Why can't I find good land/neighbours in SL?
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Dana Bergson
Registered User
Join date: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 561
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06-13-2006 21:40
From: Lady Hightower Unfortunately, this morning I awoke to find my ocean-- gone. A large land mass had been created during the night, leaving me with a puddle and some waves.
Obviously this has repercussions beyond the aesthetic. My neighbors and I paid more for oceanfront, and economically this hurts us. Do we cut losses and run before the gaudy strip joint goes up in front of us? Hi Lady, this is a sore spot probably for many a landowner in SL, as, contrary to RL, the land mass in Second Life continues to grow. But can you tell us, where this did happen? Because it is very rare that the Lindens create a land mass where there was real ocean before. The land you bought, did it have a real "beach"? Or did it simply end at the sim border with void (looking like ocean) behind it? Because a sharp cut in the terrain usually signals that there will be land appearing there in the near future. Or was there ocean floor on the next sim, which a friendly neighbor raised to create some land where there was none before? I am interested in this issue because it is a huge problem for us land developers too. We create our baby continents step by step (those of us, who do not only work with isolated islands). And this means that a former ocean front (end of the world) might become land later. This is clearly visible at the moment you buy the land, though, because of said "sharp cut" in the terrain. |
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Ranma Tardis
沖縄弛緩の明確で青い水
Join date: 8 Nov 2005
Posts: 1,415
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cant get away from them!
06-14-2006 11:11
I was on my small plot of "crabgrass" yesterday when a person in the same sim started firing off ever kind of missile that you can think of. The pair started to fire missiles at me and my property. I called live help and got the send AR stuff.
The sim crashed and when I logged back on they were doing it again!
The strange thing was they were not even newbie! They owned the large plot of land.
I would buy a private sim and close it to all but a few but it seems like an expensive option for my hobby.
What is the defense against scripted objects short of turning off scripted objects in the land management?
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Desmond Shang
Guvnah of Caledon
Join date: 14 Mar 2005
Posts: 5,250
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06-14-2006 12:34
From: Ranma Tardis I was on my small plot of "crabgrass" yesterday when a person in the same sim started firing off ever kind of missile that you can think of. The pair started to fire missiles at me and my property. I called live help and got the send AR stuff.
The sim crashed and when I logged back on they were doing it again!
The strange thing was they were not even newbie! They owned the large plot of land.
I would buy a private sim and close it to all but a few but it seems like an expensive option for my hobby.
What is the defense against scripted objects short of turning off scripted objects in the land management? This is the sort of reason *why* people rent from Dana, myself and others. People can't get too rude for too long on a private island - even with a really 'soft touch' policy like I have, chronic problems can be dealt with. Also - just KNOWING it's a private island helps a lot. Truth to tell, I've yet to deal with even one issue like this. The reason? Because residents know that being mean like that to others won't be tolerated. It's a private island, not the mainland. With regard to ocean views, I don't know how anyone else does it, but this is how Caledon's expansionism deals with that: - if you are on land that is going to have its shoreline taken away with the arrival of a new sim, I offer a free move *to* the new sim, longest-term affected residents getting choice waterfront if they like. If I burn off 4-5 days getting it ready, I gift 4-5 days to the person that had to suffer the inconveniences of moving. I'd say about... half move, the other half stay. It is NOT a perfect system, but fair enough that everyone I've dealt with found it as fair as possible. Everyone likes to see Caledon grow and become more fun as a result. * * * * * There is a sort of irony - what I notice is this: 1) residents in a private sims for a high quality Second Life experience, 2) the same residents also having mainland property to 'do whatever' on 3) mainland and islands becoming more different daily due of this In a way, it's pretty clear that the Company is favouring the pleasantness of private islands fairly heavily this way, either through accident or design. Not a complaint, just an observation.
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 Steampunk Victorian, Well-Mannered Caledon!
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Lady Hightower
Registered User
Join date: 9 Mar 2006
Posts: 12
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06-14-2006 21:55
From: Dana Bergson Hi Lady, this is a sore spot probably for many a landowner in SL, as, contrary to RL, the land mass in Second Life continues to grow.
But can you tell us, where this did happen? Because it is very rare that the Lindens create a land mass where there was real ocean before. The land you bought, did it have a real "beach"? Or did it simply end at the sim border with void (looking like ocean) behind it? Because a sharp cut in the terrain usually signals that there will be land appearing there in the near future. Or was there ocean floor on the next sim, which a friendly neighbor raised to create some land where there was none before?
Hi Dana,
I think sometimes people with computer skills forget that there is a whole underclass of people who lack indepth knowledge about things like this. We were introduced to SL, started to play, had fun, but are learning as we go. NOW I know about sharp cuts, and end of sims, but when I bought, all I saw was an ocean- it never occurred to me to question whether it was temporary. And the seller had created a lovely sort of shallow area with waves that connected my land and that I COULD walk in, so it looked very real.
Maybe there's an "SL Land Buyer's Guide for Dummies" out there I should have read. But I do think it's important for LL to realize that expansion into broad markets has to take into some consideration the next (dumber) level of users like me. Right now I think it's a pretty savvy population overall. A lot of the people I speak with are in the business one way or another, either by vocation or avocation.
But-- tonight, the ocean is back. So I have no idea whether they erred, or changed their minds, or just actually listened and thought hmm. ok. If the latter, I am impressed and grateful. Or it may be gone tomorrow, or next week. It's still the end of the sim as far as I can tell, and not real ocean. |
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Axel Truss
ssurT lexA
Join date: 2 Feb 2006
Posts: 251
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06-15-2006 01:34
Just a quick bit of research then, if i were to buy a sim and call it "lagfiesta" (to scare bad ppl away). and allow only nice people like yoursleves there with nice rules ect, would u be keen?
or maybe
a name like
"axelville"
or
"we-love-axel town"
yeahh....
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MANIC CASINO!
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Dana Bergson
Registered User
Join date: 14 Oct 2005
Posts: 561
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06-15-2006 02:06
From: Lady Hightower I think sometimes people with computer skills forget that there is a whole underclass of people who lack indepth knowledge about things like this. We were introduced to SL, started to play, had fun, but are learning as we go. NOW I know about sharp cuts, and end of sims, but when I bought, all I saw was an ocean- it never occurred to me to question whether it was temporary. And the seller had created a lovely sort of shallow area with waves that connected my land and that I COULD walk in, so it looked very real.
Maybe there's an "SL Land Buyer's Guide for Dummies" out there I should have read. But I do think it's important for LL to realize that expansion into broad markets has to take into some consideration the next (dumber) level of users like me. Right now I think it's a pretty savvy population overall. A lot of the people I speak with are in the business one way or another, either by vocation or avocation. Hi Lady, sorry, if I did offend you with my questions. It was not intended that way.  You are not dumb certainly, but have obviously been inexperienced then and maybe the seller took advantage of that. People are coming into SL in great numbers and even those that consider themselves computer-savvy will have the same experiences because other computer software does not prepare you for the SL experience.  The reason I asked, was honest curiosity. I am in the land business myself (have a look at the OTHERLAND Archipelago, if you ever find the time  ) and I want to find out all I can about customers wishes, wants and attitudes. Contrary to some sellers on the mainland, we are dependend on the continued satisfaction of our residents. So, when you say, that you were not aware that the ocean might disappear later this is important and means that we have to explicitely point that out when we talk with prospective buyers. This might cost us a deal but will hopefully lead to a greater percentage of happy buyers. Good for our business in the long run. An "SL Land Buyers and Owners Guide for Dummies" would be a good idea. I dont think that this has to be done by the Lindens. Residents could do it just as well - or better. We will be collecting some how-to's on our website in the next few days. But many will consider our information biased probably. So a group effort by residents not directly involved in the land business might be a better idea. |
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Lady Hightower
Registered User
Join date: 9 Mar 2006
Posts: 12
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06-15-2006 09:54
Hi Dana,
Gosh, I wasn't offended, and am sorry if I sounded that way. Thank you for your patient explanations; I am a firm believer in communication for solving problems and avoiding future ones. I AM technologically challenged ( the admission of dumbness doesn't bother me a bit because I am OLD and know how little I know about many things). I have a son who works in computers and constantly have to remind him that many people have no idea what he's talking about. I frustrate the heck out of him.
I am having a great deal of trouble logging on right now. I crash every time it finishes loading. Is anyone else having this problem? Have no idea what to do. But the upshot is that I can't tell if the ocean has lasted the night or not. The last time I was on, some twelve hours ago my neighbors and I were very happy.
I think that's an excellent idea about letting buyers know about something that could change-- especially if it's a strong selling point, as an ocean view is. Taking advantage of people is normal, I guess, even if we would like Second Life to be a more idealistic version of RL. In my case, I don't really believe there was any intentional deceit, so much as the seller thought I knew what I was doing.
Agh-- crashed for the tenth time this morning. Guess I will give up.
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Dodge Dinkin
Registered User
Join date: 21 Apr 2006
Posts: 8
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06-16-2006 16:08
Hi lady, maybe check for new drivers for your video card, if that is a challenge for you ask your son it will only take him 10 mins or so. Regards Dodge.
PS Last time I looked the Ocean had Disapeared again.
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No one is above the laws of humanity!
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Lady Hightower
Registered User
Join date: 9 Mar 2006
Posts: 12
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07-10-2006 20:28
I really don't know where to post this. Several weeks ago, my oceanfront dissapeared, reappeared, disappeared, reappeared again. It has remained oceanfront for several weeks now.
Tonight the ocean front is gone, and a new land mass has been created.
Now I understand all the arguments that anyone with a lick of sense would understand that a land that ENDED could be expanded. I also read arguments that this hasn't happened in at least half the lifetime of SL.
What I do know is that despite my writing several messages to SL, I received nothing in the way of explanation. No offers of compensation for my investment, and no warning of this incipient change.
I am angry. Not just because of the loss of the ocean, but because of the cavalier treatment by SL. When a service company fails to respond to a customer;s concerns, then it should realize it rides the edge of customer disservice. I have had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, and had no warnings or explanations for any of it.
NOT GOOD CUSTOMER RELATIONS, not when you are asking for real money payments.
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Kerian Bunin
Rubbish
Join date: 24 Sep 2005
Posts: 141
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07-10-2006 20:37
From: Lady Hightower I really don't know where to post this. Several weeks ago, my oceanfront dissapeared, reappeared, disappeared, reappeared again. It has remained oceanfront for several weeks now.
Tonight the ocean front is gone, and a new land mass has been created.
Now I understand all the arguments that anyone with a lick of sense would understand that a land that ENDED could be expanded. I also read arguments that this hasn't happened in at least half the lifetime of SL.
What I do know is that despite my writing several messages to SL, I received nothing in the way of explanation. No offers of compensation for my investment, and no warning of this incipient change.
I am angry. Not just because of the loss of the ocean, but because of the cavalier treatment by SL. When a service company fails to respond to a customer;s concerns, then it should realize it rides the edge of customer disservice. I have had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, and had no warnings or explanations for any of it.
NOT GOOD CUSTOMER RELATIONS, not when you are asking for real money payments. This sounds like this. |
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Nyx Divine
never say never!
Join date: 11 Dec 2004
Posts: 1,052
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07-10-2006 21:41
From: Lady Hightower I really don't know where to post this. Several weeks ago, my oceanfront dissapeared, reappeared, disappeared, reappeared again. It has remained oceanfront for several weeks now.
Tonight the ocean front is gone, and a new land mass has been created.
Now I understand all the arguments that anyone with a lick of sense would understand that a land that ENDED could be expanded. I also read arguments that this hasn't happened in at least half the lifetime of SL.
What I do know is that despite my writing several messages to SL, I received nothing in the way of explanation. No offers of compensation for my investment, and no warning of this incipient change.
I am angry. Not just because of the loss of the ocean, but because of the cavalier treatment by SL. When a service company fails to respond to a customer;s concerns, then it should realize it rides the edge of customer disservice. I have had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, had an ocean, not had an ocean, and had no warnings or explanations for any of it.
NOT GOOD CUSTOMER RELATIONS, not when you are asking for real money payments. Ok I am going to TRY to be understanding.....but whoever ever told you that you had that undeveloped area next to you forever? I understand that you LIKED what was there...edge of the world view and all, but you can't seriously think that LL has to discuss and clear every new possible sim or expansion w/ all landholders in the area. From: Lady Hightower I also read arguments that this hasn't happened in at least half the lifetime of SL Huh? U jest. From: Lady Hightower No offers of compensation for my investment You are actually wanting compensation? Then you my dear are here for ALL the wrong reasons.
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Yes Virginia there is an FIC!
If someone shows you who they are.....believe them!
Don't be afraid to go out on a limb, because that's where the fruit is!
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Luthien Unsung
Registered User
Join date: 13 Feb 2005
Posts: 409
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07-11-2006 00:06
From: Wanda Rich I've only been is SL around 7 weeks now and this is my experience so far of owning land.
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Are there ANY nice land areas in SL where people actually do put thought into what they are doing or care about others around them? I have lived in two sims, my first land sim which i found as was your case, and the one I am in now (actually two because my plots cross over two sims. I have been really happy living by a volcano. My neighbours have always been nice,and they are very few, and we generally keep to ourselves. Not ALL builds on the mainland are ugly |
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Lady Hightower
Registered User
Join date: 9 Mar 2006
Posts: 12
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07-11-2006 12:16
First I wasn't jesting about the oceans disappearing being something uncommon. Somone posted elsewhere a list of the last time new land masses were added and for this particular area, it was 2004. There were quite a few people upset that this was happening.
Second, I didn't understand about edge of land at the time, had bought what was advertised as waterfront property, and paid more than usual. I wrote to LL asking about where the ocean went, mostly because the ocean disappeared and then reappeared twice and it seemed rather unpredictable. They said they would get back to me and never did. When a new customer is confused and asks for clarification, it is just good PR to respond and explain.
Third, compensation was a poor word choice. I didn't mean financial. I do think that adding a green belt, or a waterway between the old and new sim would be nice thing to do for those who have had waterfront for a long time and probably paid higher prices.
Last night, after weeks of a returned ocean, I was just mad to find it suddenly gone again.
In the great scheme of things, I won't lose much sleep over it.
But thanks for your sympathy.
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