Oh Boy! Where have I seen this before?

Ignore this. just pointing out possible views some might see but others might not.

1.) curbs the exploding greifalt population from entering 'civilized' regions.
2.) Give noobs an incentive to go premium.

I don't like where it's heading either.

Yes it's just you. That's an insulting analogy, IMO.

It's hardly apartheid when you can freely choose to give your payment info if you want.

If residents didn't have the power to change their status I'd agree...

But remember, even if a FREE account at registration didn't require payment info it can still be given afterwards when someone either moves up to premium or if they buy lindens from the LindenX.

SO it's not like your status is stuck as such for the life of the account. It can change anytime you want to by simple providing payment info to use for buying lindens, upgrading to premium or buying land, etc.


*huggles*
Sav

Yes.

You trivialise the latter by comparing it to the former.

Very different things. And to even equate the two might be seen as an insult to people that have and still are suffering from discrimination. The SL change is designed to better protect its consumers by giving them a generic measuring stick as to background of an anonymous person they might encounter or do business with. It has nothing to do with race, creed or color. It's usefullness though I'm not sure of.

Thank you Cindy.

That is not only offensive, it's completely ridiculous.
Likening restrictions of free accounts... IN A GAME... in an attempt to give people a respite from griefing to the horror and atrocity thas was Apartheid?

A game. One played by mainly first-world people who have never known a day of hunger, never seen real atrocities, but they understand and can empathize with Africa's plight because they saw Hotel Rwanda

Grow up.

And, before someone jumps on it, yes, I know where Rwanda is and I know where SA is. That's my point.

This was in no way intended as an insult merely a question as to wether or not it semed similar. My apologies to any who were offended.

I think that it is "over the top" as a comparision in some ways, but a valid analogy.

- LL is purposely segregating residents based on monetary status.
- They have stated that the game will be altered so that those in the lower monetary status will have restricted access to areas of the game. (they wont be able to do as much or access all areas etc.)

It *is* just a game, and therefore not the same, but this is a perfectly valid analogy to make IMO.

I have several avatars, some are on a creidt card, some are not. So the one's that are not will now be "second class citizens" in exactly the same way as racist or classist regimes function.

The answer that it is volountary is also not a good one, because they allow you five accounts per household, but only two on a credit card. So if you have an account, and your partner has an account, any third account at your household will be forever second class citizens. You don't have a choice unless you go out and get another credit card.

I disagree. One is about race, creed and color and has RW implications and emotion. The SL one is about a tiny bit of money and worse case doesnt allow you to visit virtual Club Snob. Even spending $1 US could get your status changed in SL. Not the same IMO.

<looks at sign>

<looks around>

<thinks about walking away>

That is the most insulting pairing of thoughts that ever walked from some sick neurons to a sick mouth. Next you'll want to compair it to the Holocaust?

Considering you have 2 posts, I have to assume you are trolling for response. You will not get another from me, so enjoy this one.

So in which upcoming patch will the Lindens implement the genocide option?

It's a ridiculous analogy that trivializes the real discrimination that went on in South Africa, as someone else pointed out. If you want to exaggerate things, go ahead, but it's not a great way to have a meaningful discussion on the issue.

If I'm an unverified SL resident, all I have to do is spend a few dollars on Lindex. I'm now verified.

If I'm a black citizen of South Africa during apartheid, all I can do is risk my life - and possibly lose it - in open revolt trying to change things.

Honestly, this thread is a good example of Forum Drama writ large.

Do we have Rezmods still?

Bad analogy. You're born with your race. You're not born with your payment verification for SL.



Whereas before, you couldn't even make that third account at all.

Yup. My thoughts exactly.

Cindy, I am not in favour of racism apartheid or anythign of the sort and I don't think it should be trivialised, but I still think that this is a valid analogy.

- Sl is anlagous to RL
- In RL you have situations where people are divided by stupid things like race, religion or economic status.
- In SL we will now have a system where people are being divided by economic or account status.

Seems to me that it's an analogous situation. That's all I am saying.

SL "society" will now be stratified into two or more "types" of citizens, each with different privileges and each identified by a label in their profile. It's not the *same* as the situation in RL but it is definitely an analogous situation. I don't see how anyone can argue it's not.

It's indicative of the state of SL social "engineering" and the approach LL is taking to their so-called "virtual society" that they have chosen this method of solving the alt problem that they created in the first place. I think its quite ironic and needs to be pointed out.

People were ten thousand percent against Aimee's suggestion when neg rates were axed that griefers or bad folks should carry around a label that indicated they were such. This rather minor move was considered "abhorrent" and "disgusting" by some. Yet here we are all happy to do the very same thing, but at the same time to include great handfuls of innocents in this "labeling" and further to actually restrict their movements based on the label????

This is seriously hypocritical on a lot of folks parts IMO.

Valid argument? You're not serious, right?

Now if the Lindens were taken over by a bunch of griefers, had all their land and inventory stolen and were forced to hang out only in the cornfield (or worse, in the Serenity Woods Sandbox when Yiffy's testing gestures! *grin*), if Philip was restricted from visiting and travelling in his own game... a game he and others created and own... it's theirs, but these griefers come in and take it over and make the Lindens work and make the game profitable for the griefers...

If something like THAT happened, it'd be a little bit closer to mirroring, but you know what? THERE'D STILL BE NO COMPARISON!

Good lord. Read.

To say that restricting people who are voluntarily playing a game is like going into a country, violently supressing the native people and setting up a regime that continues to supress them for hundreds of years... to say that the two have ANYTHING in common other than the most bullshit semantical argument is...

Well, disgusting doesn't begin to describe it. Revolting, maybe? Ignorant? Elitist?

It can be all these things and more!

Hello? Have you read the same status info labels I have? I can check in my thesaurus but I don't think Unverified will come anywhere near Griefer.

What hypocrisy?

I for one will not stop talking to people because they are unverified. I don't check profiles by default. If they act like asses and I had a doubt, I might take a look. If I was a mature business owner, I'd probably be happy to use it.

But that is not appartheid.

Rather, you have unlimited free accounts (something you won't find in MMOG's, for instance) who will find some zones they won't be able to access. At that point, they might decide (their choice) to simply provide a CC number and become "Payment Info provided" or whatever the label is. No payment involved and they can access more.

It means SL is now open to more people and, if what you get without any registration requirement doesn't meet your needs, you can decide to take an extra step.

Again, where will it say "Griefer" or "Ban me" in an unverified user's profile? Hypocritical indeed.

2 different proposals and a very invalid comparisions. Just a company giving you totally free access to an online world and allowing you to register properly if you need to.

Wendel

No it's not. Becoming verified is voluntary. It is an option. Being the subject of racist bigotry does not have an opt-out clause.

It's possible that some citizens will discriminate, sure -- but I submit that they're already doing that when they check to see if someone was born after 6/6. That was unfair to people who paid for Premium or Basic accounts after 6/6, who came to SL to stay.


It already was before. Every society has strata and castes, it's how humans organize themselves. The difference here is that the account flags have a purpose -- to help residents protect ourselves from possible charges if underage residents attempt to access adult content.

The alternative is to do nothing and allow those teenagers to walk into any XXX club in the grid without a problem. I'm against that, even if it does discriminate against teenagers -- I'm more afraid of American Attorney Generals than I am of being perceived as prejudiced against young kids.

The whole argument falls apart right there. You get one identity in RL, period. For your analogy to even begin to be on the same page, SL would only offer you the chance to have one account ever during your lifetime.

Full access to a software game/platform based on willingness to provide verification information to the company that owns it is hardly comparible to a social caste system, especially when you start tossing around terminology like "citizens". We're customers.


Personally, I think restricting access according to your account verification status is a smart move on LL's part, at least for business purposes. The only thing unlimited free accounts with full access helps is the account tally on the front page of the website - its a time and money sink in all other ways. With verification, you're one step closer to becoming a paying member and putting money back into LL...or at least behaving more responsibly with the account you've verified.

Cory... I love you. You are exactly right.
Customers.

Oh, come on people! "Join Date: Jun 2006" "Posts: 2"

Blatant misuse of racism in Godwin proportions as the basis of their thread?

*slams down a sign that says 'DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS' in this thread and walks off*

<Foolish tiptoes out before Fenrir disembowls him>

I continue to be amazed every day by how many posters seem to forget that SL is not a right, it is a privilege. You are choosing to utilize a service for largely entertainment purposes, yet you have the option of doing so entirely free of charge to you. If you decide SL is either not worth the effort of providing verification or not worth the money for a full account, YOU are making that choice. If that choice means your time in SL will face restrictions that don't exist for paying customers, how is that anyone's fault but your own? Why demand equal treatment on unequal terms? And yet we'll compare this to racial segregation? There is absolutely no comparison, and anyone who thinks otherwise needs to pull themselves away from SL and back into the RL promptly. Honestly, a more accurate comparison would be this:

Tom uses NetZero to connect to the internet for free at a max speed of 28kbs. All of his emails include a postscript advertising NetZero's free service, that he cannot remove. Tom attempted to sign up for an eBay account, but was rejected due to eBay's TOS barring users of free email services. Now Tom can make two choices:

A)Tom continues to use NetZero, deciding that not having to pay for the service is a benefit that outweighs the restrictions he faces.

B)Tom decides to switch to Earthlink. He now pays $15 a month for service, but his speed has doubled, he is able to sign up for ebay, and there are no longer advertisements in his email.

LL offers its service to those who can't pay for it, or simply choose not to. Not all companies would do the same, irregardless of the fact that this move is more for LL to better shape SL to their widescale scope than simple generousity. Even in situations such as with residents outside the US who do NOT have wide access to credit cards through no fault of their own, most businesses would-guess what? act like a business and not give a damn about anyone that lacks the potential to be a paying customer.

I really don't expect this new resident 'caste system' to have that much of an effect on the attitudes of older players towards newbies; with or without this information in a user's profile, it's generally not very hard, at least in my limited experience, to distinguish between a genuine newbie and an insta-alt griefer. Odds are this; if you generally enjoy meeting and helping newbies, you're not going to care to distinguish between full accounts, free accounts, you'll continue to help everyone. If you typically steer clear of newbies due to uncertainty on their sincerity for SL, now you'll be able to decide for yourself if proof of their legitimacy makes them worth your time. And if you've always tried steering clear of newbies, well, you'll...continue to do so. As for existing players with unverified/free accounts, I highly, highly doubt the rest of SL will automatically start blacklisting you irregardless of your experience, abilities, group memberships, account age, and etc., but that doesn't mean further restrictions won't be implemented by LL themselves.