using a design from the internet

Is it wrong to make Sl clothes using a design found elsewhere on the internet (not in SL)? I have found some really neat looking clothes I want to make in SL but they are somebody elses design in a different game. I dont take their design & photosource them, I go to photoshop & do my best to make a similar outfit. Is this wrong? thanks for your advice

Kharie

You never saw that design the other person did, and you made yours in isolation.

Hi Kharie, I know a friend who wanted to make an avatar to sell in SL based on a Turbine game called Asheron's Call. He contacted Turbine and asked them if it would be ok and they said no. You could do the same. Just ask the company. Good luck!

Clothing can't be covered by copyright so making a recreation of a real world clothing design isn't illegal in most cases. Textile patterns can be covered by copyright, and clothing can be covered by design patents, but they are very limited and can be circumvented by only minor design changes. This is why every clothing maker on earth has very similar designs and you can go to Walmart and buy a cheap knockoff of a designer dress.

The avatar from Asheron's Call would be a different story entirely since in that case the game art is copyrighted.

lots of places make clothes that look similar to others...

Take a place like walmart around here for example...
I can go to Hollister at the mall and get some great jeans and spend 90 bucks or go to walmart and get jeans that LOOK just about the same, but only cost $15. (LMAO I editted this because I realize Chip said kinda the same thing XD)

This isn't the issue of price, but as you can see, it's done in RL all the time.

Thanks everyone. That makes me feel better. here is an example of what I am doing here is the outfit I found

http://members.cox.net/cinder1959/18663_m.jpg

& here is my version of it

http://members.cox.net/cinder1959/Snapshot_002.bmp

tell me what you think??

Kharie

damn...............you're good

I see no problems with your taking an idea and building on it.

Thanks Peggy, I am learning , I get a little better with each outfit I make.

Kharie

That would sure cause an uproar if the initial photo was done by a "well known" SL content creator.


Just sayin`

Sorry but that is just so wrong! I disagree with the previous postings that support your actions, you may not be breaking any laws but just look at it the other way round - if yours was the original and then the other one 'appeared' as a blatant rip-off of yours... how happy would you be? honestly!?

To make it your own but just as effective all you have to do is put a different but equally dynamic pattern on it and change the design by making different length sections with slightly different jaggies... be inspired, improve on the design!

I often take snaps of people and saleboards for inspiration - but NEVER copy the photographed items, I use the pics as springboards for my own creativity, to learn from particular techniques or to recreate specific details - if I copied I would get NO satisfaction or pleasure from my work as I would not be able to consider it to be my own creation...

Just my opinion but I bet many clothing makers and sellers will agree...

Cat x

Cat, you are missing a big point. None of us are making clothes. We are making digital images that represent other taken digital images.
The fashion industry frequently acts crazy for the very reason you spoke of but that stuff is never sold (or sold at outrageous sums of money)
We aren't making clothes. We are graphic designers manipulating digital imagery. If I walk into walmart and take a shot of clothes, the image is my according to copyright law. If I manipulate that image to use only the texture of a shirt, unless it is uniquely registered, it is still fair use.
You are welcome to your own morality. There are true artists who can make anything. Then there is those who photosource everything because it is easier for them.
There are those who can do both, Like me.
As long has he isn't photosourcing a known designer who actually sells their runway garment textures on the open market he is still in the clear. Or using trademarked goods either.
*sigh*

In my world this is how it would be. (I mean, your disagreement would be in tune with the law)

I dont agree with what this person did either... But apparently from the other posts, if theyre correct, its allowed.

I make clothing in Sl and all of the designs you see on them are original. If i found those designs on someone elses items i would be very upset. When i speak of its 'design' i simply mean the artwork of it, not the shape of the clothing





The whole thing seems wrong and im confused as to how its even allowed in RL. I mean i understand there are knock offs of items all the time...But when it comes to something so original like this, i dont get how its 'ok' to blatantly copy and resell. If shes NOT reselling i feel this is OK for PERSONAL USE.. but if shes reselling im pretty uneasy about it regardless of if the law allows or not. But still, even if for personal use, if i had an extremely original piece and someone did this i still wouldnt be too happy but id prefer it over them copying for profit.

You can`t TM/SM a good..only a word(s). Are you referring to copyrighted items?

Thunderclap - I am certainly not missing the point! I am not concerned with the RL clothing industry, you and other posters refer to real world clothing, Walmart etc - not me! I am talking about the morality of stealing someone else's graphic design - making a blatant and exact copy of another persons original artwork. Photo 'sourcing' is one way of stealing artwork - but that isn't the only way of making an exact copy of something...

If it was an SL item of clothing that was being copied in this fashion there would be no question, no debate - because it comes from another game does NOT make it OK!

Cat

Please I didnt want to cause any fighting. I value everybody's opinions. I just liked these outfits & wanted to have then in SL. If I make anymore I will use my designs using their designs as a inspiration to create my own. Thank you everybody. I am going to try to create eyelashes for now. so be on the lookout for my work LOL.

Kharie

this article says it best.

it says it ok

and you did a great job on that dress

can i get a copy

Oh dear Poopmaster/Domino, read Thunderclap's post, any posts relating to real world fashion are entirely misleading in this thread. If the item being discussed was a real world item of clothing then it would of course be a completely different matter - we are in fact discussing a piece of graphic artwork! The fact that it constitutes a piece of clothing in the pretend world of SL is totally irrelevant!

In my opinion, as expressed in my earlier post, the artwork involved has just been copied too precisely. This is just my opinion Kharie, I offer it in response to your invitation and I am not 'falling out' with you or anyone else in this thread/forum. It's no biggie

Cat x

I think that your design is VERY similar - enough that you may get complaints from the originator of the outfit. The clothing design business in SL is a little tricky since they are but digital representations of clothing - they could be considered art and fall under the copywrite proctection laws. However - it hasn't been determined if SL clothing is "digital clothing" or "digital art."

I would play it safe though and maybe change the design of the clothing and make the texture different - but in the same vein as what you want.

As a designer my personal opinion is that if someone copied my stuff - I would be flattered and then I would either A: Give that item away for free to circumvent any sales for the copier or B: Discontinue the item - the would be artist probably won't be around for long since they can't come up with their own stuff or C: Just keep it in the store and mark it as the "Original Design" - some peeps might buy the knock off and then realize their mistake and purchase the original.

Remember - If you come up with the cool original ideas, people are bound to copy - but you are always the leader and they can only follow you. I say if you are going to copy a design or idea almost to the tee - expect some flak. I think that if you are able to copy that design so effectively - you should be able to come up with your own stuff. Another thing to remember is that there isn't a single thing in fashion that is "NEW" - almost everything is a knockoff of something else, do your research and you will find that most of the fashion items of today can easily be found in the past 50 years.

Just my opinion.

It has, actually If the work being copied is a photograph of a real world article of clothing then the copyright on the photo is being violated but not the copyright on the article of clothing (since clothing isn't covered by copyright law). It's highly unlikely that the copyright holder on the photograph would (or could) come after you for using it to create a graphic image of the article of clothing that is its subject, since taking a photo of something doesn't grant the photographer a copyright on what was photographed, only on the photograph itself. If the end result is a digital painting of a real world article of clothing that doesn't retain any compositional elements of the photo it was sourced from then the copyright holder on the photo wouldn't have a case. It's up to each individual to decide the ethics of it for themselves, but those are the objective facts.

Now copying an article of clothing that didn't originate in the real world and only exists as a graphic work of art (like copying a character's clothing from Asheron's Call, or the original design of an SL designer) then that's a definite breach of copyright and the original designer could file a DMCA takedown notice and other legal action if they saw fit to do so.

Yeah but how is it 'right' to put someone elses artwork on your clothing and sell it in SL? Im not talking about like photosourcing a pair of jeans or anything..rather.....

Eg- theres a clothing site my RL friend models for..kind of "indie" clothing if you will. And theres a shop here in SL who obviously went to the website and cut off the tee shirt artwork and made their own clothing and is selling it.

Is that not infringing on someones copyright? I mean, once you make an original work- its yours. So using a photo to steal the artwork off of and put it on your own shirt in SL and sell it as yours seems beyond wrong

(This is not about the OPs question, I understand she made her own copy from scratch)

Yes, that would be a definite infringement. T-shirt designs, textile patterns, and so on, are all covered by copyright.

Ah ok, that clears things up.


I think that needs to be made known, because people seem to think its ok to take the artwork when one mentions it is ok to source.


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I`ve photosourced jeans (no designs) myself, but I can`t say I`m a fan of even that. I think a lot of clothing (no design) has its own feel to it as well and this is why I lean AWAY from photosourcing as being 'ok'. Theres a store that recently opened in SL whose things are totally sourced and they want like $450 for one pair of jeans- Outrageous, its not like it took them much talent to make it. ALL of my clothing is hand drawn (With the exception of the jeans) and it was MUCH harder to hand draw it then to source a pair of jeans. The detail is not there, you have to draw it on. Most sourced clothing looks nicer than hand drawn, but how can you be proud of something you completely sourced? I`d have to give credit to the company who produced it in RL.

Now sourcing for a skin- different story..lotsa` work.

People know. They also know that the chance that they'll be punished are slim. They don't care that it's wrong, just whether they can get away with it.

I see lots of copyright violations in SL. I just totally refuse to do ANY business with anyone selling those things.

I meant the actual digital clothing - photosourced or not, as the object of art or fashion. It doesn't matter though I agree with you. It is just most people don't understand copywrite (including me on some levels) and it comes up all of the time in forums here and other SL forums. It is frustrating. The thing I was trying to point out is that since these digital clothes we make are actually artwork - just copying them, even copying them from scratch is actually against copywrite laws. SL clothing rides the line - is is fashion or is it art? If it is fashion, then copy away - there is nothing anyone can do. If it is art then don't even create anything similar.

I am kind of perplexed by the whole thing. So does that mean that the person who originally designs a dress in RL has no rights when it becomes part of digital fashion? Does the person who photo sourced that designers dress now own all digital rights, so that even the original designer can't make or sell digital copies of their own dress? Clear as mud. Just to be safe - don't copy, create in the same ilk or theme but don't copy.