Sploder....yes or no? Anyone know?

I'm still waiting for an official word from LL and it is about time they do so. As a starting clubowner I would like to entertain the people and the Sploder is nice item that people like to play while dancing on good music.

I already bought a sploder before the ban, so L$900,= wasted as it seems now. And it is just a simple yes you can have a sploder or no you can't.

Just my 2 cents,

As always with regards,

Cor

Gambling is a form of entertainment.

... should not lie with your residents.

Games of skill is being bandied about as not needing to comply - WRONG! Blackjack, Craps ... Roulette ... these are games of skill in the applied sense i.e. the player has an input of where the bet lies ... and THAT is what games of skill means. Allowing people to interpret for themselves is both morally dubious AND ultimately dangerous for yourselves.

It's come to my attention that very few people know what gambling truly constitutes of and there is widespread disinformation which will only lead to chaos.

It should not be down to residents to interpret complex laws and regulations they can not have a cat's hell in chance of understanding.

Please clarify that it is up to residents to run COMPETITIONS based on their SKILLS at something or ok for 'Best in Black' or whatever - if that is what you mean. That is NOT gambling as either common voting and/or the prize giver's judgement and discretion are thje deciding factors. There is no base "equal" chance involved in that ... someone can make something spectuacular then it's pretty obvious where the skill lies ... and that is not on betting on a hand getting to 21 before the dealer.

Also ... sploders take a RAKE. That is profit from gambling, plain and simple. A friend said recently 'But everybody wins' this is not true, everyone receives a payout and the owner of the sploder takes their cut.

GAMBLING.

Shame ... as I have said before the sploder is fairly innocuous and a way for newbs to get cash. I've seeded them at 1000L a time at events purely to get some buzz going and knowing that my share will prolly be 7L. I didn't care about that ... but I am glad I didn't buy a sploder the other day, just before the announcement.

Anything which gives away money without a WAGER being made is not gambling. It's altruism/good business practice depending on your viewpoint.

/me Reluctantly shuffles off to deal with all this crap RL too now ...

Personally I don't see why this is even a question. Look at the description of what's not allowed and it's pretty clear that sploders fit the description. I'm not a gambler, but this does dissapoint me. I do see the sploders as much more of a social activity than gambling.

I have heard of one club owner who has put his sploder back in. Each participant now always receives back exactly what they put in but some also receive an addition linden or two or three. I guess the way SL crashes these days that can still be considered a gamble.

To me it sounds pretty boring but at least he's searching for options.

Interesting ... a non-losing wager with payout ... hmmmmmm ...

Picking the bones out of that will be entertaining

I will be really sorry to see sploders disappear. I got my first big break on a sploder, having come to SL with nothing in my pockets. Its a great way to get a start for a newbie.

I wish there was some way they could make it legal. I can see, though, why they probably can't. sigh

imogen

If you folks want to us 'sploders, USE them. The worst that's going to happen is a Linden might come along one day and tell you you can't use it anymore. And I don't think that's very likely, for reasons I've already stated. It would be a bit like the feds raiding a senior care center and busting up a Friday Night Bingo party.

I know this isn't a product announcement forum, but there is a way to have a 'sploder that's not against the Gaming ban. I made one, it's in my shop (Mu Industries) and on SL Exchange. It's simple, really - turns 'sploders into a game of skill rather than chance.

Basic idea is that once the minimum number of entrants is reached, it starts counting down silently for however long the owner sets it (and it does tell you when the countdown starts, how long it will last). Last person to pay in wins half the pot, the other half is split evenly among the other participants. It's funny seeing it in action, you've got some people trying to watch a clock, and others just automatically paying in whenever someone else does.

It does NOT select a random winner - the winner is based on whoever is best at either a) counting down the time, or b) paying in quick after the last guy.

We need an officially sanctioned Linden Sploder.....shaped like Daniel's head.

Or C suffering from the least lag. It then becomes a gamble if the lag will let you place your bet before the time runs out. No thanks, no place I have been that has a sploder; er had, was lag free enough for me to want to participate.

I know we've talked about this in private, but I would be REALLY careful with those claims before you actually get a Linden to sanction it, Buck.

Personally, I think that while your idea may not violate the letter of the rule, it does violate the spirit; it is still a "wagering device", it is still gambling, and there is a degree of randomness involved, even without using any kind of random selection code.

I would have to agree. I can't see that it will really be seen as any different than a regular sploder.

I think there will be many who will try workarounds, but how successful they are will probably have more to do with how busy can the Lindens be tracking them than anything else.

Lindens: clarify on sploders please

here

or or on the linden blog

One of the clubs I go to has and interesting, and rule-compliant, take on sploders. The sploder-owner pays money in. The sploder counts down a certain amount of time, and then selects a club patron at random to pay a random amount.

So, I enter the club and see Mr. Club-owner put $L100 in the modified sploder. 300 seconds later, the sploder picks me out of 15 people in the room, and gives me $L20 just for being there.

This set up doesn't pay any profit to the club owner, and doesn't let club-goers pay anything in, so it's perfectly in compliance with the rules, but it still attracts people to your site.

"If you folks want to us 'sploders, USE them. The worst that's going to happen is a Linden might come along one day and tell you you can't use it anymore." This is something that is truly starting to aggravate me. No you are wrong the worst that could happen is the feds could shut down SL and confiscate everything. Running any sort of gambling games that are against the internet law isn't putting one over on the Lindens, it's putting all of SL at stake. Why don't people seem to understand this?
If you bet; pay to play or wager, if it pays Ls, if the winner is decided at random, it is banned. What is so unclear about that?
It just aggravates me to no end when people fain ignorance or blind themselves to the facts.

Answer to a support ticket about the question if sploders are okay or not: "We won't tell."

Yep. Almost as bad as those that don't get the whole "letter of the law" vs "spirit of the law" distinction.

A club near me is doing the same. The up side for them is they've always taken a loss on the club anyway. Used it primarily as a benefit to the community and to keep rentals full.

The club where I work, however, is in business to make money, or at least pay tier. The owner has been on vacation since all this began so I'm concerned for our future when he gets back.



I'm with you on this one, Manstan. As I've said numerous times, "Why is this even thought to be under discussion?" I think it mostly still comes from this misconception that people have that SL is this great land of freedom and anarchy where everyone can do what they want. They don't seem to realize that first of all, LL is a company in the business to make money. As much as they'd like to believe it's a democracy it's not. Secondly, regardless of where they are located they will still be held accountable to the law.

All of you that have said you've had it with SL...GO!!! The fact is that they know and we know most of you wont. If gambling, however, is the only reason you came to SL, then just surf the web. There's an unlimited number of gambling sites out there for you to go enjoy yourself. Have fun. As for me, I'll still complain about LL. It will be about their inability to provide a stable environment, it will be about their poor communication and service...and so on. Those I do expect. But I have no expectations that the employees of SL will circumvent the law and put themselves on the line to be prosecuted.

You are all missing the key point, I does not matter what our opinions of what is and is not gambling are. If it in any way resembles the description of what LL has said is gambling, it is gambling.

With risk to LL from both the Feds and from credit card companies declining payments to LL they will take the safest route and ban anything that in any way resembles gambling.