From: Ephraim Kappler
A recidivist?
What's a "redicitivist"? Typo, perhaps? Did you mean "redactionist"?
From: Ephraim Kappler
I will just have to agree to differ with you, the law and everyone else on this issue, Chosen.
I'm glad you now at least are willing to acknowledge the fact that you are indeed breaking the law. That's a little progress, I guess.
That you have such little respect for the rule of law is quite troubling, though. There are plenty of laws I don't quite agree with, myself, but I still abide by them, while using legitimate means to try to get them changed. I wish you could find the strength to do the same.
From: Ephraim Kappler
Harping on about intellectual property rights is so much fatuous nonsense in a situation where no corollary of consumer rights exists to balance the argument.
But that's the point you keep refusing to accept. You're not a "consumer" in this context. You're a licensee. There's a huge difference there.
For at least the third time now, "buying" an item in SL doesn't mean you own the item, or any part of it. It means you've aquired a license to use the item in whole, not in part, within the confines of the Second Life service. That's it, and that's all.
No matter how much you might wish the facts were different, they're simply not. It is what it is.
If you want to arrange a different license agreement with any content creator, up to and including full consumption, that's between you and each specific creator in question. But in the absense of such an agreement, the previous agreement you made when you agreed to SL's TOS is what is binding. Shall I quote it for you?
From: Second Life Terms of Service
1.3 Content available in the Service may be provided by users of the Service, rather than by Linden Lab. Linden Lab and other parties have rights in their respective content, which you agree to respect.
You acknowledge that: (i) by using the Service you may have access to graphics, sound effects, music, video, audio, computer programs, animation, text and other creative output (collectively, "Content"

, and (ii) Content may be provided under license by independent content providers, including contributions from other users of the Service (all such independent content providers, "Content Providers"

. Linden Lab does not pre-screen Content.
You acknowledge that Linden Lab and other Content Providers have rights in their respective Content under copyright and other applicable laws and treaty provisions, and that except as described in this Agreement, such rights are not licensed or otherwise transferred by mere use of the Service. You accept full responsibility and liability for your use of any Content in violation of any such rights. You agree that your creation of Content is not in any way based upon any expectation of compensation from Linden Lab.
Got that? All content in SL is provided under license, and you acknowledge that your use of the SL service does not constitute transfer of creators' rights to you. What part of that was not clear when you signed up and agreed to the TOS? Let me guess; you didn't bother to read it, did you?
From: Ephraim Kappler
Even without the consideration of consumer rights, the ostensible ruling that I or anyone else is damaging the creator's intellectual property by copying and/or altering it for their own use is specious. My avatar is not a promotion for businesses in SL.
Please don't try to twist my words. I never said you damaged the creator's intellectual property in any way. I said you harmed the creator him/herself by infringing upon his/her rights. I know you're intelligent enough to understand the difference.
From: Ephraim Kappler
I bought products to facilitate the look and the creator's involvement, rights and privileges ended when I paid them for copies of their work.
No, you bought a license to use intellectual property owned by someone else, for very limited purposes. You did not buy any actual product. The creator's rights in no way ended when you made your "purchase". Need I once again quote the agreement you made when you signed up for SL?
From: Second Life Terms of Service
You acknowledge that Linden Lab and other Content Providers have rights in their respective Content under copyright and other applicable laws and treaty provisions, and that except as described in this Agreement, such rights are not licensed or otherwise transferred by mere use of the Service. You accept full responsibility and liability for your use of any Content in violation of any such rights.
...You further understand and agree that: (i) you are solely responsible for understanding all copyright, patent, trademark, trade secret and other intellectual property or other laws...
From: Ephraim Kappler
My actions are not motivated by greed, profit or any intention to do harm.
Your motivation is irrelevant. You either honor your agreements or you don't. You either act in compliance with the law or you don't. It doesn't matter why.
But since you mentioned it, I would argue that you ARE in fact motivated by greed, contrary to what you might tell yourself. Your own explanation for why you've done what you've done illustrates that well enough. You believe your own personal desires are more important than the rights of others. You want what you want, and you're not willing to do without, regardless of how your actions impact said rights of others. Further, you've got no hesitation about breaking the law in order to get what you want. When people don't respond to notecards you've allegedly sent them, rather than just walking away, you call them "pricks" and other assorted names, and then you proceed to steal their intellectual property to use for your own purposes. That is the very definition of greed.
From: Ephraim Kappler
I am working to make the best of a considerable sum spent during the previous year on products that are unquestionably unfit for their purpose and I will defend my right to do so until I am permanently locked out of SL and possibly chased into some RL court.
If the items are truly "unfit", don't use them. Examine all items thoroughly BEFORE you make your purchase, always. If you can't easily find the information you need, ask the seller all relevant questions before you buy. If they choose not to respond, do business with someone else who will. If you failed to do any or all of that, that was entirely your decision. The money you spent is gone because you voluntarily threw it away. Be a grownup and live with the consequences of your own actions.
From: Ephraim Kappler
And then some.
Really? "And then some"? So you're saying if LL decides you're no longer welcome in the service they own, you'll come back anyway? And that even if a court penalizes you for your actions, you still won't take responsibility for your actions; you'll just keep on repeating them? And you say you're not greedy? Wow.
Need I say it again? Spoken like a true criminal.
From: Ephraim Kappler
The boots example at the end of my previous post amounts to more than 28 US dollars expenditure when I take into account copies and different versions bought for alts (I like to keep them well turned-out). There is no argument that I should have known better because it was only yesterday that I realised just what a heavy load this particular item carries (I forgot to mention the additional two logo textures that I won't be including in my final copy).
Yes, you should have known better. Whether or not you acknowledge that now, you still have no right to make unauthorized copies of anyone else's IP, or to circumvent DRM.
From: Ephraim Kappler
How on earth can I reasonably expect a response to my complaint about a product I purchased more than ten months ago?
You never know until you try. Did you try?
I can't speak for other creators, but to use myself as an example, I've got several products I've updated over the years. My policy regarding improved versions in most cases is that they're offered free to anyone who's purchased a previous version of the same item. All a past customer has to do is ask, and I'll happily drop them a copy of the new version. It doesn't matter if the original purchase was 10 months ago, 5 years ago, or 5 minutes ago.
Of course, not everyone is going to have the same policy I do. Some might charge for upgrades. Some might not offer them. Some might be out of business. But unless you ask, you'll never know.
But whether the creator responds to your inquiry or not, or whether any response the offer is favorable or unfavorable in your view, you still don't have the right to make unauthorized copies of their work or to circumvent DRM. Again, you licensed IP that they own. Live with the terms of license agreement to which you originally agreed. There's no other answer.
From: Ephraim Kappler
The same goes for a great deal of inventory accrued on my rapid ascent of the SL learning curve.
Yes, there's a learning curve. Everyone makes mistakes along the way. The difference between people like you and the rest of us is we grownups live with our mistakes. We either correct them legally, and without trampling on the rights of others, or we simply let them lie. Either way, we're in the right. You, absolutely, are not.
From: Ephraim Kappler
I feel like a fool on this particular matter because I routinely complain to others about overly rich texturing. I am even on record in another post on this forum with a complaint about a 1024 x 1024 texture on the face of a wrist watch, for example: shaking my head over that ridiculous object while wearing more than 10 megabytes on my feet.
Fine, feel like a fool about that if you must. But again, that doesn't give you license to steal other people's IP or to circumvent DRM. If you feel the items you're using are unsuitable, replace them with others, without breaking the law, and without violating anyone else's rights. That means either buy new ones or make your own from scratch. That's it.
From: Ephraim Kappler
So I refuse to accept that I should be lumbered with this stuff on a 'take it or leave it' basis just because that's what the law says.
Once again, I'm very glad you're finally ready to acknowledge that the law does indeed say what it actually says. But I'm deeply disturbed by the fact that you're not willing to abide by it. By this, you demonstrate with non uncertainty that you really are the criminal you so adamantly denied you were just a few hour ago in your previous post. One who deliberately breaks the law is by definition a criminal.
From: Ephraim Kappler
'Take it and alter it to suit yourself' is a far more workable and realistic solution that I will abide by until such time as a rigidly enforced mechanism of consumer protection is added to the SL environment.
"Take it and alter it yourself" is not what you agreed to when you signed up for SL. So in addition to not caring about the letter of the law, you're also now saying you don't give a damn about honoring your own word. That's really not cool.
As for "consumer protection", I might agree with you, if you were indeed a consumer. But as I said, you're a licensee in this arena, and there's a world of difference there.
If you want to talk about licensee protections, I'd be the first to advocate for better access to education on these topics, so people hopefully will be better prepared to understand the activities in which they're engaging, before they make commitments. Beyond that, there's not a whole lot to be done. If one enters into an agreement, one is solely responsible to understand the terms of the agreement before saying yes.
From: Ephraim Kappler
When I get around to making a dinky pair of boots or a sufficiently interesting skin of my own, I will put those items up for sale at a reasonable price in full acceptance of the fact that buyers may copy and alter the products by whatever means they have at their disposal.
Great. That's entirely your choice to make. If you truly intend to grant rights to your customers in excess of the usual standard, which is absolutely your right to do, I would suggest you make that absolutely clear in your advertising. That way your customers will know where you stand on the subject, and there will be no confusion.
Beyond that, you should also include all source textures with the items, so that your customers won't have to circumvent DRM to get at them. Technically, they'd be in violation of DMCA otherwise, even if you've given permission. It's not your DRM, it's LL's, so you don't get a say on it. Let your customers abide by your wishes legally, if that's really your intent.
But remember, the people whose IP you've been taking up until now did not grant any such express permissions to you. Just because you'd make such a grant yourself does not mean that any other content creators are obligated to do so themselves. Respect their wishes and their rights, just as you'd like others to respect yours.
From: Ephraim Kappler
I should say that my goal will be to ensure that customers will not wish to alter an otherwise perfectly serviceable and attractive product.
That's the first righteous strategy you've presented so far. If you don't like the mousetraps currently on the market are inferior in your view, the best thing you can possibly do is build better ones. Put yours on the market, and drive your subpar competition out of business. Everyone wins that way. Customers get better items, and you get to make money.
Even the competition wins in the long run, although it won't feel like it at the time, since the downturn in sales of their inferior items will spur them either to get their act together and make better ones, or to move on to other professions to which they might be better suited.
From: Ephraim Kappler
Nevertheless, it will be their privilege, not a right accorded by my good self, to make any alterations or copies they want if they have paid me but still seek to make my product look and behave more like something of their own. So long as they do not resell or redistribute the product as their own work, that will be entirely their own business. Even then, "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" means more to me than the lindens I might have accrued through lost profits.
Your apparent definitions of rights and privileges is a little off the mark, but I won't dwell on it. It's obvious what you mean. You want your customers to be able to alter your products any way they want. Great. As I said, be sure to include the source textures with full perms, be sure to make the items themselves mod/copy or full perms, and be sure to include the terms of your license in your advertising.
From: Ephraim Kappler
And if someone makes a better job of my product? I will get a kick out of that too.
Fantastic. I'm glad you're so benevolent and giving. Now if only you could extend those same feelings toward respecting the rights of other content creators as well.
From: Ephraim Kappler
Preciate yore economic support of my verb'age, Mr Stonecutter.
Nothing argent said here supports your position in any way, Ephraim. Read on for explanation.
From: Argent Stonecutter
The legal fiction that making copies inside a computer that are required for the use of a product should be treated in law just as if you were distributing copies to third parties for profit or to undermine the profits of the creator is not universally supported by experts in this field of law.
Notice Argent said "making copies inside a computer that are required for the use of a product". That's not what we've been discussing, not at all.
Ripping a texture and then re-uploading it is in no way necessary for the use of any SL product. If one doesn't like the way a particular product is put together, that doesn't mean the product is not usable as is. It just means it's not optimal in the opinion of the user, which is hardly the same thing.