The new SL with lower ratings and stipend

In my opinion the statement "the game sucks now if you're poor in real life" is simply untrue. Firstly because it equates fun with posessing or spending money, secondly because it implies that everything available in SL to a Basic Account holder "sucks", and thirdly because it implies the path to fun in SL now requires one to purchase L$ or land tier or both. This also ignores the fact that one cannot be all that poor and still afford an SL-capable computer and broadband internet.

Lordfly's math stands. For a few dollars per month, or for the cost of a couple DVD's, or the cost of a criminally cheap date, anyone, even a Basic Account holder, can have more L$ than I make in a year. Will it bring them more fun than I can have without paying anything into either LL's or the GOM's pockets? That depends on them, which begs the subjective question, "why aren't you having fun in SL?"

Actually, Selador, Catherine's strongest gloom and doom predictions about the commercialization of SL were about RL commerce coming into SL. Coke, McDonalds, etc.. buying up a sim and marketing to us. She was always extremely bothered by the use of Fizik Baskervilles RL marketing company intermixed with SL. Her predictions did not come true. Her complaints about money came much later, while at the same time selling products herself and having bought and sold land and yet complaining about selling products and land. It kind of dilutes the message if you are complicit in the very thing you are rallying against (or self defeating at least). It is not a criticism of Catherine, but you are attributing some prescience on her part that just is incorrect.

Catherine still has a penchant for turning a thread into a flame war, something she is not innocent in - she has even acknowledged that. While there are certainly people who will stab at her every comment (yes you, Lordfly), she gives as good as she gets at this point. Her last departure from the forums was the result of months of a cat and mouse game of rantings in the forums combined with some odd behavior inworld. I love Catherine to death, but the forums are very stressful on her and she does not play well in them, which has always made me sad to see even as she has frustrated me.

Chip,

Very well said - while there are certainly some elements of the winner takes all mentality that crowds the developer incentives and land market, let them have at it. I enjoy SL more than ever, and it has nothing to do with any economic success I have in world (I was spending just as much money before I opened a single store).

I am frustrated at the lack of progress in SL on some technological fronts, but in terms of money having ruined SL, I have to say that on the contrary, it has caused it to flourish. It amazes me the quality of stuff that exists in SL right now. Do I think prices are out of control in some areas? Yes, I think it is ridiculous to charge $2000L for, well, anything in SL, let alone more than that. Even so, there is a market there, so more power to those who can convince someone to pay whatever price they set. That is the beauty of SL, you can give your stuff away for free (or have others do it for you lol), or make a fortune if that is what you want to do.

SL will change a thousand times over as it continues to grow. La Vie Deuxième Est Morte! Vive La Vie Deuxième!

Hi there I admit it, I'm fairly new-ish and maybe I don't "get it" but I've yet to figure out why folks complain about lower stipend/bonus.
When I signed up for my account it was fairly straight forward. Basic account $50L for the week if I logged in. Or $500L/week no matter what for a premium account. There was no other promise of funds.
Then I logged in and low and behold there was the rating bonus. Hurray...nifty neato...and stuff. Yeah it's gone now. Don't get me wrong, I miss the free money too, I shop a lot less. However, we are still getting exactly the stipend we signed up for. Or rather I am getting what I signed up for.
No one is being "forced to attend events or make stuff to sell" that I can see. In Second Life, other than for "wants" there really is no "need" for money. We don't need money to survive, to eat, to buy things to keep our avies from dying.
Just like in real life if our "wants" exceed our means we either have to live within our budgets or find other sources for obtaining money. Why should it be any different here?
As long as we continue to get the stipend we signed up for...why is there an issue?

Sunshine
(one of the clueless)

very nicely said

I have posted elsewhere on this, but a re-read of this thread, particularly the entry from Sunshine Clio (I am a newbie too), brought a rush of sense to my head (I hope!). Thank You Sunshine!

I am premium, a) for the stipend, and b) because the money I pay is more than worth it.

I agree with some that SL CAN BE the most expensive Online world ever, but it isn't in itself, I could easily have stayed basic. The world in all its features is the same...

I have also spent money buying Linden, because I Just Could Not Do Without something or other. My choice! And before I did that, I thought about whether it was worth it for me or not. And it was, and still is... That is a dimension which SL has, which is very interesting... But it is a feature, I do NOT have to go into an economic world here. The AMAZING thing for me is not, that some ppl would rather have more money (what IS enough money?) but that there ARE "Millionaires" here! I saw a land price yesterday of 160,00 Linden... And I am sure, it WILL get sold!

A world where you can get to be a millionaire by basically following the normal methods of getting rich! Wow! That is a GREAT simulation! That this divides the world into have nots and haves is obvious. But the poor are not poor because of the rich; the rich are rich because they worked for it. I am poor because I am a spender If I spent the time, and took the financial losses, I could learn to speculate (buy and sell, basically) on property as well, and become rich.. But it may, with my lack of talent and basic laziness, cost me a LOT more than I am prepared to put up in order to succeed.

So I live "on the state"... The exchange rate argument shows I am getting a Free Ride, currency wise... But I pay for being here, not for the Linden I get... I have played other online games that DIDN'T pay me any internal money... Obviously, these games are therefore FAR more expensive than SL!

I Love SL! It is so limitless! I can see why ppl get het up in Forums - You Can Live Here, I mean LIVE! And that for me is the greatest compliment an Online World can have...

One thing that should be realized is that stipends will eventually go away. They will be scrapped, eventually - but haven't yet, until the economy is deemed sustaining. However that may be measured, I don't know.

Doesn't change what I do, so I really can't say it impacts me at all. I guess I wasn't in SL for the bucks, and it doesn't bug me that profit is made, either.

I won't talk about specific personalities, since it is way beyond dated and boring, but it certainly didn't help any. I'd like to believe SL is self-healing, and the monopolists and extremists will eventually cancel each other out, or just leave out of boredom/frustration.

It all works out in the end.

I think making something odd, and random that you can attach to your head, that spins and amuses people is reward in itself. I think meeting people in a virtual world who feel you can call your "friends" is priceless. And things like this are free in SL.

i have a student debt of 50 000 dollars. i don't have a job. i made 4000 USD worth in 5 months casually selling furniture, trading land, and begging in the welcome area.

people don't need L$ to play sl. you only need L$ if you want to buy stuff. but you can make stuff instead of buying it. why should anyone be forced to give me or other poor free stuff. some people charge for stuff. some people give stuff for free or very little. some people do both. this system creates a choice for buyers and sellers, creators and consumers.

your post is rubbish. i voted for the NDP. i am against big international corporations. i'm for social medicare. i'm for social welfare. i hugs trees. i support no smoking bylaws. i support subsidized tuitions. i support free daycares for young families. i am not your creepy capitalist regime.

i do not support the people demanding other peoples labour and content for free. i do not support your creepy moocher loafer regime.

you need to take that pent up sense of injustice and put it to better use. this is a fake world of fantasies. go out there and protest for real change to benefit poor people. really poor people do not play sl! they run around collecting cans to buy a muffin and die of hypothermie in late january. go fight the good fight. i will donate some of my linden dollars if you start a charity in world.

who the hell votes NDP?

Earn a degree without going to school

Be physically fit without working out

Lose weight without going on a diet

Lose that nasty cough without quitting smoking

Get a check without going to work

Become wealthy without working, saving or investing

Get land, clothes and toys in SL without spending a dime



Welcome to the gimme, gimme, gimme society of the 21st century.



You gotta pay if you want to play!

Buy one less joint a week - buy tons of stuff in SL!

Skip McDonald's once a week - lose some weight, save your heart and buy tons of stuff in SL!

Keep a log and see the amount of dough you are spending on other S**T. Make a decision on what is more important to you, adjust and quit whinning!

- T -

people who want minority goverment.

My 2 cents. I have been on a $10 lifetime account since day one. As it happens, a friend of mine paid that 10 dollars. But by designing things and staying productive I have plenty of money. So to be honest I am not entirely sure what RL income has to do with your spending potential in SL unless you are trying to say "I want to be unproductive and socialize...but I want to have all this cool stuff people are working hard to produce too."

You think you know a person then you find out they voted NDP.

amen, sister

I may be confused here, cause I don't get out much, but didn't this change mostly effect people who were gaming the system anyway? So that the Lindens are really just correcting an unintended manipulation, rather than going back on a promise? If I'm off base, I'd actually like to know.

Your Right Cadroe but by the looks of it and how people are bitching about it you wouldnt know who was or wasnt manipulating it...hehe.


Shadow

Dunno I stopped caring about stipends and ratings when they abolished land taxes and prim rez fees..

At that time having some L$ in the kitty had a real effect on me and what I did - not having enough could having to tear down part of my build in order to make something, or return land (what a concept!) to get some work done.

But nowadays - it doesn't really worry me that much. I only checked out my ratings etc the other day because someone asked how they dropped.
Of course I couldn't tell them if they had, because I hadn't checked them for 4 months before the change either

Siggy.

Lordfly,

<<Hey, I resemble that remark. >>

Now I didn't mention a single name, did I?

Cristiano,

<<Actually, Selador, Catherine's strongest gloom and doom predictions about the commercialization of SL were about RL commerce coming into SL. Coke, McDonalds, etc.. buying up a sim and marketing to us. She was always extremely bothered by the use of Fizik Baskervilles RL marketing company intermixed with SL. Her predictions did not come true.>>

Yes, you are quite right in that Catherine was concerned with the issue of rl commerce coming into sl. But at that time that was the only aspect of commercialism that existed in our world.

So far as I am concerned, although her specific fear did not (yet) materialise, she was the only one out of all of us who sensed that something different was coming that would change the character of sl, and for that she received nothing but abuse.

I know that her reactions in the forums were often extreme. But I have recently realised that many of the people who were (and still are) abusing her (and I know you had your strong disagreements with her but you were never among that number) are actually incapable of telling the difference between someone who has passionate opinions and someone who is motivated by malice. And I find that genuinely sad.

first they take our money then they take what other people paid for us to have ppl have to pay 25l$ to rate us and then the lindens are just going to take that away too... where is it there place to take something they didnt give... what do they think will happen if they keep making these stupid changes to the game ppl are getting upset and leaving. if much more is taken sl is ganna be as bad as there.com with just as few players....

There's just as many new arrivals today as there was a month ago.

Rates now mean something.

The linden dollar is going strong.

Looks like everything's fine to me, if not better than before.