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Tringo Bullies

Angelica Black
Registered User
Join date: 14 Apr 2005
Posts: 10
08-08-2005 20:12
I think the problem is that the Tringo-pot is all down to good-will.

Since Tringo is free to play, if no-one donates to the pot, there isn't a pot to play for.

The blackjack comparison isn't quite right. Imagine if blackjack was "donations" to the pot only :) no-one would play because no-one would donate.
The same goes for the McDonalds comparison and so on ... if you haven't paid for your burger .... why grumble when you only get half a burger ?

In general, I would hope that if the person who wins the pot has been playing for free up to that point, that they would donate a fair percentage of their winnings back to the pot ( up to 50% )

HOWEVER .... if they have been donating all through the games, I have no problem about them walking away with 100% of their winnings ... regardless of if the pot is 100$l or 10000$l I will even congratulate them on the way out ( through clenched teeth of course :) )

I don't think there is a way around this. There has to be free-play to keep the crowds up, and tringo is a LOT more fun with a lot of people ( apart from the lag :( )

I think the only thing that would help is if the Tringo-Board announced when people donate to it and how much. Then everyone could see if someone has been helping the pot out all the way through or not.
Shirley Meiji
Moxie Drinker
Join date: 8 Mar 2005
Posts: 165
08-08-2005 22:02
From: Vince Wolfe
I'd be happy to tell the story (names, places, etc.) of this little episode in world, but not in the forums.

That aside, I do want to be clear that I am not painting all tringo places with the same brush. It is happening, and getting worse, but not everywhere.

Hi Vince -

I was only kidding of course, but by "spill the beans," I was referring specifically to your sentence, "I know that there are plenty who run a fun game and don't engage in, or allow, this kind of garbage to start."

I must say though, the bullying problem does extend to SLingo, too. Just this weekend my husband, who just started playing SLingo, got called a "piece of sh!+" and "@ssh*le" by other players who thought his donation after winning wasn't big enough, and the owner/host IMed him to tell him he was "sh!++ing on a tradition."
Shirley Meiji
Moxie Drinker
Join date: 8 Mar 2005
Posts: 165
08-08-2005 22:11
From: Enabran Templar
Hahaha, hold on a second. Playing Tringo is free? So instead of making someone pay some nominal fee for each round to fill the pot, everyone and anyone can play for free?

Good lord. What a phenomenal business plan. This right here is why people say you can't make money hosting events. Even in the simplest terms, no one is even trying.

LOL

I know; in real-life Bingo you have to pay... in fact, you can play as many cards as you like simultaneously as long as you pay for each of them, increasing your chance of winnings. I was surprised to learn the *ingos in SL don't operate the same way.
Travis Lambert
White dog, red collar
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,819
08-08-2005 22:27
<sigh>

I joke a lot with friends that Tringo is "Pure Unadulterated Evil".

Its still a joke, because of course it's not. But there sure seem to be a some evil hosts out there, and not the 'Evil Trivia Question' kind.

My experience has taught me that if you make people feel good, they'll come back. If you want longevity, treat your customers with respect and take care of them like you would a family member.

Not only will you have happy customers, but you'll feel good about what you're doing :)
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Vincent Cinquetti
Happy-go-lucky scamp
Join date: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 134
08-08-2005 22:34
Would the problem be solved if there were no pot at all, but just a friendly game?

Would that stop you playing, though?
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Abashed, the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is.
Vince Wolfe
HC SVNT DRACONES
Join date: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 242
08-08-2005 22:42
Thanks for all the replies! When I first saw this, I just thought it was a temper problem from a person who's tringo hall was on it's way out, but since then I've seen it happen numerous times at places that post many tringo events each day. I just couldn't believe that they would treat players this way!

I won't put up with this garbage! When I see it start, I'm out the door. It's not like it's exactly hard to find a tringo game going on.
Madame Maracas
Not who you think I am...
Join date: 7 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,953
08-08-2005 22:43
Ya know, I sat and played that Tetris like game a few places... don't remember money in or out or if I paid to play, it was comparable to putting a quarter (or 4 sheesh) into a video arcade game for a few minutes fun.

Didnt win money.
Had a great time.
RL/SL a fun game is a fun game.

Yes it would be one less thing for noobs and basic accounts to use to up their coffers, and that'd be sad but goodness gracious! All this bile and Sturm und Drang is hardly worth it.

AR the twits.
Take your winnings and use them as you see fit.
Patronize -ingo parlors that appreciate your good company.
Mute the twits while yer at it, why listen to that trash?
Move on to pleasanter things, SL is for fun not misery.
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Vince Wolfe
HC SVNT DRACONES
Join date: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 242
08-08-2005 22:46
From: Izz Fizz
I was at a game at Ice Dragon's, the mecca of Tringo the other day and a person won a 10,000L pot. Everyone was estatic for the winner. He tipped the host nicely and added 2,500L back into the pot with zero pressure and everyone just had a great,great time for hours and hours. Not all places act like the place you mentioned.


I'm not referring to Ice Dragon. I've spent a fair amount of time there (and rent shop space there) and have NEVER seen anyone associated with Ice Dragon bully their players.
Vince Wolfe
HC SVNT DRACONES
Join date: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 242
08-08-2005 22:51
From: Vincent Cinquetti
Would the problem be solved if there were no pot at all, but just a friendly game?

Would that stop you playing, though?


I don't play all that often to begin with, but the chance to win some lindens is the draw of the game. However, you lose that draw when you start mistreating the people you try and draw in with this sort of treatment. To refer back to your earlier point that owners hope that the players will buy items after being attracted to the tringo event; I don't see the business strategy in upsetting the people you are trying to attract. Do you think that will make them buy more from you?
Vincent Cinquetti
Happy-go-lucky scamp
Join date: 22 Jun 2005
Posts: 134
08-08-2005 23:33
Not me personally, but apart from hosting on the sim I don't have anything to do with the sim nor anything around it nor the owner.

I might not be superhappy if people dont dontate but I'm not going to lunge out at you either ;)

I know when I play TRingo I will put less in the pot as there are some SUPER players whom have the mad skills and I have only won once (altho I stuffed up a last move in one game and it cost me). Sometimes in TRingo I will put in nothing, particularly if it's just 'something to do' while chatting to friends and I don't want to do anything else.
SLingo is more on an even ground as it's just random numbers and there's little skill required besides "try and click on the blue ones first and make rows/columns if you can".
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Canceled my products as there is no interest.



Abashed, the devil stood and felt how awful goodness is.
Hugsy Penguin
Sky Junkie
Join date: 20 Jun 2005
Posts: 851
08-08-2005 23:34
From: Enabran Templar
Hahaha, hold on a second. Playing Tringo is free? So instead of making someone pay some nominal fee for each round to fill the pot, everyone and anyone can play for free?

Yup!

From the Tringo board I was most recently at:

"The game will start by the host putting $100 into the game pot. Players are welcome to also add donations but that's completely optional. If you wish to add to the pot, just right-click the scoreboard and choose Pay from the pie menu. When the game is over, the player with the highest score will win the pot. In the case of a draw, the pot is split."

Emphasis mine.

From: Enabran Templar
Good lord. What a phenomenal business plan. This right here is why people say you can't make money hosting events. Even in the simplest terms, no one is even trying.

If you let people play for free, expect people to play for free.

From: Angelica Black
I think the problem is that the Tringo-pot is all down to good-will.

I agree. Clearly define the rules of payment and you can reduce much (unfortunately not all) of this drama.

From: Vincent Cinquetti
Would the problem be solved if there were no pot at all, but just a friendly game?

Would that stop you playing, though?


A friendly game would be nice to be able to hone your skills, but I think most people would want to play for lindens. I think the answer *might* be that you make a set payment per player per game and define X% for the winner and Y% for the host.

Clearly define everything. Eliminate 10 different peoples ideas of 10 different versions of good Tringo (and etc...) etiquette.

HP
Alexa Hope
Registered User
Join date: 8 Dec 2004
Posts: 670
08-09-2005 02:51
If I recall correctly Kermitt, the creator of tringo did modify the game to enable the hosts to charge an amount per game. I am guessing that because the hosts are desperate for as many people playing as possible, and there is so much competition, they don't use this function.

As to the original post, that host should definitely have been ARed. I suppose the answer is not to go back and if enough people do the same, their number of players will shrink drastically to the point where they stop hosting tringo. There are plenty of others to go to.

I play a couple of times a month and always go where I know the host is a decent one. There are some who are bad hosts and I avoid them like the plague.

Alexa
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Hiroland resident
Sensual Casanova
Spoiled Brat
Join date: 28 Feb 2004
Posts: 4,807
08-09-2005 02:55
If you are being bullied or feel mistreated by a host, you may want to contact the land owner, often times they are unaware of the issue...
Catherine Cotton
Tis Elfin
Join date: 2 Apr 2003
Posts: 3,001
08-09-2005 05:38
From: Vince Wolfe
As someone who doesn't really participate in the gaming/gambling activities in SL, I have noticed a relatively new trend that appears to be specific to places that sponser numerous tringo events. I have noticed that if someone wins a decent jackpot that they are pressured to give back a large portion of their winnings or face ridicule and scorn by the landowners, hosts, and/or their "friends."

One would think that the term "winnings" implied that you had "won" something. If you have truly "won" a jackpot, then it is by definition....yours. You have absolutely ZERO responsibility to provide any welfare whatsoever to the tringo business owner. I know that many people do contribute back to the pot, after winning, and I agree that it does make the game fun to have a nicer pot. But no one should be bullied for giving away enough of THEIR money.

I know that I am by no means an "oldbie," but I remember when bingo was the big game draw and seeing people win larger pots. There was no pressure from the landowners to give 1/2 or 1/3 back for the next pot. There were no friends of the owner calling people a "cheap c*nt." There were people who, even if they were disappointed they didn't win, would congratulate the winner and try again next time.

I used to play bingo and remember how fun it was to win a good sized pot (especially as a basic account) so that I would have some money to buy things with. I know that the landowners who engage in this practice (or allow it go on), run tringo to try and make their places popular. It would seem to me that abusing your customers isn't exactly going to make you, or your place, popular at all. People don't want to be treated like this and will go elsewhere. I know that frustration can be a natural response when you have put alot of real $$ into SL, trying to make your gaming place extremely popular, and then find that:

A) Your place is slipping in popularity

B) You have to put in more real $$ to have large pots in order to compete for players

C) People are contributing a reasonable amount, but not enough for to support your advertisments of HUGE pots

Quite frankly, none of these things are the players' fault. People contribute what they can and are willing to. If you have bought into this "we must have HUGE pots like tringo hall ABC in order to compete" mentality, then you knew what you were getting into before you started.

Either way, those who do this are their own worst enemy and, most likely, the cause of their own business demise.



I dont put huge amounts of us$ in the pots on Faded Reality Island, if ppl enjoy the lag free games thats great. If they would rather play on a laggy sim where they miss pieces or rounds more power to them. I don't ask my hosts to put back anything if they win. We do not pressure ppl to put back any winnings. I myself always put back min. 50% if I win usualy tho I just roll it over to the next round. Games are suppose to be fun. If ppl don't appreciate these efforts then I will go onto a different project. I do not see the point of sucking the fun out anything in SL. By the same token if ppl want to play for 60L$ a round we let them. Also we do not expect tips, but that would be a nice gesture since they are not making big money to host. If my hosts are not having fun I'm not happy it's not like we are getting rich or even breaking even on our games. We are however giving ppl an enviorment where they can acturaly play the games that are created in SL.
Cat/Mar
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Catherine Cotton
Tis Elfin
Join date: 2 Apr 2003
Posts: 3,001
08-09-2005 05:49
From: Alexa Hope
If I recall correctly Kermitt, the creator of tringo did modify the game to enable the hosts to charge an amount per game. I am guessing that because the hosts are desperate for as many people playing as possible, and there is so much competition, they don't use this function.

As to the original post, that host should definitely have been ARed. I suppose the answer is not to go back and if enough people do the same, their number of players will shrink drastically to the point where they stop hosting tringo. There are plenty of others to go to.

I play a couple of times a month and always go where I know the host is a decent one. There are some who are bad hosts and I avoid them like the plague.

Alexa



Correct Alexa! We tried charging for cards at tringo park a few times. Ppl just went to where there were free cards. As short lived as it was it was realy nice not having to beg for tips or pots. Now I pay my hosts a set price if they make tips thats great but we however do not beg for anything. Donations to Martin Magpie are always greatly appreciated to off set the 195. per month cost of running the Faded Reality Gamers sim. BUT they are not mandatory. If this project fails well, I just go onto to something else like my 15k in prims dream home lol.

Cat/Mar
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Vince Wolfe
HC SVNT DRACONES
Join date: 10 Dec 2004
Posts: 242
08-09-2005 10:21
When I posted this thread I didn't mean hosts announcing that the pot is open and encouraging people to contribute. A host saying "Come on, let's get the pot up to $XXX" is part of what these hosts do. What I was specifically referring to was verbal attacks on people who win who and haven't given back half their winnings. If someone decides to contribute a large portion back...great! If they decide not to...Congrats on the win! Either way the money now belongs to them. It is entirely their choice as whether or not the want to contribute. This is the way this works and swearing at the winner, harassing them, or banning a winner is a sure way to see your events poorly attended in the future.
ZsuZsanna Raven
~:+: Supah Kitteh :+:~
Join date: 19 Dec 2004
Posts: 2,361
08-09-2005 10:32
From: Vincent Cinquetti
Nobody makes any money from -ingo games. In fact, the owner pays money into the pot to encourage others. It's mainly for the dwell and to get people to their sim in the hope they might look at other things nearby and maybe buy from a shop.

The owner pays the hosts to host the games. The owner pays the host a certain amount to put in the pot.
The players put what they want into the pot and win the owner's money plus other player's money.

-ingo games are a money sink for owners.



Hmm and here I always thought dwell created $L weekly. Guess they changed that when I wasn't paying attention...
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Goyan Luchador
Carbon Based Humanoid
Join date: 23 May 2004
Posts: 218
08-09-2005 10:56
I don't really see what is so hard about this one. Just laugh loudly, (MOO HOOO HAWWW HAWWWW), take all your winnings and go somewhere else. Don't put squat back into this jerks kitty.
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Nevyn Pascal
Gadget Maker
Join date: 10 Jun 2005
Posts: 8
08-09-2005 11:42
I had a similar experience. I was brand new to SL -- had been around a couple of weeks. I had heard of tringo, tried playing it a couple of times. Figured I would try it again, as it *is* kind of fun.

So I went to this event, I played 3 or 4 games, contributed a little each time. I really didn't have much money to speak of being new. My contributions were tiny, but to me they were slowly, but noticably dropping my balance without any obvious means of replenishing.

I got lucky and won a game for around $800. I was really excited. That more than doubled my balance. I put back around $100 and to me that felt like quite a lot compared to my total balance and how much I had been putting in.

After a couple of minutes I got an IM from some guy calling me a cheap ass. Way to treat new players. I told him how much I put back in, he just repeatedly called me a cheap ass. I don't know what he felt would have been "enough" to break past the cheap-ass barrier. As a noob, I really felt like I was putting back some of my winnings. They aren't really "winnings" if people are going to expect you to put it all back into the pot.

I have not played Tringo since. That completely ruined the experience of the game and the fun of winning for me. I didn't even stay for the game I donated to. Had the idiot just kept his mouth shut, I probably would have continued to play and continued to contribute to pots, making my contribution much higher over time. After his souring, I took what I had and left.

It is kind of sad to see this kind of thing happens regularly. I'm sure I'm not the only one who no longer plays after an experience like that.
Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
08-09-2005 14:08
How would it work out if people got $500 for a Tringo event, like used to be, and five games were played for $100 each, or ten for $50 each?

coco
Nyx Divine
never say never!
Join date: 11 Dec 2004
Posts: 1,052
08-09-2005 15:06
Nevvn....PLEASE don't let one assh*le spoil the game for U. There are MANY great tringo places, hosts and people to play at and with. I will bet U a shiny new $L that the experience that U just described was instigated by the same person I had dealings w/. It has his stink all over it.

I know SL is a big place w/ many AV's but since this forum post the IM's have been heavy inworld and 1 or 2 names keep comming up.

Oh and in the event of my demise please find the #24 locker at the SL bus station w/ all the pertinent info enclosed. I've been informed he was a 'bomber' whatever the hell that means, but I can use my imagination.
Foulcault Mechanique
Father Cheesemonkey
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 557
08-09-2005 15:20
From: Nyx Divine
Oh and in the event of my demise please find the #24 locker at the SL bus station w/ all the pertinent info enclosed. I've been informed he was a 'bomber' whatever the hell that means, but I can use my imagination.


I think that means he goes to the bathroom and then...well you get the idea...beware if you see a porta potty rezzed near ya.
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From: Jeska Linden
I'm moving this over to Off-Topic for further Pez ruminations.
Jillian Callahan
Rotary-winged Neko Girl
Join date: 24 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,766
08-09-2005 15:39
From: Cocoanut Koala
How would it work out if people got $500 for a Tringo event, like used to be, and five games were played for $100 each, or ten for $50 each?

coco
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Roberta Dalek
Probably trouble
Join date: 21 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,174
08-09-2005 17:32
From: ZsuZsanna Raven
Hmm and here I always thought dwell created $L weekly. Guess they changed that when I wasn't paying attention...


Dwell/traffic is a pittance. They spend much more getting the dwell than they get back.

SL players expect free tringo. If one place charges then the players will go to the free one.

I've not seen players get abused for not donating 50%+ back to the pot. I've seen a host win at tringo and not give *anything* back which I thought was a bit off. People stopped donating to the pot after that as she was clearly better than we were anyway.

I'm guessing that the places that abuse players make a big thing about having large pots - which they only get by recycling money ;)
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Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
08-09-2005 18:32
I don't understand your chart, Jillian.

coco

Edited to add: Oh, you just mean it would cause inflation.

I don't much care about that right now; I'm wanting to know if the $500 scenario would ensure enough games for the host, and if everybody would be happy if ALL you could possibly win is $100 (or $50) a game.

I think it would be kind of neat.

coco
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