Down the Road: Will the L$ = USD$ end up being trouble for LL?
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Newfie Pendragon
Crusty and proud of it
Join date: 19 Dec 2003
Posts: 1,025
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12-28-2005 18:07
From: Yumi Murakami It's a strange thing to say, but this isn't actually true.
If you enjoy creativity, you can make things in Blender, GIMP, Poser, etc. without needing to pay tier fees, worry about lag, and with more options and flexibility. And once you've done, you can save them on your local disk. Sure nobody else will see them, but if what you were enjoying was creating them, you've still done that, right? Yep. Did all that for years, and still frequently do stuff like that. From: someone The usual reason to do these things in SL as opposed to anywhere else is not just for the joy of creating them, but because you enjoy having an audience. And that's a big deal. Because if SL gets big enough that not everyone can have an audience - and it's starting to do that - then the motivation for those extra people to create drops. Likewise, if SL gets big enough that getting an audience in SL is as hard as getting one in RL then there's no motivation to create in SL. After all, there are free sites for hosting art and similar things IRL, which costs money to do in SL! I for one dont do creation of content in SL for that reason at all. I do it because to me SL is simply another Blender, GIMP, Poser, etc. I give away and sell my content because once I've created the stuff, there is no reason I should hoard my creations, when there are other people who can also enjoy it. In addition, comments and feedback from others helps not only areas in my creations that may need improvement, but also is a good way of coming up with new ideas for future content. If I wanted an audience, I'd have better luck at the local comedy club. - Newfie |
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Chip Midnight
ate my baby!
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 10,231
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12-28-2005 19:17
From: Yumi Murakami IThe usual reason to do these things in SL as opposed to anywhere else is not just for the joy of creating them, but because you enjoy having an audience. And that's a big deal. Because if SL gets big enough that not everyone can have an audience - and it's starting to do that - then the motivation for those extra people to create drops. Likewise, if SL gets big enough that getting an audience in SL is as hard as getting one in RL then there's no motivation to create in SL. After all, there are free sites for hosting art and similar things IRL, which costs money to do in SL! I agree with you. Having an audience is a big part of it. I disagree that it's more difficult to get an audience as SL gets bigger. I think it gets easier. How often do you hear people talk about their favorite designer and it's someone you never heard of before? A lot of what dictates what gets in front of someone's eyeballs is who they socialize with, where they hang out, the tastes of their friends, and so on. It may be harder to find grid-wide fame than it once was, but I think it's easier to find a fan-base in general. There's a lot more potential fans milling around now 
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Zuleica Sartre
Registered User
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 105
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12-29-2005 08:52
LL doesn't view SL as a game so why would they apply ANY mmog game-type attitudes to it?
I am still amazed by the number of people that think LL is making a game. YOU are making SL a game by what you choose to do in it. LL wants a virtual world where YOU can play a game, work and earn a living or conduct a hybrid of virtual and real world business if YOU decide to.
Yes, eventually the IRS and other RL concerns will need to deal with SL as more and more people use it as a platform to do business and make RL $s. Eventually the world is going to have to deal with virtual worlds and their relationship to the 'real' world in a myriad of ways instead of just ignoring them.
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Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
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General growth allows special interests to achieve critical mass
12-29-2005 10:09
From: Chip Midnight I agree with you. Having an audience is a big part of it. I disagree that it's more difficult to get an audience as SL gets bigger. I think it gets easier. How often do you hear people talk about their favorite designer and it's someone you never heard of before? A lot of what dictates what gets in front of someone's eyeballs is who they socialize with, where they hang out, the tastes of their friends, and so on. It may be harder to find grid-wide fame than it once was, but I think it's easier to find a fan-base in general. There's a lot more potential fans milling around now I agree with this also. As SL grows, we see increasing numbers of "special interest" groups clustering together and occupying entire sims, or multiple sims, with common themes. These themes inspire the creation of special events, special objects and special environments that would not appeal to others, but reinforce the community of their particular "special interest" groups. The Elven themed sims and the Gorean sims are prime examples. Not everyone shares that interest, but it makes it possible. Without a critical mass, there is insufficient "audience" to attract the creators.
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Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
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12-29-2005 10:58
From: Yumi Murakami The usual reason to do these things in SL as opposed to anywhere else is not just for the joy of creating them, but because you enjoy having an audience. And that's a big deal. Because if SL gets big enough that not everyone can have an audience - and it's starting to do that - then the motivation for those extra people to create drops. How does SL getting bigger automatically make it harder to have an audience? It seems to me that it'd make it easier, everything else being equal, the more people on the more likely some of them will like your stuff. |
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Deem Goodliffe
Registered User
Join date: 28 Dec 2005
Posts: 37
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cash baby...chicks dig tha cash......
12-30-2005 01:42
I came to sl for one thing and thats to meet ppl and to test out my computer skills.
If i can hold a sl store and sell making sl cash heh makes me think maybe i got a moneymaking purpose in rl too but to use sl to make money in rl no never even hinted in my mind and wont.
Alotta my friends already claim games like these are moneymaking scams and I do not need em calling me a scam artist.
I am DEEM father of Gothop the only thing I scam is Goth Chicks outta their clothes.
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Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
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12-30-2005 08:22
From: Argent Stonecutter How does SL getting bigger automatically make it harder to have an audience? It seems to me that it'd make it easier, everything else being equal, the more people on the more likely some of them will like your stuff. The problem is that if they don't see your stuff, they'll never realise whether they like it or not, and the more stuff there is out there (ie, the more people there are around) the easier it is to get yours lost in the mix, especially when all the information channels are basically the same for everyone. |
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Frank Lardner
Cultural Explorer
Join date: 30 Sep 2005
Posts: 409
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Information as the other scarce SL commodity?
12-30-2005 08:45
Yumi, are you saying that as SL gets so big, and so many can create great/good/bad/indifferent products and services, that the other scarce commodity (besides land) is valid, relevant information about product and services?
Information overload is sometimes cited as the downside of free access to the publishing ability of the Internet. Is the same thing happening in SL?
If so, is a private developed service for evaluating and highlighting products and services appealing to particular tastes a marketable commodity?
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Lordfly Digeridoo
Prim Orchestrator
Join date: 21 Jul 2003
Posts: 3,628
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12-30-2005 10:42
From: Frank Lardner Yumi, are you saying that as SL gets so big, and so many can create great/good/bad/indifferent products and services, that the other scarce commodity (besides land) is valid, relevant information about product and services?
Information overload is sometimes cited as the downside of free access to the publishing ability of the Internet. Is the same thing happening in SL?
If so, is a private developed service for evaluating and highlighting products and services appealing to particular tastes a marketable commodity? A very interesting point. Everyone always talks about the upcoming "information economy", where the people who can provide/process/get vast amounts of information and organize it properly will be king, as opposed to manufacturing/transportation tycoons. SL seems a prime candidate for this type of thinking, but it seems to have been unused thus far. I sorta half-envision Hiro Protagonist's job in Snowcrash, where he's given essentially micropayments by various corporations for his ability to find/create information on a wide variety of subjects. Half Wiki, Half Google.
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Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
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12-30-2005 10:50
From: Frank Lardner Yumi, are you saying that as SL gets so big, and so many can create great/good/bad/indifferent products and services, that the other scarce commodity (besides land) is valid, relevant information about product and services? The other scarce commodity is people's participation - whether it's in attending your events or visiting your store to find out if they like your stuff or not. Information is relevant to that, but not completely so, because the information source just becomes another location competing for people to participate (by paying attention to the information). Arguably as more people join, the amount of "available" participation increases, but so does the amount of demand for it and it thus gets spread more and more thinly - and more and more randomly. |
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Jonathan VonLenard
Resident Hippo
Join date: 8 May 2003
Posts: 632
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12-31-2005 07:37
From: Aaron Levy I just got done reading Robin's interview to ypulse.com ( http://ypulse.com/archives/2005/12/virtual_teen_en.php) about the Teen Grid and was really interested to see that Robin mentioned some of the teens are making US$200 a month selling their stuff. I was surprised actually, to see that LL has chosen to even promote the Teen Grid as a potential money maker. Not because I don't mind people making money -- I paid for almost all of my family's Christmas and travel expenses this year through my own Second Life endeavors. But I'm concerned about the outlook down the road. Sooner or later the numbers are going to get big enough for some pencil pusher at the IRS or the SEC or elswhere to notice. I'm concerned because I think LL might be shooting itself in the foot by practically always -- and yes, it IS almost every interview, news release, etc. -- talking about all the money to be made. I personally think LL would be better to stop pushing this so much and focus on the creativity and possibilities. Let people figure the money part out when they get here, so they can enjoy the place before signing up with big dollar signs before their eyes. Why? Because I hate to say this, but the majority of people who join SL will not have the technical knowledge, time or education to create a profit in SL. WHICH WOULD BE FINE, if LL wasn't promoting SL (Adult & Teen Grids) to be a place to make real, hard cash. These people come with the expectations that all they have to do is log in, create something and they'll make money. They're not aware that they need to login, learn LSL, Photoshop, Poser & THEN create something, THEN market it, THEN support it and THEN *MAYBE* make enough to cover your land tier. These people leave SL disappointed and their land sits around stagnant and unused. LL has lost a customer, but the biggest loss is to Second Life, who lost someone who came for the wrong reason -- if they had come with different expectations, maybe they would have taken the time to really get to know Second Life, the people, the platform and maybe, in that process, learn enough to find their niche and start creating, not to make a ton of money, though that possibility is there, but to contribute to the SL society as a whole. edit: Sorry for the run-on sentences. It's late and I'm too tired to edit. Hope you get my point. Great post! But whats a land tier  I love my lifetime account, i never need more than 4096
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"Now that we're here, it's so far away
All the struggle we thought was in vain
And all the mistakes, one life contained
They all finally start to go away
And now that we're here, it's so far away
And I feel like I can face the day
And I can forgive
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Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,147
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12-31-2005 08:48
From: Jonathan VonLenard Great post! But whats a land tier I love my lifetime account, i never need more than 4096 That's nice... can you contribute something to thread? |
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Jonathan VonLenard
Resident Hippo
Join date: 8 May 2003
Posts: 632
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12-31-2005 09:05
From: Aaron Levy That's nice... can you contribute something to thread? that wasn't nice i didn't realize to post you had to contribute something to the discussion, i suppose the forum has changed since the days i used to post here and 90% of posts were worthless, but oh forum master, i shall bow to your power.
_____________________
"Now that we're here, it's so far away
All the struggle we thought was in vain
And all the mistakes, one life contained
They all finally start to go away
And now that we're here, it's so far away
And I feel like I can face the day
And I can forgive
And I'm not ashamed to be
The Person that I am today"
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Aaron Levy
Medicated Lately?
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 2,147
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12-31-2005 10:18
From: Jonathan VonLenard that wasn't nice
i didn't realize to post you had to contribute something to the discussion, i suppose the forum has changed since the days i used to post here and 90% of posts were worthless,
but oh forum master, i shall bow to your power. Why even respond when the only reason you posted was to point out you have 4096 of land for free forever? How did that even have anything to do with the thread topic? I'm not the forum master, but even if I were, you didn't bow to my power as you said, because you have YET to add anything on-topic to this thread. I'm just really, really tired of stupid posts that have nothing to do with the thread they are posted in. They serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever except to bloat post counts. |
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Yumi Murakami
DoIt!AttachTheEarOfACat!
Join date: 27 Sep 2005
Posts: 6,860
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12-31-2005 10:22
I think the division between "making money" and "creativity" is talked up too much on this type of thing.
The nature of SL is, unfortunately, that if something doesn't make money it loses money. I think that if it wasn't possible to sell L$ for US$, there'd be much less creativity because tier would be horribly overpriced.
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Cocoanut Koala
Coco's Cottages
Join date: 7 Feb 2005
Posts: 7,903
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12-31-2005 11:57
Sorry for the interruption - I put my post in the wrong thread!  coco |
