What makes a good shopping area now?

Benchmark it the same way you would websites back in the dialup days. If your area doesn't load fully within a certain timeframe from an empty cache, you're doing something wrong. Simple works. A bazillion textures competing for download bandwidth don't.

But what do I know

Lag and rez time is the most important thing for me. I left an area last night which I almost certainly would have bought something from, simply because I could not be bothered to wait for it all to load.

edit: Oh, and easy navigation and movement. Open areas and wide streets so you don't keep bumping into things while you're trying to fly around. Have similar things in similar areas - don't have a tattoo shop then a shoe shop then a place that sells poseballs then one that sells comfy chairs then another that sells tattoos etc.

I like to think that my partners and I have a great shopping area, but i'll post a description here and please feel free to tell me how you would make it better. I'm always open to critique. ^.^

We have a centralized landing point in the center of our (approximately) 11k plot. Immediately to your left are signs pointing you in the direction of the Main Store and Cafe, Freebie area, Garden area, Rental Shops, etc. We thought that TPs seemed pointless, as our parcel is not all that large. In a very large open area you'll find places to sit and chat (NOT camping chairs, though we have a cute little campfire area) and a fountain, wishing well, etc. Nice places to cuddle up too.

As for the stores, it is not hard to find the main store, as it is the largest building straight ahead of you when you TP in. I used, for the most part, the same 5 textures throughout the entire building structure, so once those load, most, if not everything, is loaded. Inside the main store, our items are somewhat scattered about but we try to keep things grouped, IE: furniture, home decor, gadgets and whatnot in their own areas. There is space to move around and while we do have an upper floor (yes, with a smallish spiral staircase) it is open, so you can just as easily fly up rather than use the stairs. Scattered throughout the stores are small areas to sit (as it is also a cafe) though they don't get in the way of moving around the store. Our office is on one end and we have a meeting room on the other end, both with doors in the entry so that the casual shopper need not worry about them.

Our rental shops are two levels, in a U shape around a central open area. There are only 2 trees here for ambiance, hopefully not enough to get in the way. I used the SAME texures to make the shops as I did for the main store so the idea is that once you've loaded one store, you load them all. Content-wise, we don't regulate what our vendors can use but we do require them to keep ative scripts to a minimum. I'm still looking for the solution to hovertext. Sadly, I think the only way is to space out the shops, which takes up landspace or not allow them at all. *shrugs* We shall see in the future.

All in all, I think our setup is comfortable for most, though i'm sure there are some that would say it's not the greatest or even that it totally sucks. Meh to them

Oh and the only time we ever have lag in our sim is when i'm on the roof at 3AM playing with physics (That was not intentional, neighbors, and I'm sorry! lol)

I go straight for the individual stores.... I'm tired of MASSIVE malls and whole sims that go on FOR EV R...
I used to love shopping in SL.. the malls were limited to 4-5 places and they were small enough that getting around them wasn't a 3 hr event. Now.. whole Sims are nothing but shopping areas.

what I'd like to see.... speciality hubs.... Men's (because so little is available)
Women's stuff would have to be divided into shoes & clothing,hair and jewelry.

I know it's not possible.. but it would be convienent.

one more thing.. just a gripe.. more than once I've seen an "event" that was a posting of something new offered.. only to TP there and be in the middle of a shopping sim or nothingat all , and no sign of the store I was looking for insight. * sigh* when that happens I TP out.. w/o even looking for what I went for in the first place.

I agree with most (but not all) of what Argent said. I don't want phantom handrails and vendors, though.

When I'm shopping, I'm mostly looking for something specific (so make your Find descriptions accurate and precise, please), though I'm open to browsing if the area looks nice, seems like it might have other things I'd want, and is not an enormous pain. To be honest, I really prefer to do my shopping (or at least my browsing, since I buy very little) in Web market sites, like SL Exchange or SL Boutique. It's much, much faster than even the lowest lag in game area, both in terms of finding the kinds of items I want and loading their images. So most of the time, if I'm going to bother browsing in game, that shopping area or store has to offer me something a website can't. Now, this can take the form of offering inventory that is really good but not available on a site, but usually, it means exploiting the fact that SL is a VR environment. Which means nice builds.

What makes an area look nice to me?

* Realism, for any area. This means no buildings the size of hangers, with inventory up the ceiling (unless you're, you know, actually making a hanger). This means realistic textures and prims, and little details to add verisimilitude. This means layouts that are realistic for whatever you're building. Even if you're making a fantasy mall for fairies and angels and elves, if you don't have things grounded in some sense of reality, it winds up being just a mishmash of stuff. A world already full of floating, rotating cubes has no need or place for magic.

* Making it look like a real world shopping area is a good strategy. Dwellget and Whispering Winds (I think that's the name of it) do a good job of this, even if the latter was horribly laggy.

* Making it an interesting place to explore is another thing I like. House of Shaea is a good example of this: it doesn't look like any sort of earthly shopping center, but it still pays heed to the laws of physics and is interesting to wander through. Just be careful that things are easy enough to find (see: not being a enormous pain).

What makes an area not an enormous pain for me?

* Not too much lag. I understand that lag is the trade-off for those realistic textures and little details I want, but if I can barely move around at all, my patience is eventually going to run out. Whispering Winds is a nice area, and I wanted to see more of it, but I got fed up after looking at about three shops and I doubt I'll be going back anytime soon.

* Not too small. If my camera is regularly being blocked by walls, it's a pain.

* Easy to navigate. This means directories, possibly with teleporters, if you sell more than one kind of thing. This especially means that if your shopping area also doubles as an exploring area, and you've got inventory hidden away in nooks and crannies, you provide frequent and clear ways to teleport between inventory areas.

* Easy to move through. This also means no spiral staircases, no tiny walkways without handrails, and no phantom handrails. Make handrails transparent with textures if you don't want them visible, but I don't enjoy toppling over the sides of things.

* Boxes instead of vendors. I'm probably the only person who feels this way, I know. The thing about boxes is that, even when their textures haven't fully loaded, you can get an idea of what's in them. A shop full of half-loaded boxes gives you a lot of very basic information up front. If things are really not your style, or not what you're looking for, you can wander off and go do something else. With a vendor, you're not getting all that information at once -- you only get information about one. Piece. At. A. Time.

ohhhh shopping, this is a topic I love to discuss.

I agree with willow, I like places that are spacious and inviting. Also, the shops with stability is what I look for nowadays. Ya know the ones that you know where there at without having to look them up anymore. One thing I would like to see designers do is get rid of the old. Some of my favorite designers have things still up that they made 2 years ago. For the love of gah get rid of them and make some room. Have a retirement sale on anything over a year old (unless of course that is all you have lol.)

*sounds like forest* That's all I have to say 'bout that.

MJ

I like to search for an item, such as hair, then tp right to the store.

Then I want to stay where I land until the selections for hair rez in front of me.

I don't like wandering around a store looking for something.

At the very least, the store should provide signs directing the customer to the items.

The look of the store isn't important to me, I'm interested in easy of shopping (low lag, fast rezzing, no walls/doors blocking the way etc).

As an aside, I think the best location for a store is near a road or waterway. I often explore, and follow a road or waterway to avoid rezzing buildings. Also, I find many cool builds are near water or a road. It seems while the price for hub land has plummeted, the price of road and waterfront land has increased dramatically.

Yeah I was wondering how other people felt about placement next to water, roads and other geographical features. Next to a road or linden land or water would make sense as it's somewhat visible.

I just still seems sort of odd to find stores and huge malls right next to someone's nubie cabin.

The place where you click on the sign what item you want to buy and then a shopping trolly appears and take you straight to it. Brilliant!

I am a gurl who loves to go shopping!! so guess I saw something to give me a push to add my comments
lately when I shop, I have been veering towards the island sims.. themed, you know? based on what I am looking for. I have tried going to shop at the ones with the games going on, camping chairs , etc.. but usually give up after waiting for things to rez so i can see them and poof off to somewhere else.



Yes I think that is a great concept! Where was it I went just recent, hmmm... oh yes.. the Depoz islands? ( I think its called) you land in a central hub, they have a board with all the stores, areas to go.. you click an area and this CUTE little shopping cart appears, and it whisks you away to the area of your choice.. lol.. it was really adorable (need a seat for a child) ahem.. was much to quiet.. lol I stayed there almost a hour just riding that little cart.. great idea

PS.. if i have the area wrong.. please correct me

Luv Cry

Micky Doctorow asked me could he develop my 12,000M area. I think I mumbled yes and I had to check the land ownership box to make sure I was on my own property when he was done. He took sloped, water/roadside land in a older sim and turned it into a outdoor shopping area that is very chic and navagational. The Shopping Plaza houses many different vendors but it doesnt look like a garage sale at all. I applaud his designing skills.

not to toot my own horn but I think my store has many of the features mentioned on this thread so far.

No ceilings - you can fly in or TP in - whatever your style is, more than one door also
I have set my P2P land in point so that you land as if you were entering or walking in from the front door.

my store was right at a hub, so most people walked in from that entrance or flew in from that direction.

I have everything separated into departments with clear signs: Dresses, Prim Gowns, Corsets, Tops & Trou etc
I also list myself in find and try to be as specific as possible in terms of what I carry in my store.

I have a wall dedicated to my latest 3-4 items labled: New Items

I have a wall dedicated to themed or seasonal designs labled: Featured Designs.

Most of the store is a wide open floor plan, with most items sold in individual boxes along the wals, and occasional vendor (never more than 10-15 items inside) alongside

Even though the store is not huge, there is a teleport system to get you around to each main area.

I think that most designers these days are also avid shoppers (like me!) and I have seen that reflected in how we choose to create our own stores

As for males and the one stop shop - try The Gordian Knot - a very easily navigable mall dedicated to male clothing, skins, shoes, hair and accessories - all in one open air spot.

I think that the way Hiro Queso (my landlord!) has his islands set up is very helpful as well. While the hub system he has no longer works, he does still have groupings of commercial and groupings of residential.

so I had pictures of what I sold on the outer walls of my store. I still keep those up, because the way Temotu is set up, people might P2P into a neighboring store, but then wander and walk around to see the rest of the commercial enterprises there, as they did before.

many of us shop keepers have gotten to know each other as well, so it makes for a nice community

I want to make people's shopping experience a good one, so I've had to take a lot of time away from my R&D to design a great area:

•First, a large dome-shaped area with two main floors, connected by a central stairway. The stairway should NOT be spiral or anything that will cause excessive bumping. Remember the move control is not very good anyway. The stairs MUST face the front doorway for easy exit. (Some people think teleport prims can replace stairs, and I won't dispute that, except I prefer stairs which add character to the room.)
•The interior walls will be specially textured to allow for description of what the nearby vendor is selling. (Unfortunately I put "clothes" for one category instead of specifying which type, but I wasn't going to sell many clothes anyway.)
•A helpful store directory right next to the stairs. I'm still not sure if I should go with a map or a text description. Maps are cumbersome to draw by comparison, but probably worth the extra effort. (Most stores don't need maps/directories since they are small enough.)
•A great custom vendor! The individual touch is what makes great stores have that distinction that so many wish they had. I have developed a couple of interesting vendor designs, but what is more important is the scripting, which should give you exactly what you want in a vendor.
•Since the vendor will be a custom job, you should MAKE SURE to test it out before committing it to your shop.
•Content. What's the point of opening a clothing store if all you know how to make is T-shirts? Far too often I've shopped somewhere and there wasn't anything remotely approaching what I wanted. But specialization is not a bad thing if you can get it across to the public.
•Some stores have no doors and make you descend from above to enter them. This is ridiculous-- not everyone wants to fly, and some people hate flying into/out of buildings. Other stores have a phantom door, which will confuse many people who keep touching the door trying to get it to open. The really good stores, of course, have an open doorway and (if needed) front stairs.
•Some people will suggest a box of freebies. I think that freebies are important, but far too often it's the same stuff that everyone already got five times over. If I put out any freebies they will be new content from me. Also, when one's shop is still new, freebies are not the way to go just yet.
•Advertising should be minimal and noninvasive. If there was a shop called Impeach Bush Hair Salon, you can guarantee nobody will visit it. 'Nuff said.

Now, my shop is still not ready to be opened, so I can't show it off as a good example. But there are plenty of shops out there. Why not visit one at random, walk around and note the good and bad things about it? Sometimes one learns by experiencing.

Wow, so many great tips here.

Something I've observed often in SL is that great packaging often equates to great product. One reason being, because the same person who makes what's inside the boxes, also makes the boxes themselves too. That's different from how it's often done offline, by different art agencies and whatnot. So with the added control, you get a greater degree of how you'll be showcasing your schtuff to sell. I wouldn't have believed it at first, but over time for me, judging a book by its cover has most rung true--and I'm not even a "judging" type!

In addition to an overall compelling design, I also like the little details. One of my first ever was seeing what Nicola Escher was doing in Avalon, and she left a bunch of stuff out as she was working on it. It wasn't messy in an unpleasant way. Rather, it gave me a sort of "I'm busy mussing about" feel, the sign of a laborious craftsman. Even in a very tidy store, there are indications of this, like boxes in a white Apple Store queued to be sorted to another room, pamphlets fanned out a little bit... all of that.

What also really got me was seeing some Resis do simulations of things we didn't "actually" have in here, like folded clothes and hangers. And I was like "You have GOT to be messing with me!" and I really zoomed in because that attention to detail is sooo lovely. It can be frivolous and impractical, but when it's icing on the cupcake, it's delicious.

Stores don't have to be straightahead recreations of something brick-and-mortar, but those types of cues are welcome, especially for those who are new here. I'm thinking of the way Jean-Luc Ponty or Vanessa-Mae play electric violins. There are certain articulations which can be performed on electric violins easier, in part because of mechanics, and also because of the often stripped-down design. Tunings can be set more flexibly, lending an ear to all manner of new sounds. And yet, from what it's descended: it's not totally removed.

I don't know who else does; I enjoy walking through stores in Mouselook, feeling as if that's thru my own eyes. When I do so, I'm mindful that A+D or the left+right arrow keys now strafe, so I want to be careful not to bump into racks.

Keeping Profile Picks info uptodate and accurate? Crucial! Revise landmarks if your store's architecture changes too. I've had the unfortunate experience of ending up in the back lot on occasion, or trapped between walls.

Above all, make what's yours: yours. I see Residents who don't strive to market a brand identity or a commercial image; they just are. Sucks for me to try to explain that, but being comfortable with your creations, even if it comes eventually and not all at once, is a sign of renewed confidence in yourself... which warms your customers too.

Oh, yes, this is another nice feature if you have to have multiple levels for some reason.

So many good ideas for shopping areas. While I personally like individual stores, if I were to go to a shopping area (mall) my first concern would be low lag. I also like boxes so that they can rez in and I can look at them all at once. Usually I will land in a store and just zoom around with my camera. Railings and stairs matter not because of that.

The shoppes in Larsen are not all open and ready for business yet, but you should stop by there and take a peek. Barnes did a fantastic job building this shopping area. I Love the little shops, it is so cute. There are only about 20 stores in all.

Well! I just became the Store Manager for the Forest Store, in The Forest! So, it looks like I will get a chance to implement some of the nice suggestions from this thread in an existing mall. While I can't completely restructure it, I certainly do plan to implement some of the great ideas from this thread, like a decent Mall Directory that shows who has stores in the mall, and where to find them.

We already have many of the desirable features. Low-lag priorities, open design, easy floor-to-floor access by teleport elevator or by flying, 'adult' area seperate from general shopping...

Keep those suggestions coming, and I'll try to make our mall a place people will really enjoy shopping, and where the merchants can enjoy good sales volume, as well.

haven't been there in a while, but unless things have changed... my suggestions would be:

1. Offset the holes on the top and second floor, so you can just step through the hole on the top floor and land on the ground on the second floor, without having to fly or teleport.

2. Phantom the roof, or at least put another offset hole in it.

3. Make the interior partition walls thicker to reduce or eliminate the llSetText bleed-through, and do the same with the outside wall by the free vendor area.

4. If you can make the path to the store from the sim's landing point a little clearer and easier to follow, that would be good.

Thank you, Argent, for the specific suggestions!

I am not sure if I can get them to edit the building to make the straight shaft of holes up the center into something that is offset. But I have found that if I walk a short distance at a normal pace before I go over the edge of the center hole, my forward momentum carries me to a landing on the next floor down, on the far side of the holes. (They eliminated the half-circle wall on the shaft, partially to facilitate that maneuver.) The teleport button elevator was installed to make it easier to go up and down.

There is a hole in the roof, aligned with the holes on the other floor. So one could land on the roof and fly down to any level.

I definitely agree on the thicker partition walls! It's already on my list of changes to implement! I detest that bleed-through.

They recently added much clearer signs to guide people from the telehub at the sandbox up the hill to the Store. They also recently installed a small network of teleport stands in The Forest that will take you to some of the more popular attractions, including the Forest Store.

-- Ceera

Maybe add alternating quarter-circle prims on the shaft, if they won't move them?

More detailed comments:

* The rocks on the upper part of the path are kind of uneven, and you get collisions sometimes if you're running.

* The garish animated textures on the last ramp up to the store level are amazingly ugly.

(FYI - Until the current Officers have voted on my appointment, I'm still in a trial period. So I can suggest changes to the Officers, but to alter the building or the surrounding land features, I have to grab an officer to get it done for me. Once they approve me, I'll be an officer in the group and will be able to make more changes myself. And any for serious changes, I have to run them by the Officers first anyway.)


That is a very good suggestion! I'll pass it on to them.


I agree. Again, I'll pass that on to the people who landscape that area.


Yes, it is. I think that was the first attempt at 'helping people to find the store'. It was that way when I first came to The Forest, before there were any other signs indicating what 'that big building on the hill' was. I will see what they have to say about making walking/running access easier.

I normally fly to the store, as my home is just across the creek fron the site. Yet I usually fly to the main entrance and walk in from there, rather than flying in through the hole that I know is there in the roof... Hmmmm.

Rich people buying my stuff.

Not having overlapping textures in the store's construction.

I mention this because I just recently saw the worse example of overlapping textures I have ever seen in an otherwise nice enough looking store. It is hard to believe the person who built it was seeing the overlapping, possibly they had their object detail level set to lower than max or some other reason accounted for this abberation.

The other problem I have had with stores lately is so many textures they wouldn't all load, so the other end of the store was always gray textures. So to put that in positive terms, use some vendors or have one texture with both a top and a skirt or a top and pants.

Directional signs, big signs that you can read from far away.