitting up into arms that reunite. Islanded between the arms, the inhabitants argue for a lifetime as to which is the main river. - Cyril Connolly
Without the political will to find common ground, the continual friction of tactic and counter tactic, only creates suspicion and hatred and vengeance, and perpetuates the cycle of violence. - James Nachtwey
|