STIPENDS - Lets all vote then STFU!

Will ending stipends kill/harm SL?
Will it 'save' SL? Does SL even need saving?

Vote here. Then maybe everyone can shut-up going on and on and on and on about it!

You could also discuss it here, but why bother when there are already 10 gazillion threads, not one of which has ever caused anyone to change their original opinion?

(unsure what STFU means? Check google for definitions)

Welcome to SL Digital Misfit!
Thank you for voting to end stipends today, your first day on SL!

Great poll! Keep it here for 2 weeks, count the votes, inform LL of the outcome and dont bring it up for another year!

Need to run this poll in world too, to see it have real results.

D) I trust LL to make this determination more than any resident.

*bump*

Must say Im surprised. I thought that STFU would have taken an early lead. As it is, its lagging in second place.

Monetary policy should never be decided by the public - the temptation to exploit the economic system for short-term political gain is too great. This is especially a danger in democratic societies.

It is for this reason that the federal reserve is operated as an independent central bank.

Agreed! Another reason to stop the discussion in the forums!

Thank you very much! I needed a good laugh. End stripend threads indeed!

The Pro-Stipend Party will get their wish, but don't come crying
when the L$ is L$2000. In certain circles it is called (Mudflation).

Dear Anti-Stipend RBD.
If stipends are gone, where will new money come from?

For a while, the economy will do fine, yes.. but then the population grows too big, and the money supply becomes less and less (due to sinks), which will induce a massive deflation.

Capitalists are so cute

Reservebank

If you really believe the l$ value is that way headed, then trade for it.

If your crystal ball is as perfect as you believe, then trade, trade, trade and you can't fail but to make millions.

Market volatility is what a day trader needs, not stagnation.

If you have money invested in game then get it out and if you are thinking of investing now, then don't.

I never actually understand what your 'economic' posts are meant to indicate, other than the obvious.

However trading is more than just 'reporting' and I think we can all see the LXchange for ourselves.

If I in my stupidity don't take the benefit of your advice and just keep on playing it my way, then you can trade on the LX everyday against me and people like me and make a fortune.

Acting on your own instincts and graphs is one thing, to give the advice away for free, seems a bit naive. Why not set up a Reservebank tip sheet and sell it, far more profitable, but do the graphs not show this as being very well subscribed?

I trade currency , very limited, I employer creators, I buy, rent and sell land and I sell content. Now with all those little balls in the air, according to the words of wisdom I should be broke and dying on my feet. Funny I'm not, neither are most people.

In RL if your chosen business isn't making it for you, it may be fun for a while berating the rest of the world, but after a while it's time to wakt up and smell the coffee, may be the business model sucks. SL is perhaps the same.

I can trade and make a profit both on SL keeping money in game and by trading the Lxchange. According to your missives, my L$s are becoming worthless and my trading has no hope.

I suggest it's time to listen to the input instead of trying to drown everybody out with output.

All else being equal, I know I will still be making a similar RL ROC if the L$ reaches 2000/1. I also know I will still be makig a similar RL ROC if the L£ trades at 1/1. Simply put, the numerous individuals who just buy L$ to play the game have no great interest in what the L$ rate is, they just want to know they get 'value for lindens' and if they budget US$ 20 a month, that is what they budget, whether the L$ is 1000/1 or 1/1. If you sold content or provided in life product you would see this. As a currency speculator, yes your take may be different, but it is no more valid or important than the creator and content seller who wants to keep the stipend as it keeps revenues flowing and gets people in game, the people who will then buy US$20 a month of lindens and spend it ingame, at any exhange rate.

I guess the answer is, trade currency to cover a position and add an in life activity to draw in the Lindens from SL avatars who play ingame all the time, with a monthly gaming budget.


I play the exchange but work on the inlife development. It seems some of the posters on these threads operate the other way round and that is great. It's perhaps why they have time to post so frequently. I read a thread from someone recently, I don't recall where it was on the forum, who said now the Lxchange is up and running they hardly ever go ingame.

It is a question of perspective as to who is right on the stipend. If you don't worry excessively about the exchange rate, you want the stipend knowing you can make it up on content, land rent, entertainment etc. sales, to ensure new players keep coming in and the revenue still flows, whereas if you are a L$ currency speculator then the desire is to keep a strong linden by reducing money supply, though this is only one of many possible tools and appears to be considered by some to be the only one. As a currency trader, either way is fine, so long as the currency stays volatile and if you are looking to cash out of the game having made millions of lindens then you wnat to a strong linden. If you are like me, new to the game looking to add significant investment, if the TOS ever make sense for it, then I want a linden rate at 1000/1 for now...

So it's perspective not prescriptive, hence these debates go on for ever between the dogmatists.

At present I would like to see the stipend stay, I would like the L$ to fall to below 1000/1. Give me a time when I have made a significant investment ingame and am looking to cash out all my chips, I'll be calling for no stipends, drastic money supply cuts and a very strong linden. That's called perspective.

I don't believe the linden is heading for 1000/1 but I sure wish it was.

Dear Zonax:

The Money Supply should grow based on the GDP of the game,
not the population. If people join and contribute nothing, then why
do we need to increase the amount of money printed?

My solution:

a) Halt all stipends until the money supply begins to feel the
strains of deflation. This will allow the economy to soak up
the current float of L$700/million.

b) Once the money supply and economy balance out, then restart
stipends to increase the money supply, but only in relation to the
relative growth of GDP. If 200,000 new people join and they do
nothing but yak in the forums, we don't need any increase in the
money supply. If those 200,000 folks begin buying land, widgets,
services, etc... then it will be reflected in the GDP and as such
stipends can be handed out accordingly.

Note the Image. We are deep into the Red Bubble.. We need to
get back to normal.

Reserve,
While I agree that your solution might work, the contingency to keep the stipends is enormous and I don't think it will fly. Can you think of a way to balance the sinks and sources without eliminating the stipend?

-Hunter

Yes.. Increase the Sinks to match the inflow of Stipend Dollars.
Thus making the currency growth zero. If Linden Labs dishes out
L$50/million new notes via Stipends in June, then there should be
an equal number of Linden Dollars removed via Sinks. That would
fix the Currency float around L$700/million with minor variations
from that number.

The key would be figure out a way to recoup those stipend dollars
without people feeling milked by the sinks.

Your proposal 'halt all stipends' seems to be totally contrasting what you broadcasted in all your previous posts: 'end stipends'.

Hearing 'end stipends' doesn't sound the same. But also, I wouldn't be happy if my premium stipends were taken away without any form of compensation. Maybe it would be okay if it would float between L$ 300 and L$ 500, but that's even harder to explain to people in a contract.
'Buy Premium now! Get a bit of land and 300 - 500 L$ of stipends, depending on how the market is doing right now'



In theory, this sounds okay, but I don't think it's feasible to do.

But, you might have a point. IF the percentage of premium accounts vs. free accounts decreases, that means the growth of the money influx becomes less than the growth of the population, which is exactly heading toward stabilization (if we suppose other factors stay the same, eg. supply, demand percentages).

Let's say there are 20 000 premiums now and 230 000 free accounts.
If there are 22 000 premiums and 500 000 free accounts, less money comes in (relative to population).

However, there's also the case of land: Linden Labs lives on land rent fees, so the more people have land, the better for them. That means they might be better off pushing people to be premiums, after all...

Complex system.

Uggg. The tool to add new currency should be independant from stipends, just as any payment to premium members needs to be independant from new currency.

Having the two linked is the crux of the problem.

And how do you think adding new currency should work? Should Lindens just sell at L$ 300 / US$?

Then maybe LL should tie the money supply growth to new land.
For every XX amount of land bought, XX amount of new currency is
printed. Making Land a Gold Standard to the value of the L$.

And if stipends are halted, what mechanism do you propose to replace them to allow premium members to have some sort of income?

Either you need to have a "fun" job that will result in payment from wealthy SL residents to those interested in "working," or you'll need a gaming abstration which premium members are "paid" for working while off line as a benefit for the premium fees in such a way that the payments do not dilute the value of the $L.

Keep in mind that many SL residents don't want to work if its work, but they do like to buy stuff.

A Land Gold Standard to the L$ would mean that if
Linden Labs says it will Print L$10,000,000 new dollars
for every 1/Sim Sold at Auction, then whatever the
average value of land becomes the average value of
the Block.

And those new dollars can be divided among the Premium users
in the form of stipends. The payouts will vary, but the people
who pay a premium will receive a premium benefit.

Will I get 500 or more a week guaranteed? If not, you know where you can shove that idea.

MAJOr problem here is that stippend is pretty much almost the only source in the game. If you talk about balancing sources and sinks, it's pretty much talking about modifying stippends, or creating sinks.

Who told you that information?
https://secondlife.com/currency/economy.php

People upgrading to premium get a one time bonus. People approved as Instructors recieve a 500$L payment per class. Up to 2 classes a day which can be 7000$L a week if they DO teach daily. Only limitation is the classes must be educational dealing with one of SLs features and you must have at least 5 people in attendance to submit your class log. There are also still referral bonuses given out if the person you refer upgrades to premium.

So if you know someone thinking of upgrading to premium that has a basic account. Have them INSTEAD of upgrading, sign up as a new account. That way their basic account still gets a 50$L stipend and the new account not only recieves its premium stipend but you get a referral bonus for it.