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An interesting bit of hypocrisy

Kathy Yamamoto
Publisher and Surrealist
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 615
09-15-2005 22:42
If you do not form your own government, the enemy will form one for you.

You have one last chance to block a government formed by those who believe their "investments" give them a louder voice. If you do not create a truly representative body, they will create something else instead.

I have always said I do not want government. But I have always understood that such a vacuum will be filled nonetheless.

Well, the race is on. And you can't win without running the race. They've already given themselves a head start. You'll have to run to catch them.

As I've also said before, I have always intended to place myself as a watchman or opponent to whatever government arrives. But I'd much prefer to observe representation than to have to revolt against tyrants.

Are any of you beginning to see the necessity for action on your own behalf? Is it time to create SOME sort of Representative Body?
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Kathy Yamamoto
Quaker's Sword
Leftist, Liberals & Lunatics
Turtlemoon Publishing and Property
turtlemoon@gmail.com
Gabe Lippmann
"Phone's ringing, Dude."
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 4,219
09-16-2005 09:03
From: Kathy Yamamoto
If you do not form your own government, the enemy will form one for you.


This is the only reason I am paying attention to any of this. I don't want to care about any of this, but my own self interests dictate that I keep a close eye on all you power hogs ;) . Nobody will do it for you.
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
09-16-2005 09:52
Yay!!! It's Kathy!!! *HUGS YOU*!!! :D
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Greene Hornet
Citizen Resident
Join date: 9 May 2005
Posts: 103
Let 'em meet!
09-16-2005 11:49
From: Siggy Romulus
I don't mind folks forming the group, hell form away! its your right.
I don't care what you talk about - talk away! it's your right!..


That being said...

.. Tell me what to do or make decisions for me, and I'll snap my foot off in your arse.

Siggy.



But make sure they PAY us for the privilege of representing OUR interests! I'll take mine in the form of weekly payments inversely proportional to the work they get done on our behalf. Anyone else with me?
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Greene Hornet
Sereine Bard
His Muse
Join date: 26 Jul 2004
Posts: 28
09-16-2005 12:16
From: Enabran Templar
Eh, the only way it's going to bother me is if any single person, who is peaceable and well-behaved, is forbidden entry. Otherwise, meh, if you care about SL enough to meet with others and talk about it, more power to you. Citizenship is a good thing.


If it was, indeed, an unannounced meeting, does it not by its' very nature, preclude and prevent other people interested in attending from attending and thereby participating?
Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
09-16-2005 12:30
To whom it may concern,

I'm writing to convey my absolute dismay about the "Justice Watch Partyrama" debacle that you people sell as a birthday party. Little Billy isn't even talking to me anymore. You should call your birthday entertainment package "Box-o-Disillusionment," or "The Man Behind The Curtain Shows Your Children His Penis," or "People Wearing Capes Debate Politics While Performing Punch & Judy Clasics As your Child Watches Horrified." The other parents and I will soon be serving you with a class action suit to cover the post traumatic stress disorder therapy sessions and deprogramming.

I'm sure your people thought it would be hilarious to teach the children to point at things randomly and scream "Pernicious!" shrilly while jumping up and down. I'll admit I was even amused the first few times Billy did it after the party. However, his bus driver, teachers, piano teacher, soccer coach, random strangers at the grocery store, and the hundreds of pets he's frightened were not amused!

Also, what genius didn't figure out that filling a hundred pie shells full of shaving cream for the "Extra FunTime Pie Fight" would result in several kids needing their stomachs pumped? You even handed out spoons! At one point after a brief visit to the restroom I returned to find the children staring at a spinning sleep wheel while chanting "rent my land." The whole experience was bizarre, frightening, and a travesty of "Justice." I would like a refund in full, plus damages (see attached list) or you'll be hearing from my lawyer.

Sincerely,
C. Midnight

PS. I have no idea what this "Justice Sunday III" event is you conned the children into handing out fliers for, but needless to say I won't be attending!
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Ellie Edo
Registered User
Join date: 13 Mar 2005
Posts: 1,425
What Delicious Irony !
09-16-2005 13:53
From: Sereine Bard
If it was, indeed, an unannounced meeting, does it not by its' very nature, preclude and prevent other people interested in attending from attending and thereby participating?
One more time. I think the problem was in presenting a special-interest lobby group as something else. Nothing wrong, in my opinion, in special-interest lobby groups, honestly described as such. They are inevitable.
The open membership and flowery pseudo-idealistic language set the stage for this misrepresentation, which was then made worse in forum by the postings of slightly naive second-rank organisers who had swallowed the rhetoric, and couldn't see the implications of the inappropriate claims of wide representation which they were making. Going much further than the organisers would have authorised, I think. These naive and exaggerated claims probably exacerbated the huge swell of indignation, leading to the subsequent disaster.

One interesting, and possibly useful outcome is the schism in the "unholy alliance" between the two leaders. And the amusing incident of one of them finding himself, protesting, thrust into the role of representing, to Philip himself no less, another group set up largely to oppose and counterbalance MJW's (ie his own) activities. An opposing group of which (as he himself meticulously pointed out as part of his fruitless attempts to decline such a hugely inappropriate role) he was not even a proper member.

Fact is stranger than fiction, huh ? What a deliciously ironic moment !

Maybe one of SL's greatest such moments, though littlest known. I am resisting the temptation to quote it from the transcript.
April Firefly
Idiosyncratic Poster
Join date: 3 Aug 2004
Posts: 1,253
09-16-2005 14:02
From: Kathy Yamamoto
If you do not form your own government, the enemy will form one for you.

You have one last chance to block a government formed by those who believe their "investments" give them a louder voice. If you do not create a truly representative body, they will create something else instead.

I have always said I do not want government. But I have always understood that such a vacuum will be filled nonetheless.

Well, the race is on. And you can't win without running the race. They've already given themselves a head start. You'll have to run to catch them.

As I've also said before, I have always intended to place myself as a watchman or opponent to whatever government arrives. But I'd much prefer to observe representation than to have to revolt against tyrants.

Are any of you beginning to see the necessity for action on your own behalf? Is it time to create SOME sort of Representative Body?



I agree with you. I am going to be more involved with RAC for this very reason.



For my part, I travel not to go anywhere, but to go. I travel for travel's sake. The great affair is to move.
Robert Louis Stevenson
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The most successful software company in the world does a piss-poor job on all these points. Particularly the first three. Why do you expect Linden Labs to do any better?
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Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
09-16-2005 15:15
I see the party in this thread is still going on.

Those who are involved in any of these groups are busy now being involved in groups to effect such changes as they may wish to see come about.

None of these groups ever intended to speak for all of SL. Or to be a "government." How anyone could expect the residents of SL to stay unorganized rather than forming interest groups (which may or may not benefit everyone) forever is beyond me.

Anyway, if history is any indication, it is not going to go away.

coco
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Kim Anubis
The Magician
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 921
09-17-2005 02:26
From: Kathy Yamamoto
I have always said I do not want government.


Oh. I guess we just hallucinated this, then: /120/21/33961/1.html#post359510

Whatever.
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
09-17-2005 05:40
Actually, what Kathy said was:

From: Kathy Yamamoto
I have always said I do not want government. But I have always understood that such a vacuum will be filled nonetheless.


The full statement does make the context a bit different. :)
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Kim Anubis
The Magician
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 921
09-17-2005 10:27
Pendari, I like you a lot, and I don't like posting even vaguely in opposition to anything you post. On top of that, I have already wasted hours of my life debating Kathy's posts on this subject, six months ago. I took another look at the thread today, in fact, and I know what she said then versus now. I do not buy the excuse presented here, of pre-emptive first strike. That's my opinion, it's quite firm, and it would almost certainly be a waste of time to try to get me to change it.
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
09-17-2005 11:11
From: Kim Anubis
Pendari, I like you a lot, and I don't like posting even vaguely in opposition to anything you post. On top of that, I have already wasted hours of my life debating Kathy's posts on this subject, six months ago. I took another look at the thread today, in fact, and I know what she said then versus now. I do not buy the excuse presented here, of pre-emptive first strike. That's my opinion, it's quite firm, and it would almost certainly be a waste of time to try to get me to change it.



eek! :eek:

No worries! :D We can see her viewpoint differently. Doesn't change the fact I like the both of yas. :)
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Kathy Yamamoto
Publisher and Surrealist
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 615
09-17-2005 23:24
Right. I have indeed proposed various forms of self-government. That fact seems to cause some people to disregard anything I say before they even read it. Let me try to be clear for those who haven't already made up their minds.

No, I do not want government. Yes, I believe that one will create itself no matter what we do. Like many people here, I could simply say, "If you make a government of any sort, I will leave and never come back." But, I've invested way too much for that. I've committed. Either way, I'll be staying.

So, given that a government of some sort will eventually be created by someone, what is the chance that it will be a government that allows people like me - who oppose government simply because it's essential to do so - to have a voice? Pretty slim. I really believe that leaving it up to happy fortune is the best way to disaster.

If you want a group of powerful, elite, corrupt plutocrats making rules for you - or for the Lindens - then stick your heads back in the sand. Go back to threatening to desert any attempt at government. The governmental vacuum will be filled, no matter how you or I feel about it. If you don't make something healthy, then you'll end up with something sick. Despite your personal preference for no government at all - a preference I share - realize there WILL be a power structure. If YOU don't fill the space, someone else will.

If you think it's possible to create something representative, then it's getting to be time to do so. If you believe it's impossible to create anything useful, and you intend to leave if the attempt is made, then go now. Stop getting in the way. And if you do stay and thwart any heartfelt attempts at representation, then at least stop whining about the plutocracy you helped usher in because of your apathy and obsessive mistrust.

Now, since it's clear too many people think I want to be president of something, and I'm not going to be able to contribute anything that might be taken seriously, I'm going to take another break. As I've done for the last few months, I'm going to wait to see what the people decide. If you all manage to avoid any sort of government, I'll be happy to come back and enjoy your utopian anarchy. If you create something honest and representative, I'll be back to help keep it honest. If you lay around and give up your chance at self-rule to those who believe they DESERVE TO RULE YOU, then I'll be glad to stick a thorn in THEIR side every chance I get. Just don't let me hear you whining about how unfair it was that you're being bossed around by rich folks.

And PLEASE don't claim that the government you end up with is the only one you could have had.

Send me some email, if you want to chat.
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Kathy Yamamoto
Quaker's Sword
Leftist, Liberals & Lunatics
Turtlemoon Publishing and Property
turtlemoon@gmail.com
Kim Anubis
The Magician
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 921
09-18-2005 00:54
From: someone
If you want a group of powerful, elite, corrupt plutocrats making rules for you - or for the Lindens - then stick your heads back in the sand. FNORD


This song sounds familiar.
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Siggy Romulus
DILLIGAF
Join date: 22 Sep 2003
Posts: 5,711
09-18-2005 01:02
Space is a vaccuum - and I'm sure from the perspective of a solar system, or a galaxy it looks like things WILL be filled.

Then put it in perspective of the universe... no matter how many little bits and peices form, fly around, burn out, or collide into each other... it doesn't look like it will ever be filled - or need to.

I personally don't think a group will be able to form and stay immune to adgenda, sabotage, infighting, or backbiting drama long enough to have any lasting impact - let alone form a government.

I'm probably alone in this - but I look at it like shooting off my foot with a shotgun, because theres a chance that it will happen one day. I mean my foot is right out there - and theres plenty of shotguns!

Siggy.
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From: Jesse Linden
I, for one, am highly un-helped by this thread
stampshady Grimm
Registered User
Join date: 20 Apr 2003
Posts: 17
Who wants to be the king?
09-25-2005 10:57
Sorry I am late…lol..

I would like to say, if I may, ( regarding the original post by Editorial Hare and debate that has followed) that I think the Lindens did the right thing in humoring Anshe. Let whomever dream as they wish (btw, I thought Anshe was a guy?), but what I read, the Lindens, other than the humoring, were requesting that he get the rest of SL involved and formulate a platform. Do you really think large numbers of people who are escaping RL through SL will want to give up freedom to anyone who believes they are above them or better than them or more involved than the rest of us? So, those of you worried - I beg of you to relax just a bit. I wish to thank you for being concerned and alerting the rest of us of what’s up, but I can’t believe that Anshe could “take over” a group of folks not wishing to be ruled we are much too strong for that. I have faith that LL will not ruin my “escape” or anyone else’s. Their jobs are riding on it, and as for Anshe, they probably feel that LL will be here long after Anshe Chung. Humoring him is a good policy – just as they humor most of us : )
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