Is U.S. Becoming Hostile to Science?

So do we in the USA Eggy. It's called West Virginia.

That depends on the particular family of style one adheres to. Some styles call for the punctuation to be inside; some, for the punctuation to be outside.

I point this out due only partially to my own tenacious grammar-mongering; also because, having not read the first page of this thread, I didn't realize that my post w/r/t the whole tow/toe confusion was redundant to that which was already pointed out by Ulrika. And so I wanted to perform this service in her defense, as it were, in lieu of owing her the proverbial Coke.

I mean, hell, I only just yesterday got off her List. And the bruises have yet to fade to where I can wear that two-piece again.

Parts of it, perhaps; I won't deny if you go up into the hills from where I grew up you don't have to go far to find snake-handling churches.

On the other hand, WV has a truly surprising amount of tech around for such a poor state.

Being half West Virginian myself I have heard many terrifying tales about the witches and demons up in them hollers and I wouldn't go up there if my life depended on it.

Yeah, it's just the tech that DOES get adopted is interesting.

Did you know WV had (and probably still does) one of the the highest per-capita use of the Caller ID function in the US? For that matter, I recall having a cable modem in the relatively small city of Huntington waaaay before several larger markets...

This is true, to an extent. I usually adhere to the style put forth in the Chicago Manual of Style, a widely accepted source.

I was perusing several websites devoted to grammar and found varied opinions on this subject; however, to the best of my knowledge and research, the prevailing and conventional line of thought is such that "Closing quotation marks appear after commas and periods, before colons, semi-colons and question marks."

Also noted on this particular site is the following comment, which I find to be both humorous and true: "... it is a fact that very many people have been taught the conventional view and adhere to it rigorously. Many of these people occupy influential positions ‹ [sic] for example, quite a few of them are copy-editors for major publishers. Consequently, if you try to adhere to the logical view, you are likely to encounter a good deal of resistance. -- You may follow your own preference in this matter, so long as you are consistent. If you opt for logical punctuation, you will have the satisfaction of knowing that you are on the side of the angels, but you should also expect some grim opposition from the other side."

(Consider me grimly opposed to periods placed outside quotation marks, respectfully, of course. )

I quite agree.

I just didn't want that to get in the way of my sycophantic favor-currying with the Mistress of Neualtenburg, dontcha know ...

Oh, wait --- this isn't an IM?

Oh, my stars and little fishes!

Anyone else here think that maybe, just maybe, high school students ought to be taught to think for themselves, decide for themselves, explore, research and find things out for themselves? How to take data such as evolution theories, creationist rants, political messages, and critically evaluate them?

Making sure students know the "right" authoritative message is no substitute for that, no matter who is pushing the message.

If these folks mentioned in the first article want to really make a difference, and improve the numbers of kids coming into scientific studies and professions, they're going to have to dig much deeper than simply worrying about whether they believe in Darwinism or not.

I confess that I haven't read all of the posts here but it is every American's right to believe in whatever they want. They don't have to believe in Darwanism. They can choose to believe that the earth is flat and the world is only 4,000 years old.

It's a great country that allows it citizens to stand up and be as stupid as they dare and to be proud of it too!

Europe is dead. Face the facts. The EU can't even decide on a universal cheese.

All the action is in Asia. They're the next powerhouse.

No, we must defend them from the terrorists. We must support the free market and be on guard against our enemies who hate freedom.

Terrorists have many psychological tricks they can pull and if we let our children think for themselves, they would probably be ensnared by these lies.

We must continue bringing freedom to the Iraqi people so they can resist the Imps of Satan and be part of the world market. And if nothing else, because damnit, my SUV needs cheap gas.

The only thing worse than a terrorist is an SUV owner.

~Ulrika~

I voted yes, despite being in the UK. The intelligent design thing has been big in the scientific media; particularly the Dover case and Bush's implicit endorsement. But I would have said "more hostile to science" in the poll question.

It's weird because the US government say GM is fine (it's a technology and makes money) but no to stem cell research (it kills babies, but could eliminate many brain rotting diseases). They approve research into breeding human genes into animals for convenient transplant organs, but try to deny global warming which could wipe out millions of people, including Americans.

But I'd say it is not just the US.

Stop worrying about SUVs and oil usage. The free market will automatically correct these issues. There's nothing wrong with SUVs.

That's right, because we all know the true intellectuals in this country (the USA) don't drive those satanic pollution makers (unless you live in California, and then you have the full pardon of the Govenator)!

Start the revolt now! Everyone burn their bra's, err, I mean cars today! We cannot let this oppression go on any longer!

And, while we're are at it, lets take the owners of those horrid things and line them up in the street and shoot them as an example!

Wait, lets go further, lets shoot those that sold them those dinosaur consumers.

Come to think of it, lets go after the folks that made those things.

Oh, I'm sorry, lets go after those that designed them.

Wait, wait, wait, I'm sorry, lets go after the ones who taught those designers to open ther minds and design things properly. You know, the free thinkers!

Well crap, how did that happen. I think we just killed all of us elitists. Dang it.

Well, maybe since we are the ones with all the money we can leave those stupid SUV owners alone for a little while until we figure this one out...

This is one of those things which is purely a matter of style rather than of grammar. I do believe there is a difference between American and British convention in this regard, but for the life of me, can't remember which country prefers which convention.

I follow a more logical path by punctuating according to sense. If what is in the quotation marks is a full sentence I put the full stop inside the inverted commas, if it is only a phrase, the full stop goes outside.

[/PEDANTRY]

On target so far, now follow the implications for the US.

Yes. Its sad.

But maybe he was quoting someone else, himself.

"100 years from now we'll all be supressed events in a Chinese history book."

~ Bruce Sterling




But maybe he was quoting someone else, himself.

iunno, I just think creationism sounds way more fun than "evilutionism".. We want better soldiers anyway not smarter children.. O.O......

I so agree. The problem is the evolutionists want kids to accept their doctrine without question. Kids should question everything.

The real failing with science education is that it isn't teaching critical thinking. In most schools, science is memorizing facts to spit back on a test. Children are being taught that science is "learning what the experts tell us". Its no wonder that people think that creationism is equally valid, the "experts" tell them it is.

Quite right. I want my kids to be able to decide that Intelligent Design is a load of rubbish completely off their own backs.

I'm sorry but I'll say it again...

I'm slightly worried that my child will grow up thinking he's living on a 6000 year-old spinning disc, with the universe rotating around it, and God pushing down on him to stop him falling off.

My biggest fear is that they won't be able to tell the difference between what is religious belief and what is science.

If all four Creationist theories are allowed to enter the classroom then that's what their text-books will suggest. I'd hate to try and explain to them that we're not all inbred descendents of two humans.

Although I'm an avid fan of free thinking, I think you guys have thunk too much. Religious opinions should be kept the the Religious Education room and stay well away from Science.

The Department of Education should be abolished and every parent and child should seek the education they desire.

Additionally, we should all remember that we can study and learn whatever we want. We don't need a government to tell us what is worthwhile.

Too many complain about the government but forget that they are not enslaved by that government. In the US we have some basic rules about what you cannot do, but there are no rules about what you MUST do (other than pay taxes).