Resident Answers is the new black

Why were 75% of the forums here closed including 'General' and 'Land and Economy' after they were moderated beyond reason thus driving many residents to 3rd party forums but now we have a reincarnated 'General' forum?

Was it a great purge? And if so who was the target?

Just asking.

Yes

Everyone

Customer service is the new black (hole)

This is the new SL General forum by default. Until they close it because people are using it as the new SL General forum by default.

If they close this, people will just starting posting general comments in another topic which does not allow general comments. This will keep happening until all the forums are closed. Stupid if you ask me.

It was my understanding a year or so ago that they planned on closing all the forums eventually.

Let's hope that doesn't happen, Tristan. I'm running out of excuses not to clean.

I'm guessing the forums have had some abusive traffic lately, and LL doesn't want to moderate that traffic -- so, they will simply close the forums.

I'm guessing if they try to moderate the traffic, some traffic will get frustrated, and some traffic may get frustrated to the point where they quit SL -- and you I and know that LL can't have traffic quitting SL, because that would be a loss in revenue for LL.

Business is Business, Profit is Profit -- right?

*sigh*

Instead of extinguishing the abusive traffic, it's now being redirected. LL keeps their clients, and residents keep the abusive traffic. Yeah, that's real rich -- /sarcasm

It might've been their plan. But they probably later realized that it wouldn't have been beneficial to them. Why hire people to answer customer questions when you can have your customers answer eachothers questions for free?.

These forums are not for entertainment. You're supposed to pay for that. The forum is here for the benefit of Linden Lab.

Ideally, people are supposed to come here to answer other peoples questions. We're supposed to enjoy being helpful.

Answering the same stupid questions over and over and over is great fun!

They are trying to move people out of the forums and into the wiki. I personally do not care for wikis, because they seem unorganized to me and I never seem to find what I am looking for. I am just so use to the concept of forums. What was that saying about teaching an old dog?

Well, SL is not here for intertainment, either. SL is here for the benefit of Linden Lab.

coco

I've not seen very many "stupid questions" at all. And if you really look at much of the content of Resident Answers, it's of no great value to Linden Lab - it's INvaluable to many residents, because many of the questions are about things Linden Lab wouldn't be able to answer in any meaningful way anyway.

(what's the point of this thread?)

The real problem is if we have a voice in the forums we can protest the stupid things that LL is doing, and express our concerns. LL doesn't want us to tell them what they are doing wrong, so they try to silence us.

Curious perspective.... from where I'm sitting it looked more like the moderation process had no hope of keeping up with the quantity of off-topic, trolling, flaming, dead-horse-beating, name-naming, and other flagrant ToS/CS violations that were utterly rampant.

Personally, I'd rather have LL hire labor to work on improving SecondLife... not waste it on hiring professional forum baby-sitters.

No additional hiring is needed. We have Strife who is doing one hell of a job. Cheers, Strife!

*moves to the resmod discussion forum*

Why the forums were closed:

1. General, et al. - Repeat abusing committed.
   1. Abuse - People attacked each other regularly and with disregard. And when admonished they screamed bloody murder. The concept that they had done wrong was beyond them.
      
   2. Repeat Offenders - The punishments had no effect on stopping the abuse but did cause people to think the system was unfair; that we were playing favorites. People who make work for us are not our favorites.
      
   3. ResMods - LL tried to bring the system under control by creating the ResMod Program. Interestingly the people most vocally against the ResMod's were the worst repeat offenders. The ResMod Program became a new point for them to attack and abuse.
      
   4. Endings - In the end there was only one way to end the abuse. The other methods had been tried, they weren't scaling. They had rules, they had punishments, they had Moderators, they had Resident Moderators, they had a diverse selection of forums, they even threatened to close the forums. Some worked for a while but in the end they didn't work.
      
   
   
2. Linden Answers - Swamped. People asked LL the same questions over and over again; they never searched for the answers, just reposted. They used it to report bug and ask for dispute management. When things didn't work, people posted there. Every question answered was replaced by two more. As a method of communicating it wasn't scaling. The wiki and blog have the potential to answer any question formulated and in such a fashion that encourages using the built in search functions. Bugs get reported on Jira now, having the result that they get dealt with; not lost in a black hole.
   

Perspective:
I'm a ResMod, I see things from the side of LL and the community. I'm on the front lines you could say. In the scheme of things I don't have much power but it's enough to do my job. The only perks are knowing you can make a difference. You don't get invited to special meetings or told whats going to happen next. Sometimes you get asked how things are holding together on the forums.

Futures:
Keeping the lid on the RA forum is a never ending job. It's a balancing act between free speech and keeping on topic. Having a general forum would make my job easier in that regard but in others much harder. As a result of the closing, we have had an incredible reduction in abuse. Reopening the forums would increase the abuse workload. Keeping the lid on a General forum would be nigh impossible. Ignoring the workload, I would love there to be a general forum again, it filled an important niche. It provided a voice to the community. But I have misgivings about it, a part of me say the community needs to show it has earned it, that it has changed. Some part of me is expecting apologies to be made or a mending of bridges.

Musings:
One of the problems I've see with the system is that punishments aren't public record, you don't see in the middle of a thread "x you have broken rule y, two day ban from the forum for you" I think having this sort of thing visible would greatly reduce the amount of abuse. Discretion is a great thing but a visible Sword of Damocles works better then a hidden one.

Great post, Strife. I just wish it was on a more visible forum.

(plays devils advocate) so we who pay, like adults, are treated like kids because a few others have the control of a 2 year old? not buying it. yes i agree, having a more visible means, or "sword of damocles" type consequence, will probably reduce abusive/flaming etc; but to state that we need to "earn" it back is very arrogant of You and LL.

i have seen the residents police the RA forums way better. and well the old fashion if you ignore it, they will stop. approach never fails either. it seems the more we do behave, the more that is taken away. granted closing the GF may have been warrented, but LM, and LA forums were closed as well, even though they were only used for thier predetermined purposes.

So Strife before you bless us with Your musings, a somewhat gentle reminder: i have seen you allow threads to continue when they shouldn't, and lock those that so much as go a hairs breath off topic, maybe for your amusement, or maybe just maybe, because you are human just like us, dont know. all i know is moderators should not be allowed to offer thier opinions on anything in the forums except to give a valid reason as to why they locked a forum thread.

p.s. you are right ralph, but in this case it was used as a "big brother is watching" type thing.

Perhaps you mean more like the Sword of Justice.

The Sword of Damocles was about why people shouldn't envy those with wealth and power who control them.

Maybe so, but the edge and tip of the Sword of Damocles is only ever felt as a result of the abuse of power. Everyone has power.

@Maggie: (plays angel) It is to much to ask for apologies is it?

As to consistency of moderation in RA: It's tough, sometimes I get it wrong a little, sometimes alot. It's not always obvious what the right thing to do is. Ignoring this last week (I took the week off), I've come to the conclusion the right way to manage things is to use discretion. If the sky is falling then people need to discuss it, to better understand it, to give the community time to cope. If I stick tightly to the rules then the community suffers. If I take a week off, the community suffers. The extremes don't work, some balance in the center needs to be found. Each case assessed separately and considered together with others. The variables aren't all known and the outcomes can't all be predicted. But I keep my mailbox empty so if you ever thing I made a bad decision or need to make a decision on a thread, then please PM me. Since going to a more community conscious methodology the number of "Strife Sucks" threads have decreased.

There wouldn't be a resmod program if the community was good at policing itself but I have noticed the policing going on in the RA forum and it has made my job easier. I haven't given it much thought to giving informal warnings up until now but I think there is room for me to improve. I will spend time thinking about it.

As to giving opinions: I agree that I shouldn't be giving an opinion when doing my job. Like if I'm closing a personal dispute thread picking sides is a big mistake (been there, done that, it was a disaster, don't need to repeat that). When it comes to giving opinions, I usually spend a long time writing and rewriting (I've been writing this post for the last two hours) because people like to pick them apart. I have to choose my words very carefully. It's tough but sometimes it's good for the community to know where their moderators stand on issues. Having my opinions being known helps the community understand and better communicate with me. The responses help keep me in touch with the communities needs.

I am very tired now but I will revisit this topic tomorrow.

I've been here for a while now. In the past I've moderated and owned forums, so I know how tough the task of moderating a forum can be.

From what I've seen, Strife Onizuka gets a 7 out of 10 on my score book.

reading this, one would think the forums would completely fall to ruins if you weren't here.
and yes it's very obvious what the thing to do is: your job. you can close a forum without the smart alecky comments such as :the following sentence requires a sense of humor; please read no further if you find yourself lacking This is soooooo locked. just lock the thread and give your reason. without the ego posturing.as to the drop off of "strife sucks" postings i owe that to the fact that those who did dare question you were either banned from the forums, or realised that bringing up valid points in regards to your moderating was useless. as for case variables? again simple: do your job. does the thread help a resident? does it answer questions that residents need to know? is it a repeat post? not that hard or as hard as you make it at least.




again you missed the point. it was not my intention to have you give a long "winded" speech clarifying as to why you seem to think the forums would collapse without you. all i am basically sayin is this: you can close a thread without snide remarks, or voicing your opinion. you are a resmod, act like one. the fact you feel the need to take two to three hours trying to compose an answer to my previous post or some witty but un-necessary remark, is very telling.

i need coffee now and a danish. perhaps i will visit this topic again perhaps not.

I believe you all are reading more into the reasons than what actually exist. The reason there are less of these types of threads, is that the number of forum users have significantly decreased. Fewer people are reading them that care to see what Strife or any of the Res Mods are doing or saying. Another reason is that the attention to responding to most threads is a waste of time so the responses are getting less and less.

I wonder what the forums will look like in a year from now and if they will have an IBM insignia attached to them. I know, I know, this is how rumors get started. Imagine that!

I would interpret that not as "Strife Sucks" any less, but that there's less people to state it, or less that are bothering to point out what's been all but a fact of life for a year now.


- Newfie
(Who doesn't really think Strife sucks, but that Strife's just the local LL stormtrooper. Oh wait, maybe that does make them suck)

Of course there are fewer forum residents, a short time ago they made it a requirement for access to the forums that accounts must be verified. That change of policy alone makes quantizing the changes in forum readership due to anything else very difficult. Not to mention with the closing of specific forums which caused the focus of the forums to change, resulting in readership turnover. I'd love to see the results of any study conducted on this topic, especially if it gave recommendations.

If I enforce the rules flawlessly, I'm seen as a stormtrooper. If I use discretion I'm seen as inconsistent. I can't make everyone happy.

The forums don't need me but they do need someone to do my job. If abuse is left unchecked then LL will close the forums.

Strife, you said that well. You are one of the few ResMods that DO their job. If I see a problem on the forums, You are the one that I alert first. You will do something about it. So many say they will, so many have good intentions, but so many fall short on what needs to be done. As you said the job needs to be done, all of you that are Res Mods should be stepping up to the plate and doing your fair share. Strife has broad shoulders and does take a lot of heat...it can be shared by many more than just him tho.