Repossession of land + Changing the name of a region ?

Hi SL'ers

I was just thinking about 2 things this morning.

Did you read some Private Islands Covenants ?

Sometimes you read this kind of Esoteric formula (well, in my opinion) :

"If you do not pay at due time, we'll take repossession of the land"...

And other different ways of writing it to express the same idea, but other than the fact you will be banned with possibly no home, what happen after for you in terms of money... or for the Land Baron ?

I meant: ..let's say you paid 55k for a chunk of land, also paid your first 2 months of Tier to the PI owner, and suddenly fails to make your new Tier payment... can you consider that the Baron will take all of your initial 55k without any reimbursement ?? So, you bought Land for nothing, better to just rent ??

I'm sure this case already happened and i wonder what the baron did with the 'repossessed' land ? Selling it after ? (making twice the price of the Land then..)

I'm curious about your comments on this point...




Oh and if someone here know if we can change the name of a Region ??
I know we can do that for the name of the Island for a $50 fee if my memory is good, but what about the region name ??

Tks all

They do, that's one of the ways they make profit.

A private sim owner can do anything he or she wants with their sim, which unfortunately includes being less than honest since the proper place for any such disputes is the RL justice system which is impractical/impossible in almost all cases so they just get away with it.

In extreme cases some sim owners have banned their tenants and demanded an extortion fee to be allowed to come pick up their furniture, or have them deleted (in reality they could only keep the furniture "hostage", but most people don't know or are too fearful that it might be true).

The majority of private sim landlords will be honest, but you should still realize you're paying for a hollow guarantee since a covenant isn't even a legally binding agreement so the risk is always there.
If you want the benefits, but with a reduced risk, find a reputable landlord who does a "pure rental" in which case the most you'd ever loose is a week's worth of rent (or month's worth depending).

I think the price for a region name change is actually $100 US though, and if you're renting a full sim, it's the sim owner that needs to request it through concierge.

can't change the name of a region if not private for what i know.

what do you think LL do to land owners that dont pay the Tier on time ?

It's no different on the mainland, if you don't pay your tier, LL will repossess with no refunds for the purchase of the land.

It has to be written into the covenant that land will be repossessed, they do need to collect the monthly fees to pay LL themselves.

Welcome to the concept of paying your bills... Let's examine your question a little further...


If you dont pay your house payment, guess what happens.....

If you dont make your vehicle payments, guess what happens...

If you dont pay your land taxes, guess what happens......

Of course they will take it away.

Now go pay your bills so you dont lose your stuff.

Just having an evil thought but a particularly vindictive sim owner I think could 'roll back' to before occupancy? Of course, that would knock everyone else for six too but just thinking aloud.

Thanks for your comments, actually i'm writing my covenant.

One thing is sure, the Sim owner will continue to be charged each month by LL, the land being paid or not.
Just that i noticed nothing after this 'delicate' alinea, like " we'll take repossession of the land and you'll lose it", point. Period.

I think there isn't a perfect solution for both parties...
But if someone get it, comments are open

And about changing the name of a Region , i'll try to contact a concierge in order to be sure about the fee, $100 isn't a 'friendly price'

You have at the very least a week (I think it's 30 days) to settle any negative balance with LL before your account runs into any problems. No such thing can be said about private sim owners, so it's still quite different.

This is true, however the reason behind that is LL owns all the land anyway. Private sim owners have to make sure they get enough to pay their own bills or *everyone* that rents on the sim could find themselves locked out because LL locks out the private owner.

My rentals are just that, rentals...I never wanted to deal with anyone complaining about not getting the amount they paid for on the land or having to deal with someone not paying and then getting pissy about losing their land. Its simple for a renter, you either pay weekly or you are removed from the property. Nothing lost as you pay a week ahead of time. I DO wait a day or two after rent expires and contact the renter before clearing a property for rent again (watching to see if they have logged in through the group too). For larger tier payments a private sim owner may not even wait a day.

Keep in contact with your landlord if you have a need to be a day or so late with your rent. I would hope to shout that most wouldnt just ban people the day rent is due.

You're right about the fact a Sim owner can't wait 'too' long.. But i really hope a Sim owner has enough money to be out for a few dozens dollars each month and can wait a few days to solve the problem with his/her customer... at the worst.
A majority of residents will pay on due time, hopefully.

About my covenant, well..the problem is solved.
Each one will have the guarantee that they'll never lose more than 50% of the price they paid for their land, it's not a 'perfect' solution but it's far more better than what i already read
At least, somewhat fair

They give them due time to pay, some of there landbarrons are thiefs and LL should ban them and reclaim all the sims they own

Just pay your bill in time or at least get into contact with the island owner. For the group I work for there is a period up to ten days depending on the problem a resident has. But there are also residents who ignore messages while they are on. In these cases reclaiming land will work to force them to take action. What is the difference with rl? Maybe a longer time frame before they take your stuff away, but it's LL who is responsible for billing policies in SL. They don't give you an inch more to pay, so it's reasonable when you get a few days extra to pay the bill IF there is a legit reason for it. Keep in touch with the staff. That's very important. It's a matter of mutual respect.

And don’t forget to hear both sides of a story, before you comment a situation

Hypothetical question along these same lines:

If an Island owner rents out land and then dishonestly kicks his tennants out and bans them EVEN IF THEY HAVE held up their end of the covenant - paid their fees etc. What sort of recourse is there for the tennats?

Lets put that another way:

You agree to a covenant that is not in any way binding on the Leassor. You the Leassee can get evicted at any time at the whim of the Leassor. The Landlord holds all the cards. LL has said that they will not intervene in any business disputes that don't violate TOS. So does the Tennant have any recourse if their money and furniture is taken and they are banned from the land?

Just wondering

Amen!

Thats a very good question...would be interesting in finding out as well. This is one reason I would never put a payment down on land on a private sim, I could handle losing rent money but not purchase money. The best way to go about buying privately owned land is to talk to the other SL residents on their sims. Talk to the owner themselves as well and see how responsive they are. Purchase carefully, regardless.

In any of those cases...

If they take your house....
If they take your car.......
If they take your land.......

They still contact you ahead of time, give you a chance to pay your bill or respond, and after said amount of time you get a notice of their plans to reclaim and more than enough time to get your stuff out of the house/car/off the land etc.

Here that isnt as much of a luxury as the sim owner could lose out on a large sum of money and have the possibility of their own land being reclaimed by SL, so the time frames would be vastly different. The point still stands you cant compare RL to SL, seriously.

Ok I can see reposssing land IF YOU HAVE TOO..
BUT heres the thing, I help manage 6 islands and every single month we have at least 1 person who needds a reminder that the auto lease ran out, or we have someone who needs 2 or 3 days until they can pay thier tier, we will be very accomodating to help them. BUT how many "Land lords" swoop and reclaim as fast as they can?
In my eyes that is pure wrong and I am glad that we just do rentals for tier cept for one resident who purchased.

As an island owner we can give our residents much more than they can realize on the mainland but WE MUST be fair, if island owners are not fair in their dealings it makes us all look bad and a shady land lord will soon be begging for someone to buy their island.

Treat them like Gold and YOU will be treated like Gold

No but in sl your are expected to pay your bills, just like the island owners are resonsible for paying monthly tier on the islands. And most rental boxes give several warnings, and most estate owners give warning as well. No rl and sl arn't the same but they are compairable. I think most owners reclaim as a last resort. I onlt rent out land right now, but either way I think it's a last resort.

Trust me, you arent talking to someone that doesnt understand land rentals. I deal with renters daily, those that are always on time and those that always need reminders. I've done the math and I know how much money even I have lost in a month due to late payments or a renter that simply doesnt communicate back to me.

There is a HUGE difference between swooping in and reclaiming land the day the rent expires and giving a renter a bit of time and plenty of communication before reclaiming property. Also being sure to return all of their items and not delete them or hold them for ransom, as was mentioned before. The time frames are not at all the same, of course (that was mentioned in my previous post) but adiquate warning and communication is respectful and as far as I am concerned...expected.

edit for inclusion;
Never rely on rental box notices. When someone logs into SL that notice goes into their chat box. (Not everyone has things go to their email) If they crash on entry (we know it happens, Im sick of it) they lose it. If they get other spam from other things, they may not see it. Never ever put your faith in a script to ensure your renters know how much time they have. To each landlord their own, but a nice short IM stating "Just wanted to send a little heads up that your rent is expiring tomorrow" is a lot nicer than logging in to find all your stuff in your lost and found or just simply gone.

I'm pretty sure the unpleasant answer to this question is "Not at all." because Linden Lab won't get involved in disputes of this nature, and in the eyes of Linden Lab the island is owned by the estate owner and that is where LL's obligation ends.

The great big HOWEVER though, is that a dishonest island owner might only get away with that once or twice before the rest of his tennants leave and he never rents another plot ever. It would be financial suicide for an island owner to treat residents like that. For that matter I think it would be folly for an island owner to treat their residents (aka their Customers) with anything other than fairness and respect.

Renaming an island (from the knowledge base):
Can I rename my private island?
Yes. There is a $50 charge to rename your island.
http://secondlife.com/knowledgebase/article.php?id=098

-Atashi

Oh I agree totally Ashlynn. My reply to his post was meant to be serious in a humorous sort of way. I own 7 sims of all rentals. I deal with people constantly. Luckily I am blessed with a great crew out there that 90% of them always pay on time or ahead of time. There are a couple here and there that need reminders sent, and I *always* take that extra step to make sure that they have gotten the message. I wont swoop in the minute the clock runs out either. Thats just nasty. As long as one of my tenants gets ahold of me and lets me know hey.. got the msg, will take care of it by -x- date, we're good. Its always easier to keep a tenant than find new ones.

I wont sell land on my sims for the very reasons posted earlier. If someone moves / fails to pay / etc. all they are out is a place. No money on their side is risked, I dont profit from reselling their land. I just move on to the next new friend / tenant , and start over. No biggee. I'm not in SL to make a killing on other people's money. I do it because its fun.

Completely true - always easier to keep a tenant than find new ones lol.

I dont do it to make a killing either, I wish I could but it takes more than I have to do that. I basically want to break even each month and have the 3 sims I have support themselves (2 rent, the last more for my shop, mall, friends club etc).

Course...all of this would work great if I could invite people to my group atm. Poor new tenant waiting patiently. Updates scare me

How is pocketing L$55k "losing out on a large sum of money"?

The OP's hypothetical scenario wasn't about a "pure rental", but paying L$55k for the land which should be more than enough to hold out for at least a month in case something happened on the tenant's end. If they still don't show up, the land can just be resold and the sim owner still has a nice sum left.

As for how often it happens, I'd see 1 to 3 help requests a day about people who were evicted/banned/scammed out of their private sim land, going from the loss of a few L$ k to $1000 US in one case.