Snatched Land

Just a few hours ago my buddy was buying a lot for 1k. The seller did not set it up right as in so many cases i'm sure. Instead of setting sell to only my buddy, he set it to anyone. Withing seconds, and no one else in the area, the land was snatched up by an unlisted group named VLANDCO OR VLANDCO.COM and seconds later was for resale again for 4k by them.

My buddy not wanting to lose the lot bought it quickly for the 4k. He did not get the members names in his rush and as I said, they are unlisted.

My question is how the hell did they do this? Is this something LL allows? I mean it's not safe to sell your land. One tiny mistake and poof, it's gone!

Now I don't want to say anything bad about the group yet as if contacted they may be understanding and attempt to rectify the situation? But he can't find anyone to contact.

Any help will recieve many thanks.

If no one else was in the vicinity when your seller changed the price too low by mistake, it sounds like some automated software robot is scanning for land offers at a certain price and grabbing it instantly.

Any other theories?

Theory: someone saw it in the land list (probably sorting by L$/m2), used p2p TP to arrive instantly and bought it. I don't know how an automated robot could TP somewhere and buy land.

Very easily ... if you can program in mouseclicks then it can be done..there are hundreds of scripting tools(not LSL scripts) out there to get it accomplished...(not that they are safe from a virus infection OR TOS stand point)

There has been rumor by several land owners in the sim that there is a scanner flying around it. This is the first time to my knowledge that no one appeared as it happened but several close calls have occured in this sim when someone accidently made this same mistake and in seconds, someone was flying overhead. My buddy new about this and was watching very close.

If it is some type of scanner, does LL allow this rather it be automated or not?

if the scanner is LSL based i dont think it would be all that much of a problem ..just another tool for Real Estate investors in SL .. on the other hand if they have automated their computer to run SL and scan, buy and sell land... first good job on gettin it working but in most MMORPG's 3rd party software is against the TOS.

I'm not so sure about that. If reverse engineering wasnt required, I'm not sure there's anything in the TOS other than the catch all 'we can ban you for anything' clause.

-Adam

Well if its not LSL based, how would I know?

I'd like to add that if that is what they have, a program set up to scan for land, buy low and sell high, and all automated, I want one. Gees, I could sit back, log in once a week, collect my money and see how many suckers I screwed!

It just amazes me more and more everyday the things that are allowed to happen here. I feel sorry for myself and more so for the people that just don't have a clue yet.

Well, doing it without reverse engineering might be difficult; but I think it can be done. Some screen-scraping OCR/pattern recog., combined with some windowing hooks might be able to do it without R.E.

Of course, the best way involves decoding the SL protocol - but you would need clearance from LL's legal dept before you even thought about that.

-Adam

Be glad it was a small loss. I remember one person who lost a huge property because when rejoining land together, the lower priced land overwrote the price of the big land, making the price for both lands combined very low. A buyer swooped in and grabbed it up.

Then the buyer cut it up and sold it for a huge profit.

That this exists is certainly possible but I find this story suspicious in general. That it worked so perfectly, that no names were named and that after having complained to us about it you seem eager to do it yourself.

Perhaps I am confusing you with the perpetrator, but didn't you start that long thread recently about land scanning and how to find out about land for sale "automatically"?

This is something to be wary of. Working in haste, I have made this mistake in the past. Fortunately, no harm done for me.

The issue isn't that the guy bought the low priced land. This is good real estate practice, using an efficient means. I will give the person the benefit of the doubt that this is not just to swoop in on these types of user erros, but simply to buy low priced land and turn it over. The real issue is in the land tools and the need for people to know what they are doing. Mistakes can be costly.

Dunno how they do it but yes, one tiny mistake and poof, it's gone. Some will return the land; some won't. None of them are obligated to by LL or the TOS.

The only times I've personally known LL to step in and reverse this type of issue were when Jarod Godel bought accidentally priced or released land. He purchased both in good faith with a plan to build; so the second time around, a Linden promised him a block of land in the new colour sims as they came online. The company didn't back the promise of course; so he ended up with nothing.

I relate this story to demostrate the types of situations LL finds itself in when it tries to negotiate land mistakes for residents. Basically, nobody wins. They've had to determine that the best policy is to let the person who made the mistake lose so that they, and the buyer, can win. Two out of three ain't bad.

No you don't want to say anything bad about the group because you'd be breaking the rules.

Yes, I did start a thread like that. And yes, I would love to have a tool that would IM me when land became available in my sim as I'm trying to buy more there. At least I'd have a fair chance of competing against the big companies. But I wouldn't want a tool that would lag the sim and I don't think it should be allowed at all to be able to let an automated program buy land. I believe a live person should have to do the leg work and get there as fast as they can if they want it. That's fairness to me. To allow a program to buy and sell peoples dreams is not. You can see the result in this case. Then to top it off, the group that bought and sold it is not listed. No way to contact them. Why is that I wonder? I'm sure this is not the first time someone got taken by there little program.

As far as names, I'm not sure what you want? You see mine, you see the groups. I won't give my friends name without asking first but I don't see what that has to do with anything? Sorry if I'm missing something here.

Me too.

getting one is probably a discussion for the scripting tips section.. however.. im not sure that SL provides a way to check for land price via script IN GAME... it could be done via another scripting language for sure though

There is no way to query a parcel for any info other than who owns it. So please save all the hysterical bot stuff.

This happens many times, every single day. There are about 7 or 8 peple who regularly refresh that land list, sorting by price per meter squared, that will port in and buy land when they see deals. Most will give it back, if you simply IM them and tell them it was a mistake, however, there are a couple who won't. If you want their names, feel free to IM me in-world, I will tell you.

Your best bet is to use the sell to individual function.

The problem with that is who are they? It's a unlisted group. No names. My friend in his haste to buy the land at the higher price so he wouldn't lose it again, did not think to grab any members names first.

The goodness in me tells me they will be understanding about it but as you said, it happenes all the time, so you would think they would have a better, more public way of contacting them when cases like this happen.

A couple of months ago I had 1/4 of a sim near a telehub, and I set it for sale for 130k, or so I thought I did. Had to go afk quickly to see to my son, came back 10 mins later and eveything was gone, and it had been bought for 13k cause I missed off a 0 in my hurry, and then had been sold on to someone else and the land was all divided up and set to sell, all in 10 mins!. And he refused to return it, and he refused to give me the profit of 67k which he made on it. Trust noone. I lost over $400 rl money on that.

So, if I sell my land for what I think is a good price and the buyer then puts it up for sale for a huge profit, should I ask him for it back so I can make the huge profit instead? How is the buyer to know if the seller "made a mistake" when typing in the amount or "made a mistake" when figuring out a good sale price? Land is worth lindens, lindens are worth dollars and dollars are real money. Be careful, typos can cost real money, just like in real life.

This thread was brought forward to me, I am the person that seems to be in question here.

First off lets clear up the conspiracy theories of some evil automated land monitoring system, my system consists of occasionnaly clicking on "find" then "land sales" and indeed sorting by the price per sq meter.

So with that out of the way, I vaugley remember this purchase. From my recolection I teleported in, and stood directly next to presumabley your friend? While your friend was talking to what I would guess was the seller about his up and comming establishment, none the less AFTER I purchased this land he said to the seller something to the effect of "so would you like to sell the land?" I thought to myself "good timing" and I'm not ashamed of that fact at all, as was already mentioned in this thread several people do the same thing, far more than the number that was mentioned, and someone else even noted "good real estate practice". Thats all it was, no more no less, and sadly no evil automated scanning robots.

I learned my lesson long ago not to buy obvious mistakes in land pricing, #1 someone gets screwed out of $L #2 those people are obviosuly going to complain and #3 it's simply bad karma. Hell, I've begrudgingly given mispriced land back to THE biggest land owner in SL, if I was out to rip people off I would have certainly kept it.

I remember selling my "first land" for $L512 because I wanted it to sell fast so I could go shopping!

Now down to my final point, Linden Labs has done us all a huge favor by creating a dialog box that reads as follows, whenever you make a change to land sale pricing:

The selected XXXX sq. m. land is being set for sale.
Your selling price will be L$XXXX and will be authorized for sale to Anyone.
Would you like to continue making this change?

Seems pretty clear to me...

IMHO currently the only place the fail-safes actually fail is when subdividing and reconnecting land parcels, adding a large parcel to a small for sale parcel, puts the larger parcel for sale at the price of the smaller parcel. Very dangerous, yet not the case in this situation.

Due to the circumstances, and especially because the SELLER didn't contact me before your friend purchased it (please don't use the excuse that he was affraid he would loose it so he had to buy it quickly, land doesn't go very fast at your claimed price of $L7.81 sq m) and further I personally witnessed the fact that your friend had no deal with this seller before I bought it, I'm not really sure what you expect me to do?

Do you think a RL relator wouldn't laugh in your face if you came up to them and said, I'll buy this for more money, but I want reimbursed for what the other guy paid for it?

I am trully sorry that you and or your friend feel jilted in this situation but in quoting you "Gees, I could sit back, log in once a week, collect my money and see how many suckers I screwed!" who has the problem here? I don't think it's me.

It really seems to me you just want to know "how I did it" because you yourself "want to do it". Well I'll tell you once more... the magic of the find button.

Yes, Nolan, there are these people.

And of course the practice described is completely legitimate. If a parcel is set for sale at a specific price, its a little lame to complain if it is sold for that price.

It is lame too, to base your business on other peoples mistakes. Some might say that it is a sure road to success, though. Maybe that is true. I still would prefer to do a business that adds some value and not only exploits that fact that other people might be stupid, inexperienced, tired or simply have made an error. But tastes differ.

...'profitable real estate practice' is a superset of 'good real estate practice'; sadly, this distinction is lost on most pods these days...

Adam. Thank you for coming forward. I will put my friend in direct contact with you now and if any resolution can come from that then great, it's between you two.

I'm really not in these forums to bicker with people who like to make assumptions about me, how I think or what my motives are. With that said, I will just add that I disagree with most of what you are saying! If you care for a further explanation feel free to contact me anytime. As far as I'm concerned though, this thread has acomplished it's goal.

As always, thank you all for your help. When there seems to be no place to turn to in times of need, I know I can always count on support here