Feelings on the ResMod program

Already the ResMod program has gotten off to a very rocky and controversial start. I am curious how other people feel about it, as most people I have spoken to about it seem to be opposed to it.

For me, I just don't think it was necessary. The forums are not that bad most of the time. Sure, there are threads that flare up a few times a week. That's the nature of human interaction, it can't all be hugs and positivity.

I certainly don't think it was very well thought out at all - and the confusion we've seen on the part of the resmods bears that out. I am also unsure just how much LL anticipated what the community's reaction would be.

I have a nagging fear that it's the first rumblings of player government, something Robin told us would never be compulsory.

Then there's the fact that they had to let them in on the details of ARs because of the way VBulletin works, which apparently wasn't something they intended to do initially - it seems as though they simply had no choice once they discovered that VBulletin doesn't have that level of granularity with regard to moderator privileges.

Since the forums and in-world are now interconnected discipline-wise, I think we either have to have full disclosure of ARs - names of the accused, what they are accused of, and who is doing the accusing, in BOTH places, or no disclosure whatsoever in either place, like it was prior to the advent of the resmod program. Having some players, who happen to have been picked for resmod duty privy to that info can only lead to problems, in my mind. It's just a matter of time before someone leaks out who reported who, and we have a bigger situation than necessary on our hands. (For the conspiracy theorists - NO, I am not afraid that someone will catch me or anyone else filing tons of ARs - I've used that function on very rare occasions, and that even goes for some of the most famous trolls.) I am simply worried about consistency.

Now, before some numbskull(s) try to tell me I am criticizing the program because I am "jealous" - let me just say that I would rather drink Liquid Drano than be a resmod.

In the end, I guess I'd like to hear the specific reasons that LL felt this was necessary. Are they so flooded with ARs that they can't keep up? If so, this "solution" seems like overkill. I don't know why they simply can't issue warnings to those who repeatedly make frivolous ARs.

So far I really don't have a problem with it. I can't say that I've noticed any detrimental effects, and aside from Talen's strange warning the moderation that I've noticed has seemed reasonable. I give it a big fat *shrug*

I am one of the people who aren't sure what the need is. I'm not sure that you can reconcile having all the different styles of moderator work together. It is uneven in application. It also seems apparent that the forums of late are harsh and it affects some users negatively, so though I would call for no changes, I can see that beyond my personal feelings there may be a tone that needs adjusting.

However, the forum system should function as it was. Posts reported. Those that don't abide by the TOS and Community Standards get suspended. If the mods are there to ease the LL workload, then there needs to be a better way to get this done. If LL felt it difficult to adjudicate on delicate issues/threads, then having a group of mods with different views on how to moderate isn't going to fix that either.

So far I'm very skeptical, given how it started and how we know LL communication and application to be. That said, I'm willing to give them a full cycle to see what happens, but I don't feel particularly comfortable with it.

So here I am again with no solutions. If I knew LL's real motivation I could offer one, but I am seeing conflicting motivations.

I will say that this has worked very well on other forum communities.

I didn't vote, and this is just my slice of the pie, but in my life experience... there've been a lot of things that were "rocky" and "controversial" but led to really beautiful butterflies, so to speak. What's going to be fascinating is how someone feels now, compared to awhile down the road, and comparing those. It may be kinda wacky like "Remember the 80s?".

Right now, I'm feeling a lot of twists and turns, like the blood that comes when a baby's born... the pain and suffering during that process... before the tears of joy. I spend a lot of my Second Life on the Forums, ever since the first day I started asking questions. People come and go, lots of new faces... and some familiar ones returning.

It's a weird situation for me because I'm a Linden, and in a really cathartic way, it's opened up my appreciation for opposing opinions on this. I think to myself, "If I was solely a Resident today, would my opinion be different?" And I've thought that over for the last few days, and no, it wouldn't be. I wouldn't be a ResMod because of my chaotic nature, and indeed, I'm not a moderator in the Jeska-calibre, but like the duck that aspires to be an eagle, I look up to the Residents who are doing this. I cheer them on. And what about the system? I'll explain more in a bit.

I just had this mad, beautiful idea: today is Philip Glass's birthday. He's one of my fave composers. He did a soundtrack for the Qatsi trilogy, and the movies feature--among other things--timelapsed video of many things on the planet in motion, accelerated in motion after they've happened. It's been parodied in The Simpsons and many other places. And this dream came to me: screenshots of every single post ever made on the SL Forums, flashing in one hyperkinetic ball of light, darkness, and everything in between. Showing the growth from the very first post made here, to... who knows?

The ResMod program itself is transforming, and I have corroborative visuals in my mind's eye--wish my building skills inworld matched up--of these crystals coming together, sort of like how the T-1000 reformed after being frozen in liquid nitrogen and blown up (and without the damage), and they're sort of lilting, and melting... and gelling. And the ResMod program, it might have been perceived as some kinda alien threat at first and blown to pieces, but now, it's joining with a smile on its face, assuring us that it comes in peace; the ResMods the goodwill ambassadors of the mothership that wants to take all of us on a journey of discussion.

Today, Jeska posted "Forum ResMods - Tweaks to the Program" with clarifications about several concerns:

1. Privacy
   
2. Identifying Problems
   
3. Pool System
   
4. Continued Tweaking
   

And on top of that, please remember the essential emphasis of the ResMod program is not because things were in a really bad place, but because there's good here--and it can get even better.

Until there is a scaleable solution for peace in the forums and on the grid - resident participation is coming.

How many Enforcer Lindens must there be on the grid 24/7, when the in-world concurrent population is 100,000?

One can approach resident participation with denial - yes, that's a strategy I suppose. But maybe not the best one.




A modest proposal:

Residents moderate their own in-world land and group forums successfully.

Perhaps each thread can be moderated by the thread creator?

Simple, understandable, and enforcing a natural sort of order - pretty soon, some folks won't post at all in certain other folk's threads if a problem develops.

Just a thought.

Thanks Torley, I missed that announcement somehow. I am especially glad to hear about the privacy part.

Certainly sounds nice, as did the original idea, but the practical application has left much to be desired and I don't know that many of the problems have been resolved from the tweaking. Mainly, how do the moderators determine how to modify? Each user's expectation is different and the moderation is inexact, to put a kind term to it. This was not the place for yet another untested, shortsighted implementation.

Like I said, I'm willing to give it a go, but given the polarizing personalities, I have a hard time seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. That is as far as successful ResMods go. I personally don't think there needs to be any moderation beyond what was.

I know what you mean!

I'm an empiricist, so I really don't get a lot of feel out of theories. I take care to share that when I express things, hence my mention of my life experience. "Practical application" to me is a YUGE thing.

I will explain a little more of what I've seen that's actually happened. I'll say this is merely my viewpoint but I do want to share... as you prolly already know, there is a Support and Discussion forum for the ResMods. Any questions about decisions made can be brought up there to keep everyone on the same "page". And more questions? Ask Jeska! So ultimately, it comes to Linden Lab as it always has, with the ResMods providing a nurturing, guiding hand.

It is true each of us carries a different perspective... and how different opinions are what both attracts and repels on the SL Forums. Already, I've seen some really lucid reasoning, ResMods asking each other for what should be done. It's not a "lone gun" operation; this is teamwork. And there's a publically-published Second Life Forum Resident Moderators (ResMods) Manual.

The recent tweaks were done in response after the original call, listening to the community's opinions. Frankly, I wouldn't have it any other way. Further practical application will require actual--actions!--so even though the picture is blurry now, I'm really hoping ameliorations will make it much clearer.

As a firm example of this, as time passes on, Jeska is establishing a knowledgebase of how to deal with specific instances as they've actually happened. For example, a popular one would be "General of Off-Topic?". This knowledge will thus be passed on to future ResMods, so the wisdom from one generation to the next.

In a way, it's sort of like a beginner cook learning from a master chef's recipe. Or a novice musician who has just learned "Twinkle Little Star", opening the sheet music to Paganini's virtuoso works. The foundation is there, but within the self--much development must happen. Travel along the way, with growth, with the support this community provides... those have been there before know. But this is a new experience, so none have been here before.

This is consistent with Second Life being a journey. You can set goals for yourself, and there's a lot of leeway to explore, but in case you get lost, there's a guiding hand to help you along the way.

I dont mind having players who want to volunteer to help out, but I am absolutely turned off that one of the resmods selected is a regular abuser of the forum rules for posting and the CS. As recently as last week this member posted a hostile post containing crass profanity, F**K, BULLSH*T, DAM*, words that if I were to post unedited in this post now I would be subject to sanction by the very same resmod who used them in the post last week. The aggregious post also contained personal insults against another member.

The resmod I mention has posted in the past the admission of receiving a disciplinary warnign for forum posts that violated the rules, and many posts made by this resmod have been edited by Jeska to remove statements that violate the forum posting rules as well as the CD.

How many members were ineligible for participation as a resmod because they received a disciplinary warnign in the past for a bad forum post? How many would be hit with a sanction for violation of the forum rules if they used crass profanity and posted personal insults agaisnt another member? Most of us and so should this resmod be held up to the same standards.

HOW THE HECK DID THIS PERSON QUALIFY TO BE ONE WHO JUDGES THE REST OF THE MEMBERSHIP!!

Oh yea, this has been reported to Jeska and Robin, with links to the offending posts and the admission of disciplinary action on the past. How much do you want to bet that nothign is done.

The post made just last week was also reported, and guess who gets the abuse report? You got it, the very same resmod who broke the rules. How much do you want to bet that this gets swept under the table.

My position is always the same...the same old message...regardless of what rules LL decides to enact, THE RULES MUST APPLY EQUALLY TO US ALL.

I think its intolerable that one who has regularly abused other members with nasty posts, who violated the PG posting rules and CS rules against crass profanity and harassment, and who has received a disciplinary warning in the past for a forum post, and has many posts that had to be edited to remove the abuse is now judging and correcting the rest of us.

It disgusts me. Anyone wanting links to the offending posts as well as the posted admission this resmod did receive a disciplinary warnign please IM me or send an email to [email]katykiwi@gmail.com[/email].

I'll email you, katykiwi...

i didn't vote either.

Cris, thanks for putting up a poll with this thread! i agree with Torley that it will be interesting to see what opinions are when compared from now to later. would you be able to basically recreate this thread in a couple weeks? someting to gauge the ResMod progress, or lack thereof, once it has had time to bake a while?

-

as for how necessary a ResMod program is.. i agree that it might be a little overkill, but it won't be as time marches on. this is the perfect time to introduce this, while we're relatively small in our user-base compared to what it will be come the end of this year.
i imagine once we hit 250,000+ active accounts that moderating the forums will be a much bigger job than it was before the ResMod program.. and Jeska was already being overburdened, i'm sure. i mean, remember when we all got excited at the "most users online" when it topped 100? then 200? you know, numbers that are now normal to see at almost any time of any day. by the end of the year, we'll probably double to triple the amount of users online at any given time.

moderation would become a nightmare for Jeska, nigh impossible. there needed to be a resolution to this and hiring new official moderators could have been done, but why not involve the community? it's what we're always asking for, is it not the nature of the community to want to be involved in everything? i know this is off-center of what we're normally talking about, but it's also part of LL's decision and how they wish to see us involved as well.
and if they do want to hire any new official Linden forum mods, what better pool to select from than one made of residents who are familiar with the subject matter found throughout these forums? with the additional "training" that being a ResMod would provide, if and when such time comes, there will be a short list of ResMods who have done a fair and decent job and who show enthusiasm in performing said task. whether this happens or not, extra moderation will indeed be necessary by the end of this year. starting now helps to get the glitches out of the way before the forum community grows to numbers unmoderatable by only one or two Linden mods.

so, while i understand the concerns expressed, i think we have yet to see exactly how this will all gel together and whether it will be a good idea to retain the program or not. some major issues were dealt with inthe first round of "tweaks".. if anyone hasn't read them, please do so. i was very impressed with the new developments and am further emboldened as to the future of this program because of them.

i think we should wait until the third generation gets rolling before really judging whether this is working or not. so far, i have seen a lot of good coming from this and a lot of effort being put forth by the ResMods to unsure that there is a significant amount of dignity in this program. i have also seen where discrepencies (OT vs General, consistency in moderation, adherence to criteria, and so on) have been cause for concern and i hope that they will all be addressed and rectified.


just to let you know, had i voted in the poll above, i would have voted "Undecided".

opinion unchanged.

If it smells like it - be glad you didn't step in it.

It's all the same people day in day out on the forums, so now Linden Lab decides to let them moderate themselves, i dont think thats a bad idea
It's kinda scary to post something on SL forums, pulease dont flame me!

Seconded. I spend way too much time on the forums, and but for the people complaining about it, I don't think I would have much noticed. I'm not saying the ResMod aren't doing anything, just that which they are doing, they are doing with grace.

Since I was one of the ones that voiced my concern, I'll follow up with a big thank you for stirpping our names off the abuse reports. That was my only concern with the program. From what I have seen, the resmods are doing what they are suppose to be doing, and I like the other "tweeks" that Jeska posted as well.

So endeth my contribution to this issue. Good luck resmods. Its a thankless job, just like being a parent.

*edited to add since Aimee is counting stats.... I would have voted YES, but being the too literal type of person I am, I voted "Other, post below."

These results so far (51-25% against) show slightly LESS support for the resmod program than Wuvme's poll last week (49-29% against).

Jeska, Torley, do you guys have any sort of plan for a roll back under certain conditions? A plan like "if the plurality are still against ResMods after such-and-such a date we will scrap the program." At this point my impression is that you guys are going to make small concessions over time until people get bored of complaining, or the major critics just stop participating in the forums.

One other question ... Obviously you guys on the community team are advocating and supporting this program. Why? From a customer service point of view, shouldn't you guys be a bit more impartial and generally lean towards the customer's desires? Just as I, as an ordinary resident, would lobby against this ... other ordinary residents may lobby in favor of it. The Lindens, on the other hand, should be quietly taking it all in and adjusting their customer service strategy in such a way that it serves the customer.


I'm Pro-Choice.

Other.

I'm basicly favor of the concept, but I think the current itteration needs to be scrapped and re-launched to wipe away the bad flavor the current itteration has.

First guess? Less work for them. Also, SL forum polls are about the opposite of a "statistically representative sample", that is, margin of error is roughly +/- 481%

LOL. Well I agree about the polls being innacurate, but if there is any way to detect widespread support for this program, I'm not exactly feeling the love here.

EDIT: However the polls seemed to have swung to a near tie within a minute...so maybe I will have to eat crow on this one.

It's not something I would want to be involved with. From what I gather, the player mods on the TSO forums were hated. However, I don't think the ability to police ourselves is a bad idea. LL is really giving us the benefit of the doubt here, it would be a shame if we screwed it up.

What about anonymous mods?

I don't think it was necessary, we could have used something like this maybe months ago, but that ship and drama has sailed.

I think it is unethical and possibly illegal to have customers do the same work you have paid staff do. Doing it for the community just does not fly. Community service to rich people does not give you a gold star, if you want to do community service, call the Red Cross or the Y. Falling for a coporations PR stunts is just well, umm yeah. If you want to work for free, come paint my hallway!

The ResMod program has created more drama than existed before it came it came along.

How are we supposed to know who a ResMod is again?

Also it seems to be a bit of a failure. How long was that thread still open after people started tossing the "tard" word around? It seems like the lack of moderation is still at an all time high. Improvement? None.


Permissions Still Suck

I've been wondering about this myself. To me this is a bad move on the part of LL.

Yes because the only realistic option is to close the public forums and only allow us to post to the Linden forums which are focused enough to make moderation easy for a few employees to cover.