The unofficial new permissions system discussion thread...

So what happens to the Hour long post that I wrote previously that was just posted this morning on the Blog?

That information that was on that blog was pertinent to this discussion here as a lot of people responded there but dont want to have to duplicate the information here.

<<shakes head and wanders off to lunch>>>

Shadow

LOL Sorry Bored as all get out waiting for the shop to get finished with my car.

Cory's blog post had 160 comments last time I looked. It is a crying shame that the discussion was vaporized. I understand wanting to have it in a forum, but dang, erasing the past just seems so counter-blog. Dude should just disable comments if it's going to be like that.

Cory, you da man

The good one, not the one that's always keepin me down

Thoughts on version 2 of the permission plan here: /20/fd/25069/1.html#post238772

Ok, I haven't bothered reading the rest of this thread, so i'm just gonna state my opinion. Otherwise, if I do read the rest of it, I'll probably turn into a real grouch... In its current implementation, I don't like where its going. Wrappers, mod versus nomod, copy and no copy and all this baloney.

1/ The rights are being taken away from the creators and given to the users. Simple.

2/ I like my copyrights. NoMod/NoCopy/Trans is what I use and like. Simple.

Now, ok, that's pretty blunt, but here's why I'm so bothered by this. I create objects that I sell in world for a very cheap price. I do this to reclaim the expenses I incurred to create said objects. Now, before all the short-sighted people say "WHAT EXPENSES?", let me add the following saying "Time is money".

I am paid to professionally develop software on a daily basis in RL. Now in SL, I've spend countless hours creating stuff for other people to enjoy. Further to that, I spend countless hours answering inquiries, helping and supporting said products as well.

Under the current regime of permissions, I sell my objects for $25-$150 per item. It price it so I make back a reasonable amount, and its also affordable for my customers. To make my money, I depend on the fact that some of my bigger customers will require 10-20 of my objects. Now at $100 per item, thats fetched me a measily $2000.

Under this wrapper BS for the (ahem) "Full-Copyright", I now sell that light for $100, they break the wrapper, and can make 19 extra copies! Yay, I just lost $1900 of income. Tres un-cool. Further to that, the user receives full mod!

Now, usually I wouldn't mind full mod, but some of my objects have built a fairly big reputation for my products. Furthermore, I also have my own branding and look applied to them. So if someone does a piss-poor job of modding an object to their needs, guess who enjoys the damage to their product branding. Yep, you guessed it, me, not the modder.

Mind you, I have to admit, for some of my products, yes, the wrapper idea is cool, and I'd be the first in line to enable it. Just it doesn't fit all my creations too well.

So, after all my ranting and raving, my two cents on it all, make the wrapper optional. If I don't want it, I don't use it. Otherwise, if this is forced apon me, I've got three big options, raise my prices by ten fold, stop selling them, or force people to lease them from me. None of these options are ones I want to exercise. Further to that, I would not introduce any new content for people to purchase from unless I specifically wanted to share it under public domain.

So, Cory, you, Phil and the LL crew should probably take a deep breath, pop a rittalen tablet or two, and examine this one closely. While it really looks cool and may stimulate change in game, its even more scarey than the 1.2 and "You own you're rights to the objects in game". Heck, the rate of inflation most probably is going to skyrocket in game, I know I'd be the first jacking my prices to $1000 per object. Everyone, buy while you can, cuz things are gonna get interesting...

Its harsh, but its my own opinion. While many may feel this is a great step forward, they are correct, for the customer, not for the vendor and creators. Cory, CC is cool, and so is PD, but leave those of us who want the old way a way to live happily. Trust me on this one, you feel you're going to cause innovation in game, I disagree, you're going to send a bunch of us "creators" into hiding.

Cory, the first rev had me outraged. I was seriously going to stop selling and offer direct only leasing of my objects to compensate. But after reading the second rev of the permissions plan, you got a solid supporter here! YAY! Cory, you rock dude!

This is why we're posting this early and why I'm glad that everyone has been so engaged.

Ok I read it but Cory what about the Skin thing that Chip and I have to deal with I know it was mentiond that you were looking into additional layers for skins but. Is that confirmed can it be done and in addition will it go in place before the permissions changes?

Reason I asked even with the " overlay " mentioned will that be enough to stop texture thieft. Currently all it takes is a UUID key to scarf someones texture to another object. If a person has the UUID of a texture and a script to call it and display it on a face Texture copying will not stop cause then it would just be a matter of Calling the texture and then zooming in and Taking a CTRL+Printscreen and wala some minor manipulations in PS or PSP and you have a viable "Copied" texture. I dont do this but it has been done to me thus how I know of the situtuation.

Shadow

UUID obfiscation is somewhat separate from permissions but is currently being discussed. It's probably at least t as far out as permissions.

Separate layers will be one of the topics discussed as we work on the next verisons of the avatar renderer. That design work will be starting this week, so that feature will definitely be in the design.

Bravo on the second draft. It gets a big thumbs up from me. Thanks for being so responsive.

Kex, the problem with your idea is that it still permits trans in pretty much all cases. I realize that you believe that posession == ownership == transferability, but the ONLY way my firefly objects even partially work is with nomod/copy/notrans. Otherwise people would have to buy them by the dozens at nomod/nocopy/notrans, under your "lease" thing. (I'm guessing the same is true for vehicles, since they're so easily lost.)