Check out the votes
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll363.xml
Welcome to the Second Life Forums Archive
These forums are CLOSED. Please visit the new forums HERE
Internet Gambling NOW Illegal |
|
|
Carmo Camus
Registered User
Join date: 12 Oct 2005
Posts: 27
|
07-12-2006 09:48
|
|
Clarrice Cinquetti
\m/ รดรด \m/
Join date: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 259
|
07-12-2006 09:51
BILL TITLE: Unlawful Internet Gambling Enforcement Act
So lawful would be ok?  _____________________
Wandering SL enjoying myself
 |
|
Zoe Llewelyn
Asylum Inmate
Join date: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 502
|
07-12-2006 09:54
Incorrect.
A bill has passed one of three hurdles to POSSIBLY becoming a law that would make some forms of Internet gambling ilegal in the United States only. A bill passing the House of representatives does not make the bill law. It must also pass the Senate and then be signed into law by the Preseident. The last two have yet to happen. This bill is NOT law. The original post and title are untrue and inflammatory. _____________________
 |
|
Esprite Xavier
Second Life Resident
Join date: 13 Nov 2004
Posts: 37
|
07-12-2006 09:55
It doesn't ban internet gambling it bans the use of certain payment intruments such as credit cards for unlawful internet gambling. Though I'm not sure of the legalities of SL, credit cards could be used to purchase L$, but then again its not used for just gambling, and you can get L$ without using a credit card and then you could use it for other things besides gambling...
|
|
Michi Lumin
Sharp and Pointy
Join date: 14 Oct 2003
Posts: 1,793
|
07-12-2006 10:05
it's not ratified, in effect, or a law yet.
|
|
Alazarin Mondrian
Teh Trippy Hippie Dragon
Join date: 4 Apr 2005
Posts: 1,549
|
07-12-2006 10:29
I for one would not mourn the passing of the gambling establishments in SL should that law be passed.
_____________________
My stuff on Meta-Life: http://tinyurl.com/ykq7nzt
http://www.myspace.com/alazarinmobius http://slurl.com/secondlife/Crescent/72/98/116 |
|
Shirley Meiji
Moxie Drinker
Join date: 8 Mar 2005
Posts: 165
|
07-12-2006 10:47
Incorrect. A bill has passed one of three hurdles to POSSIBLY becoming a law that would make some forms of Internet gambling ilegal in the United States only. A bill passing the House of representatives does not make the bill law. It must also pass the Senate and then be signed into law by the Preseident. The last two have yet to happen. This bill is NOT law. The original post and title are untrue and inflammatory. It can become a law if the president doesn't sign it, so long as he doesn't veto it. |
|
Zoe Llewelyn
Asylum Inmate
Join date: 15 Jun 2004
Posts: 502
|
07-12-2006 10:50
It can become a law if the president doesn't sign it, so long as he doesn't veto it. I am quite aware of that, but didn't feel it necessary to point out every contingency of the system here. I was merely pointing out the particular error the OP made. _____________________
|
|
Dragon Keen
Registered User
Join date: 24 Apr 2006
Posts: 245
|
07-12-2006 10:50
good thing a pass of this law would have absolutely ZERO effect on in-game gambling
 |
|
Shirley Meiji
Moxie Drinker
Join date: 8 Mar 2005
Posts: 165
|
07-12-2006 10:53
I am quite aware of that, but didn't feel it necessary to point out every contingency of the system here. I was merely pointing out the particular error the OP made. likewise. |
|
Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,147
|
07-12-2006 11:29
Check out the votes http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll363.xml Did people pay attention in school? Or at least watch "I'm Just a Bill" on Schoolhouse Rock? Just because Congress votes and passes something doesn't make it a law. _____________________
|
|
Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
|
07-12-2006 11:35
good thing a pass of this law would have absolutely ZERO effect on in-game gambling How do you figure? |
|
October Jezebel
Registered User
Join date: 5 Feb 2006
Posts: 22
|
07-12-2006 11:38
One must point out that while the use of real money in a random win/loss system within most of the US is illegal (gambling) the use of tokens or other valueless things in a random win/loss system (gambling) is not. that the tokens are purchased for money and can be turned in for real money does not change the value of them from zero.
in other words, gambling for L$ is legal, even under this law should it pass because L$ are not real dollars any more then Chucky Cheese tokens and tickers are real money. |
|
Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
|
07-12-2006 11:46
One must point out that while the use of real money in a random win/loss system within most of the US is illegal (gambling) the use of tokens or other valueless things in a random win/loss system (gambling) is not. that the tokens are purchased for money and can be turned in for real money does not change the value of them from zero. in other words, gambling for L$ is legal, even under this law should it pass because L$ are not real dollars any more then Chucky Cheese tokens and tickers are real money. This is completely false. It is illegal to gamble with anything that has value or is representative of value. Casino gambling is done with worthless tokens that are exchanged for money by the casino, yet it is illegal in most places because the tokens are representative of value. If Chuck E. Cheese ran a booth outside their establishment where you could exchange their tokens for money, it would be illegal to gamble with their tokens. Similarly, given that LL supports the exchange of USD and L$ (and, in fact, when you trade L$ payemtns are made to/from LL alone), I highly doubt a claim could be made that gambling with L$ is any more legal. |
|
Doubledown Tandino
ADULT on the Mainland!
Join date: 9 Mar 2006
Posts: 1,020
|
07-12-2006 13:57
Looks like someone needs to break out their old "school house rock" videos. Check the one "how a bill becomes a law"
_____________________
http://djdoubledown.blogspot.com
|
|
Chris Ellsworth
Registered User
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 33
|
07-12-2006 14:01
"Yes, I'm a bill, I am only a bill, and I sit here on Capital hill....."
 |
|
Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,147
|
07-12-2006 14:03
Looks like someone needs to break out their old "school house rock" videos. Check the one "how a bill becomes a law" Didn't I just say that? _____________________
|
|
Jellin Pico
Grumpy Oldbie
Join date: 3 Aug 2003
Posts: 1,037
|
07-12-2006 14:07
Check out the votes http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2006/roll363.xml Obviously you didn't watch Schoolhouse Rock Boy: Woof! You sure gotta climb a lot of steps to get to this Capitol Building here in Washington. But I wonder who that sad little scrap of paper is? I'm just a bill. Yes, I'm only a bill. And I'm sitting here on Capitol Hill. Well, it's a long, long journey To the capital city. It's a long, long wait While I'm sitting in committee, But I know I'll be a law someday At least I hope and pray that I will, But today I am still just a bill. Boy: Gee, Bill, you certainly have a lot of patience and courage. Bill: Well I got this far. When I started, I wasn't even a bill, I was just an idea. Some folks back home decided they wanted a law passed, so they called their local Congressman and he said, "You're right, there oughta be a law." Then he sat down and wrote me out and introduced me to Congress. And I became a bill, and I'll remain a bill until they decide to make me a law. I'm just a bill Yes I'm only a bill, And I got as far as Capitol Hill. Well, now I'm stuck in committee And I'll sit here and wait While a few key Congressmen discuss and debate Whether they should let me be a law. How I hope and pray that they will, But today I am still just a bill. Boy: Listen to those congressmen arguing! Is all that discussion and debate about you? Bill: Yeah, I'm one of the lucky ones. Most bills never even get this far. I hope they decide to report on me favourably, otherwise I may die. Boy: Die? Bill: Yeah, die in committee. Oooh, but it looks like I'm gonna live! Now I go to the House of Representatives, and they vote on me. Boy: If they vote yes, what happens? Bill: Then I go to the Senate and the whole thing starts all over again. Boy: Oh no! Bill: Oh yes! I'm just a bill Yes, I'm only a bill And if they vote for me on Capitol Hill Well, then I'm off to the White House Where I'll wait in a line With a lot of other bills For the president to sign And if he signs me, then I'll be a law. How I hope and pray that he will, But today I am still just a bill. Boy: You mean even if the whole Congress says you should be a law, the president can still say no? Bill: Yes, that's called a veto. If the President vetoes me, I have to go back to Congress and they vote on me again, and by that time you're so old... Boy: By that time it's very unlikely that you'll become a law. It's not easy to become a law, is it? Bill: No! But how I hope and I pray that I will, But today I am still just a bill. Congressman: He signed you, Bill! Now you're a law! Bill: Oh yes!!! _____________________
It's Official! Jellin, you are soooooo FIC! Fabulous, Intelligent and Cute |
|
Adriana Caligari
Registered User
Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
|
07-12-2006 14:08
This is completely false. It is illegal to gamble with anything that has value or is representative of value. Casino gambling is done with worthless tokens that are exchanged for money by the casino, yet it is illegal in most places because the tokens are representative of value. If Chuck E. Cheese ran a booth outside their establishment where you could exchange their tokens for money, it would be illegal to gamble with their tokens. Similarly, given that LL supports the exchange of USD and L$ (and, in fact, when you trade L$ payemtns are made to/from LL alone), I highly doubt a claim could be made that gambling with L$ is any more legal. This was covered in a thread some time ago. To quote the TOS 1.4 Second Life "currency" is a limited license right available for purchase or free distribution at Linden Lab's discretion, and is not redeemable for monetary value from Linden Lab. Linden do not ( at present ) sell or buy Linden $ - they clearly state they are worthless and are part of the game. The fact that you can ( and do ) buy them using Linden's software from other people is immaterial - If anything, the people selling them to you would get into hot water if the gambling bill hit SL - not LL. It is a very nice piece of cover that protects LL quite nicely. _____________________
Maker of quality Gadgets
Caligari Designs Store |
|
Ricky Zamboni
Private citizen
Join date: 4 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,080
|
07-12-2006 14:15
This was covered in a thread some time ago. To quote the TOS 1.4 Second Life "currency" is a limited license right available for purchase or free distribution at Linden Lab's discretion, and is not redeemable for monetary value from Linden Lab. Linden do not ( at present ) sell or buy Linden $ - they clearly state they are worthless and are part of the game. The fact that you can ( and do ) buy them using Linden's software from other people is immaterial - If anything, the people selling them to you would get into hot water if the gambling bill hit SL - not LL. It is a very nice piece of cover that protects LL quite nicely. If I buy L$ through LindeX, who charges my credit card? LL does. If I sell L$ through LindeX, who sends me USD? LL does. From a transactional point of view, I'm dealing solely with LL in my currency purchases. As the quote goes, "Calling a tail a leg does not make the name fit". Just because the TOS claims L$ are worthless doesn't make it so. In this case, it would be the U.S. government who gets to decide if gambling with L$ is legal or not. And given the fact that (a) SL users use L$ as a proxy for cash in licensing their own IP to other users, (b) LL strongly advertises that anyone can make real money in SL, ans (c) LL actively supports and derives revenue from the exchange of USD and L$, I doubt Uncle Sam would believe the assertion that they have no value. |
|
Gabe Lippmann
"Phone's ringing, Dude."
Join date: 14 Jun 2004
Posts: 4,219
|
07-12-2006 14:18
Did people pay attention in school? Or at least watch "I'm Just a Bill" on Schoolhouse Rock? Just because Congress votes and passes something doesn't make it a law.  _____________________
go to Nocturnal Threads
 |
|
Adriana Caligari
Registered User
Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
|
07-12-2006 14:24
If I buy L$ through LindeX, who charges my credit card? LL does. If I sell L$ through LindeX, who sends me USD? LL does. You buy Linden from another user. You sell linden to another user. Linden Labs merely handles the transaction. If I arrange insurance for company A with Company B and charge 5% commission - I am not involved if company B goes bust or doesnt pay up on a claim - I am merely a broker. That is all that the lindex is - a broking house - it passes money from A to B ( and takes it's cut in commission ) Linden Labs do not buy or sell Linden$ ( although they have mentioned selling them ) _____________________
Maker of quality Gadgets
Caligari Designs Store |
|
Maximillian Desoto
Max's Landfall Bar & Dock
Join date: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 323
|
07-12-2006 14:27
Linden Labs do not buy or sell Linden$ ( although they have mentioned selling them ) Ahh, but they do!! They sell me 500L$ every week, for the low, low price of 72US$ per year! |
|
Adriana Caligari
Registered User
Join date: 21 Apr 2005
Posts: 458
|
07-12-2006 14:29
Ahh, but they do!! They sell me 500L$ every week, for the low, low price of 72US$ per year! No they give you 500 worthless in-game tokens - that you could not sell back to them if you tried. You can sell them to someone else - as mentioned above. _____________________
Maker of quality Gadgets
Caligari Designs Store |
|
baystreet434 Avis
Registered User
Join date: 12 Jul 2006
Posts: 19
|
07-12-2006 14:33
[deleted spam]
|
