Heh, I've known people that say "I'm not buying a car to advertise your dealership, either discount X amount or remove your decal".
thats me, that is. although actually, I'd rather they remove the decal than gimme a discount.
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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02-02-2006 04:06
thats me, that is. although actually, I'd rather they remove the decal than gimme a discount. |
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Felix Uritsky
Prime Minister of Lupinia
Join date: 15 Dec 2004
Posts: 267
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02-02-2006 07:07
thats me, that is. although actually, I'd rather they remove the decal than gimme a discount. A few years ago, I bought a '97 Acura Integra used from a new-car dealer (someone had traded it on a Celica the week before). They were asking $12k, mostly because they were the only dealer in town with an Integra on the lot, though it was in absolute perfect condition. The Bluebook value was $9k at the time, I believe. I drove away with it for $7k, after getting a friend to pretend to be interested in a brand-new 4 Runner (that trick works great, Neehai, glad you played it well!) When they pulled it around, after I'd paid for it and everything, I removed their stupid license plate frames right in front of the dealership, and handed them to the salesman, saying "I believe you forgot these, I don't want 'em". I don't think I've ever seen anyone so relieved to see me leave their presence  Buying my Land Rover was a far different experience. I was looking for a winter vehicle, and had been looking at Jeeps, but I saw this '95 Discovery on a used car dealer's lot and had to take a look. The truck looked great, and while checking it out I was making small talk with the salesman (it's a rural thing), and mentioned I was a computer technician. He said he was having severe problems with his computer, and I didn't have any other tech support appointments that day, so I went right in and cleaned up a nasty spyware infection on his machine. After I finished, he offered me the truck for $3k off his asking price right off the bat (He wanted $8k to start, same as Bluebook for retail). I gave it another quick look-over, had him throw in taxes at no extra cost, and called it a deal. The whole process, including fixing his computer, took about three hours, and I got a truck out of it  |
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Rose Karuna
Lizard Doctor
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,772
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02-02-2006 07:11
Okay, I hesitate saying this because I know some of you think I am already a little crazy. Maybe you are right. I did plan things out a little bit. But I figure they had a whole team working to charge me a higher price, so I needed backup. Day 1: I sent my friend to the dealership in her old car to look at a new Land Cruiser. While she is there, she remarks about the Prius and how she has a friend who would love one. Naturally the dealer suggest she bring him in. In the interim, she is "this close" to buying the $55k vehicle. Unfortunately they don't have what she needs on the lot. She goes to research on the website and will come back tomorrow. Day 2: She comes back with the printouts of the specs she wants for the car. The salesman is very excited. Her friend calls her while she is there and she invited him for advice on what she wants. I am nearby so I agree to stop in. "He's the one that would love the Prius," she says. I arrive and help her look at the car. It was almost torture waiting for the greedy salesman to bring up the Prius. Meanwhile my friend thinks she has the perfect vehicle. She takes the paperwork all the way to the limit. I look at the Prius and am in love. She needs to get with her bank to arrange the financing. When she gets the check she will bring it in to complete the purchase. Day 3: I arrive alone to look at the Prius again. I really want it but am so fragile and inexperienced with car buying. I think they are always trying to rip me off. I even call my friend with the big ticket purchase to discuss my angst within earshot. At this point I negotiate some of the discounts. Day 4: I come back to buy a car. I negotiate hard. My friend "got her check" to finalize the purchase of her vehicle and will be in that night after she leaves work. I purchase my car and negotiate hard. I call again to worry that I am being ripped off and maybe this isn't the best dealership. She thinks I may be right. Maybe we both moved to fast. I negotiate the final discounts and make my purchase. Strangely, my friend seems to have lost interest in a new car purchase. Some people can be so fickle and unpredictable. At the end of the day, Prius or not, I bought a MSRP $25k car. She was going to buy an MSRP $55k car. If people are willing to use their greed against you, the easiest thing is to use their greed against them. Brilliant. That's all I can say, just brilliant. I just bought a PT Cruiser and I wish I'd had you with me. . _____________________
I Do Whatever My Rice Krispies Tell Me To
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Beryl Greenacre
Big Scaredy-Baby
Join date: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 1,312
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02-02-2006 07:28
Oh, the $4 I demanded off the price was based on the mileage on the car. The car had 4 miles on it. I wanted them to deduct a dollar for every mile it had been driven. It was completely irrational, but I just wanted to see if I could get away with it. Many people enjoy this sort of exchange, as it sort of sounds like you did, the thrill of haggling and feeling like you came out ahead in the end. Myself, I hate it, it exhausts me. I'm pretty sure that car dealers always leave themselves plenty of bargaining room in their prices to still come out ahead in the end. Congrats on your new vehicle, Neehai. Incidentally, I've always wondered what the "new car" smell in a hybrid smells like.  _____________________
Swell Second Life: Menswear by Beryl Greenacre
Miramare 105, 82/ Aqua 192, 112/ Image Reflections Design, Freedom 121, 121 |
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 07:33
Wow, people really are morally bankrupt, judging from the responses here. I thought that was just some bullshit middle aged rhetoric, but it's real. Hmm.
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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02-02-2006 07:36
Wow, people really are morally bankrupt, judging from the responses here. I thought that was just some bullshit middle aged rhetoric, but it's real. Hmm. Car dealerships are trying to take advantage of you at every turn. If you don't play their game, they will. _____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 07:44
To be fair, they, being the car dealership, are trying very hard to screw YOU, too. I have only bought 2 new cars, both BMWs. I preordered them from the dealer, and I got a discount because of my employer. I have never had the experience of being screwed by a dealer on a new car, my experience has only been positive and I have an excellent relationship with the dealership. They are highly recommended by many people and are very well known for their excellent customer service. People are in business to make a profit, not necessarily screw people over. I try to live a ethical and moral life, I wouldn't use these tactics to get what I want, mainly because in the time I wasted doing all of this I could have made enough money to make up the difference I was "saving". This just seems like wasting the time of a few people to save a few bucks. http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2005-05-31-hybrid-costs-usat_x.htm When compared with the smaller, gas-thrifty conventional Corolla, the Prius wouldn't equal the five-year costs unless it were driven 66,500 miles a year or gas reached $10.10 a gallon. |
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 07:46
Car dealerships are trying to take advantage of you at every turn. If you don't play their game, they will. Yes, and all men are cheaing dogs.  The car market has changed a lot from what it used to be, with more information available to consumers, auto dealers are unabel to pull the wool over people eyes as they did in the past. Neehai spent hours over 4 days to get a deal on a car using less then etical methods, you can justify it however you want, but 2 wrongs do not make a right. |
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Gabe Lippmann
"Phone's ringing, Dude."
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 4,219
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02-02-2006 07:48
Car dealerships are trying to take advantage of you at every turn. If you don't play their game, they will. This is true. One of my closest friends is a Finance Manager for a large dealership. I've knocked a few back with many car salesmen over the years and they relish in detailing every last tale of screwing people. This is not unique, it is rampant throughout the industry. _____________________
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Aliasi Stonebender
Return of Catbread
Join date: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 1,858
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02-02-2006 07:49
Wow, people really are morally bankrupt, judging from the responses here. I thought that was just some bullshit middle aged rhetoric, but it's real. Hmm. The only moral bankruptcy going on is on the part of the car dealership. _____________________
Red Mary says, softly, “How a man grows aggressive when his enemy displays propriety. He thinks: I will use this good behavior to enforce my advantage over her. Is it any wonder people hold good behavior in such disregard?”
Anything Surplus Home to the "Nuke the Crap Out of..." series of games and other stuff |
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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02-02-2006 07:51
I try to live a ethical and moral life, I wouldn't use these tactics to get what I want, mainly because in the time I wasted doing all of this I could have made enough money to make up the difference I was "saving". This just seems like wasting the time of a few people to save a few bucks. Most people I know, probably Neehai included, cannot make 2,500 dollars net profit in a about 12 hours worth of very casual work. Contulations on all your successes and BMWs. _____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
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02-02-2006 07:51
Neehai spent hours over 4 days to get a deal on a car using less then etical methods, you can justify it however you want, but 2 wrongs do not make a right. They make a substantial discount though! More than worth 4 days effort, I'd say! |
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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02-02-2006 07:54
Yes, and all men are cheaing dogs. The car market has changed a lot from what it used to be, with more information available to consumers, auto dealers are unabel to pull the wool over people eyes as they did in the past. Neehai spent hours over 4 days to get a deal on a car using less then etical methods, you can justify it however you want, but 2 wrongs do not make a right. What do you think bullshit like "non-negotiable fees" that they wont itemize are? Tada! A new way of pulling the wool over people's eyes, and even better, the individual car salesmen gets to sound like the poor victim of mean ol' regulations while he's doing it. A lot has changed. I liked it better when car dealers just flat out lied to you about how much a car was worth. _____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 08:05
I think we see some differences in the discount he received.
He received 500 because of his employer and he had a $500 coupon. Those were gimme discounts. Then he they reaised his trade in $600 for cover an administration cost. The $600 is the only part where he may have got something special. The insanity over the four fucking dollars isnt even worth addressing. Really I don't think his tactics were necessary at all to acheive his goal. they want to sell cars, they want to sell cars fast. He could have probably got the same deal without the smoke in mirrors and wasting hours of his life. You guys seem so happy to think the little guy got over on the dealer you are missing the larger point which is the excessive dishonesty that Neehai felt was necessary to achieve his goal, which shows a lack of moral fiber and character. Reitsuki, I value my personal free time very highly. I do not enjoy haggling, I find it common and it makes me uncomfortable. I set my price point before I make a purchase and if I can't get it at that price I walk away. It is really simple and makes for a happier life for myself. I can't thnk of any worse way to waste my free time than haggling over the price of a material object that will be worth thousands less the second I drive it. |
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Gabe Lippmann
"Phone's ringing, Dude."
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 4,219
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02-02-2006 08:06
Yes, and all men are cheaing dogs. The car market has changed a lot from what it used to be, with more information available to consumers, auto dealers are unabel to pull the wool over people eyes as they did in the past. Neehai spent hours over 4 days to get a deal on a car using less then etical methods, you can justify it however you want, but 2 wrongs do not make a right. You are correct in that the dealers don't invest much concern over new car pricing. They just want to move the cars off the lot. However, they are unscrupulous with financing for people with less than stellar credit. They mark their bones on used cars and are very capable of screwing people over with trade-ins and resale. This happens every day. High end dealerships are much better to deal with for new car sales. They are cultivating relationships that should prove profitable as people will use the dealership for service (high margin) and hopefully will be repeat buyers and will refer others. Additionally, most of them have customer review forms that have to be turned in and they will go so far as to tell you straight up that if you can't give them top marks across the board they want to know and try to change that. Outside of the certified pre-owned cars, even these dealers are rarely completely honest with used car sales. I'm glad you have had good experiences, but don't think these shenanigans don't go on. Of course, that does not remove any "moral obligations" on the part of the buyer, but that is nothing I'm concerned with. _____________________
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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02-02-2006 08:15
Reitsuki, I value my personal free time very highly. I do not enjoy haggling, I find it common and it makes me uncomfortable. I set my price point before I make a purchase and if I can't get it at that price I walk away. It is really simple and makes for a happier life for myself. I can't thnk of any worse way to waste my free time than haggling over the price of a material object that will be worth thousands less the second I drive it. So terribly sorry you find it common. Some of us are common. I'm not exactly going bankrupt, but I don't have excessive money to throw around. I'm living mostly on savings and scholarships and the odd college-level income job. Even 500 dollars to me is a very signifigant amount of money if I can save it, and yes, I will haggle to get it if I can. I don't have the luxury of finding haggling below me. _____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 08:15
You are correct in that the dealers don't invest much concern over new car pricing. They just want to move the cars off the lot. However, they are unscrupulous with financing for people with less than stellar credit. The devil is in the financing. The price of the car they will get low, most dealer make money on the financing of cars, not the car sales. In Chicago several car dealers are suing Chrysler because Chrysler didn't want to offer finacing to blacks, and when they did, they charged them more points than white customer with the same credit. The case is still in court. It is pretty easy to get the price you want, especially if you have your own financing. You don't need to be dishonest to get what you want. The fact Neehai is bragging on being dishonest and people are patting him on the back is pathetic. |
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 08:19
So terribly sorry you find it common. Some of us are common. I'm not exactly going bankrupt, but I don't have excessive money to throw around. I'm living mostly on savings and scholarships and the odd college-level income job. Even 500 dollars to me is a very signifigant amount of money if I can save it, and yes, I will haggle to get it if I can. I don't have the luxury of finding haggling below me. Wow! You took something really person when I was just stating my personal choice. I'm not going to try and talk someone down on price. I decide if I am willing to pay what is asked and if I am not I walk away. Most of the time if people want to make a sale they will offer you a lower price, if they don't then I don't buy it. I don't care what your financial situation is. Some people like haggling. I don't it is a personal perference. |
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Reitsuki Kojima
Witchhunter
Join date: 27 Jan 2004
Posts: 5,328
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02-02-2006 08:20
Wow! You took something really person when I was just stating my personal choice. I'm not going to try and talk someone down on price. I decide if I am willing to pay what is asked and if I am not I walk away. Most of the time if people want to make a sale they will offer you a lower price, if they don't then I don't buy it. I don't care what your financial situation is. Some people like haggling. I don't it is a personal perference. Yes, the word "common" in these days does tend to provoke reaction... _____________________
I am myself indifferent honest; but yet I could accuse me of such things that it were better my mother had not borne me: I am very proud, revengeful, ambitious, with more offenses at my beck than I have thoughts to put them in, imagination to give them shape, or time to act them in. What should such fellows as I do crawling between earth and heaven? We are arrant knaves, all; believe none of us.
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Eboni Khan
Misanthrope
Join date: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 2,133
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02-02-2006 08:23
Yes, the word "common" in these days does tend to provoke reaction... Yeah, but dishonesty is socially acceptable it seems. Attaboy Neehai! |
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Beryl Greenacre
Big Scaredy-Baby
Join date: 24 Jun 2003
Posts: 1,312
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02-02-2006 10:22
The real shame in this case is that the auto manufacturers charge as much as they do for hybrids; they should be practically giving them away. Why, you ask? Because the more hybrids they manufacture and sell, the more of the big, gas guzzling road hogs (SUVs, Hummers, etc.) they can sell according to their cafe standards agreements with the government. Hybrids are, in reality, nothing but a ploy to pacify "nasty, evil liberals" (like some of us claim to be).
I have very little sympathy for the whole auto industry. The people doing the work in the factories and selling the cars in the dealerships aren't the ones whose pockets are being lined with cash. And now, with the loss of more auto manufacturing jobs in the U.S., I'm guessing the big auto makers are just setting themselves up to ship even more jobs overseas where they can pay pennies on the dollar to poor workers who have no better job options. Welcome to big business in the 21st century, and be careful of the slippery slope of calling out someone else's morals. May (insert non-denominational, non-gender-specific, non-offensive diety here) have mercy on all our Wal-Mart shoppin', Starbucks drinkin', consumin' souls. Amen. Pass me a latte. _____________________
Swell Second Life: Menswear by Beryl Greenacre
Miramare 105, 82/ Aqua 192, 112/ Image Reflections Design, Freedom 121, 121 |
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Creami Cannoli
Please don't eat me....
Join date: 17 Jul 2005
Posts: 414
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02-02-2006 14:16
It is pretty easy to get the price you want, especially if you have your own financing. That's true. Go to your bank FIRST to find out how much of a loan you can get through them at a much lower rate than using the car dealer's financing. Usually when you have the check in hand for the amount you want to spend, you can get the car at that price and be done with the BS. But if you have to use the dealer for financing, then by all means haggle and try to get the best deal that they will give you. Nothing dishonest in that at all. The $4.00 dollars for the milage was hilarious. The dealers charge you for AIR in the tires, so it evens out. |
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Neehai Zapata
Unofficial Parent
Join date: 8 Apr 2004
Posts: 1,970
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02-02-2006 15:18
You guys seem so happy to think the little guy got over on the dealer you are missing the larger point which is the excessive dishonesty that Neehai felt was necessary to achieve his goal, which shows a lack of moral fiber and character. I didn't feel it was necessary. You are drawing a conclusion. You give away a lot about yourself when you post. It is amusing. As for being dishonest and morally corrupt. That would be like me saying you are a filthy whore for having sex. I bought a car. I negotiated what I felt was the price I wanted to pay for the car. If the dealer had additional expectations of a sale, that is not my problem. It's not like I promised to cure cancer or something if they gave me a good deal. You like to feel superior and you like to brag about yourself. I am extremely happy that I have provided you a forum for both in this thread. Sure, I make plenty of money. If I woke up tomorrow and made $100k a year, I would be very sad. However, I completed this task when I was not working so I did not trade off $100/hr to do this. When I was young, my grandmother explained to me that people who have money have it for one very good reason. They respect money. No matter how much you have, you should always save and spend it wisely. I was taught to always seek out the best deal. Anyone can get money, that is easy. Keeping it is the hard part. _____________________
Unofficial moderator and proud dysfunctional parent to over 1000 bastard children.
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