Today's Update - Anti-Push What ???

Hi:

Could someone please explain the effects of the new anti-push stuff in today's update?

For example, after the update can a land owner prevent pushing of avatars? Orbiting? Floating? Anti-Grav Weapons?

Any differences betweeen effects on getting pushed/orbited by a bullet or a HUD Push Weapon?

I've read posts that grifers will still be able to "cage". Anything else a landowner will still have to watch out for after the update??

The answers to your questions

/108/a1/124230/1.html

Thanks Cindy, but after reading that and other threads on the subject I'm still confused. Could someone please state here in one place a complete answer to the question ?

Basically, to move you around in a Push-restricted land, either the owner has to do it, or a physical object has to repeatedly collide with your avatar. Expect to see more complex cage systems to emerge post 1.11.1

So, if a land owner enables this:

* The land owner, and objects owned by him, or objects set to the parcel's land group, can still use Push, which means his security orb can still keep people out of the parcel. His elevators and vehicles and other push stuff will still work, including an orbiter HUD if he has one.

* Any object that you own can still affect you, so your vehicles, wings, etc still work for you. Note that a vehicle which allows you to carry passengers, and which relies on push to operate, might fail to work for your passengers if you enter a push-protected parcel.

Push weapons, orbiter HUD's and any other devices that use PUSH apparently will not operate on people or objects within the parcel, no matter where the shooter is standing. So a griefer armed with such a weapon can shoot all day, and no one inside the push-disabled parcel will be affected.

However...

A griefer can still shoot you as soon as you step out of the protected area, and there are tns of other annoying griefer tactics that don't use Push. This change eliminates the most easily abused ability, the one that any idiot who wants to cause trouble can pick up and use instantly. But it doesn't solve all griefing.

This solution also relies solely on the owner of the parcel to enable this protection. If you're on Linden Protected Land or somewhere else, and the land owner hasn't bothered to enable this, then the new protections are not available to you. There is no way to apply this protection to a person - only to a parcel of land that you own.

Where is all the fun going? Carries on like this they may as well rename it dull life or even worse first life!

Things like orbits go outside how the game was designed. They use multiple scripts to bypass the system of exponential diminishing returns on push that was built into the system. To fix the system, you either need something like what we're getting with 1.11.1, or only allow one script per object. The former is obviously the better solution, by a wide longshot.

Dull life. That is great!!! and dear god... first life.. ZOMFG I totally forgot my Zoloft prescription!!!!! And yeah where is allt eh fun going. People make all this cool stuff like guns and orbitors and the like and you can't use them because LL has not made Space yet. Just a unstable parallel blob of mesh. It wouldbe pretty bad ass to fly out into space and lose all gravity.

Spike, is it really that big of a deal to you? I'm sure that the weapons sims / sandboxes will not be using this option, so when you feel the need to pull out the big guns and send people flying, just head over to one of those sims. Otherwise, if the only enjoyment you get from SL is orbiting the unsuspecting avatar in areas where push weapons are probably frowned upon, you'd probably have more fun playing an FPS type game anyway.

To be honest, the fact that we could push avatars into the stratosphere in the first place is fairly retarded.

And yet so much fun!!! Beat av sex. lol

You're clearly doing it wrong.

I don't understand why this is such an issue.

If Push was disabled EVERYWHERE, yeah, okay, that would be bad.

But I don't see why anyone would object to land owners getting the option to choose here.

The only reason ANYONE needs an orbiter on someone elses land is to cause that person trouble.

Its quite amenable to me. I'm a land owner. If I need Push enabled for a little consensual weapons play I can turn it on.

But lately the biggest benefactors of Push, at least on my land, have been griefer accounts trying to disrupt my home and business.

Far as I'm concerned this is the best feature they've introduced in a patch yet. Hopefully it won't be horribly broken or bugged.

How likely is this to be a valid issue? The only time I walk between properties is when I'm browsing random commercial districts. I teleport the rest of the time. Griefers largely stalk populated spots, not Generic Strip Mall #487.

Hon, if you like playing combat games, go to Jesse or Rausch, and stay there. Or better yet, log off of Second Life and go back to playing Quake, Duke Nuke'em, and Unreal Tournament. SL isn't intended to be a combat game, and I'm not volunteering to be anybody's live target. You like getting your tail blown off? Be my guest. Somewhere else.

How is your fun disappearing?

The only thing that are affected by the change are griefers, and people who shoot at unwilling targets.

Your pushes will always work on yourself regardless of where you are. Your pushes will work when there's a consensus to have a firefight and land owner enables group push.

I don't know about you but being pushed around when I don't want to be, while I'm supposedly on safe land, DOES kill my fun.

Agreed.

I used to like exploring, and I used to like shopping. I can do neither comfortably when I can't tell from one step to the next is I am about to enter a live-fire zone. It would not surprise me at all if griefers started setting up sniper nests outside popular malls and venues, to shoot anyone who ventures too near the edge, and wanders past the line of safety.

When I started in SL, less than a year ago, I felt safe walking around new sims, seeing what sorts of stores and interesting builds were there, and trying to make new friends. In the past several months I have given up entirely on exploring.

Now, even if the owner of the land for the mall that I teleport to has enabled these new protections, I have no way of knowing I am safe, short of pulling out a gun and trying to shoot someone. And I have no way of knowing if the parcel next to this one is safe, or if the Linden-owned road is... I've gotten to where I shop by teleporting to a specific store, rushing to make my purchase, and then teleporting back home as fast as possible, to avoid being a target.

I haven't had a chance to fire up the new client yet. Is there any visible indication at all that you're standing on land that has push-disabled? Like the 'no-build' or 'damage enabled' icons? Or do I have to keep clicking on the ground ahead of me and looking at land permission, like I am carefully probing the trail ahead of me in a combat zone with a wire, to detect land mines? Is there any way yet to be assured, before I teleport to a location, that it is 'safe' from push weapons? I do not think there is, other than asking the land owner directly, via IM, prior to going to their property. Assuming, of course, that you know who the actual land owner is...

Sadly not, and a big ommission methinks.

Lewis

I write gun scripts for Carlos Weapons...arguably the best weapons in SL...and I agree that the difference between 50,000m and one million meters is a joke. Both take so long to fall from that you just tp out.

That being said, and as I've stated in a few other threads, this restriction AS A SOLUTION TO GRIEFING is an utter joke.

Being pushed was the least offensive griefing tactic I've ever encountered. It removed you from the presense of the griefer thereby preventing you from enduring more of the same.

Griefers though don't just quit and go play with their Xcite! parts when you remove the most common tool...they go get the next tool and resume griefing.

Unfortunately for all of us LL just got read of the lest offensive of their tools...that void WILL be filled in short order and the results will not be a lot of fun.

Unfortunately also LL STILL will treat abuse reports with as much intensity as they have in the past...virutally none. And our business of selling weapons to retaliate will continue only you won't be able to push them away, you'll have to use some of the same annoying methods they'll be using...methods that are as likely to be annoying to others standing around as to the griefer.

You want to get rid of weapons outside of battle sims? Then freaking deal with the abuse reports in a way that actually DECREASES griefing.

LL is telling you all you can't protect yourself and find your own justice IN THE SAME BREATH they are telling you they won't lift a finger to protect you by their LACK of action.

I had a few gay friends that were constantly harrassed by neo-Nazis...I think they filed so many abuse reports their fingers bled. LL banned temporarily yet the same actual PEOPLE kept coming back over and over. Where IS the justice? Not in the hands of LL that's for certain.

It's a big step, but to ultimately combat greified we'd need, as you said, LL actually policing it's own turf.

But... less orbitting means we have a fighting chance to fire back.
Yeah, TOS violation to return fire.... fucking crock.