End or Fix First Land

Oooh, good point...

Though they'd get the same effect by having the First land distributed among the regularly auctioned sims, and probably still get the same amount for the sims themselves.

Would forcing first land on the auctioned sims not screw it up for anyone wanting to create a themed sim?

If it's $30 more to get a sim though "alt farming" first land than to buy it outright, and you end up with land that's worth less because land in a "first land ghetto" is unattractive, it doesn't seem to make any economic sense.

OK, how many of the people posting to this thread so far actually purchased first land within the last month or so? Hands?
I've been a free basic account until yesterday when I took the plunge, upgraded to premium and of course - having actually read a few things - including much forum traffic, wanted to take advantage of one of the few perks given when upgrading. I also did this, having been in the game for some time and having my eye on a nice 4096 across from my girlfriends 4096 (which I have now bought). I've seen what becomes of first land after it gets sold and doubted I was going to stick around anyway, but I dove in, found a plot that looked like the surrounding purchased lots were getting bought by people intending to settle in, met a nice reporter from the messenger who bought just up the hill, and anyway, put the plot up for sale, since I was trying to offset the purchase of what I really wanted. I did not put it up for the pittance offered on the nasty signs, but put it up for a bit over market, with a note in my low profile for sale sign, to IM me to negotiate. I got an IM within a few hours from the owner of a neighboring plot who has a more ambitious project in mind, we negotiated, he ended up with a fair price - I took possibly a bit less than market, but more than I would have got from the land grabbers, and both of us were elated. I chose that plot since I felt it was likely a neighbor might want it for expansion, rather than add to the problem. If a 60 day wait had been enforced he couldn't get on w/ his project and I couldn't have gotten on w/ mine.

I like the idea of a mandatory education program, but feel it would be much more labor intensive (even if resi run) for the Lindens. As someone who just experienced it first hand, I guess I'd have to say leave it alone.

How many themed sims are there on the mainland that weren't set up by Linden Labs? About the only one I can think of off the top of my head might be Abbotts... and it's got a special reason for not being on an island. Have there been any themed sims on the mainland set up since the islands started being available?

Torley's right. It does evolve. That is what happened in the sim where I got my First Land(s).

I get tired of this constant business of always trying to take away whatever the Lindens give out. If First Land and stipends go, nobody but land barons will bother to be premium. And that will be the far bigger hit on the Linden pocketbook.

coco

Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't. T'was only a hypothetical thing though - the risks of getting all your accounts canceled if you do that is too high.

Hey, someone might want to do it one day. Although they'd need to buy the surrounding land too if they wanted imersion.

Ooh! Ooh! Me Sir! I did! I got a little plot on the edge of the sim just yesterday. I'm going to need some space for a project soon and renting is too restrictive for me.

The phrasing of your poll reminds me of the old joke "Have you finally stopped beating your wife? Please answer only with Yes or No!"

Hiro, while I agree that most First Land sims are not a beautiful sight to see after a few days your description seems more than a little bit exxagerated to me.

The profit margin you are describing simply is rediculous. Maybe there were one or two cases in the history of Second Life where a 512 plot in a First Land sim was sold at 10 L$ per sqm. But I guess it is a very rare case. 5L$ or a little more seems much more common to me. And a margin of 1.5L$ - 2L$ per sqm is perfectly normal in the land business. Anything less does not make much sense at all.

perfect example:
/108/c1/89855/1.html

I believe that problem is one of the reasons LL have been looking at bulk sales. As I understand it, the idea is to have the majority of people with plots renting from other users rather than LL - that way rules can be imposed that LL are unwilling to (and for good reason in my opinion).

Could someone please teach a class in how to create unbiased polls?

Of what? Of the fact that the resident finds it all a bit crass? Is he claiming to have been scammed?

the bitter awful truth no one wants to accept is, Second Life is a casino. No I am not talking about the casinos in second life. The whole system is based on a lot of people paying for something that does not exist. As in any casino, only the owner wins.

The land barons may seem like the big winners, but in truth they're just a cog in the system however large, still a cog. They may make money but in comparison to Lindens, they are getting pocket change for all the work they're doing -- creating speculative value by marking things up and selling them on.

....

I could go on. The summary is: new land does not cost Lindens much, even when they undersell it. As long as someone claims ownership of the land and pays the land maintenance fees, Lindens actually could sell it for free and still make money. They would lose money up front yes.

But strange how $75 dollars a month from an average user and $23 dollars every 4 months for premium membership from several thousand people will keep a relatively small company with little to spend on other than server rack space will pay the bills and keep a company going even profitable.

SL IS the ultimate casino -- the lowest facilty expenses matched by the most wins by the house.

Troy.

The Welcome Area is on the mainland, right where people go when they bypass the orientation islands and help island. The notecards are at the Welcome Area, on the mainland.

People who choose not to learn are ignorant by choice.

If they have the oomph to buiy first land right after they enter without doing any research they are getting the consequences of their choice.

Really? Is Linden Lab buying bargain dual opterons , now?

I don't find this to really describe the situation accurately, other than as it relates to how business works. Line worker toils for little, business owner gets rich. Not bitter or awful.

As for paying for something that isn't there, it depends on how you view it. I don't actually "own" my slice of virtual land, but I am being entertained and that is very valuable to me. I am getting exactly what I think I am paying for.

Not sure why I'm posting this, probably more due to avoiding work than anything else, but these signs were floating above the new first land within hours of it being released. Don't know if it's relevant to anything or if anybody cares, but I've uploaded it now so what the hell.

I saw those, too. That's one way to help out.

Yes, I am sure the land owners next to those signs think so too.

I couldn't vote in the poll because it was too skewed, but I think first land works just fine.

What exactly is broken about it?

First land's purpose is to introduce users to the benefits of land ownership, one of those benefits is the ability to sell that land at whatever price they decide. I do not think it is broken.

You get to have the Creature from the Black Lagoon as your forum avatar in the Second Life forums. That's worth a lot right there!

This really strikes me as not much of an issue.

When people sell land for a few thousand lindens less than they might have if they had waited they only lose a few real dollars, and the loss is not an actual loss but simply not making a potential gain. Big deal.

As for spoiling people's views with signs placed adjacent to their land, well, ugly builds around my land is one of the reasons I sold my last few plots of land.

Ugly builds with imperative statements giving people commands of what to do with their land might annoy people. I, for one, don't like being told what to do. Someone trying to modify my behavior, who is not in a position of authority over me, is more likely to accomplish their goal with a suggestion than an order.

I would guess that they probably pay about $1250 per server. At least, that's what they sell an island for.

But let's say it's $2000.

Now, they "give that away" as first land to 128 new accounts.

Let's say those 128 accounts are ALL optimizing nuts, so they pay $72 a year, or $6/month, rather than $10/month.

That means over the first year that "free" sim nets them $9216 in premium accounts.

OK, now let's say the accounts are all land baron alts at $10 per.

That means they get $1280 for the accounts, and $2340 from the land baron's tier, or $3620... if the land baron never sells any plots.

Yeh, looks like they COULD give away the servers and make it back on tier.

Wow, LL actually did the sums to work out what they should be charging? That's amazing!

</sarcasm>

Apparently to Hiro it is.

Once again, as another person in this thread failed to do, you completely ignored costs of bandwidth, setup, and maintenance. These opterons don't come with free fiber optic networking and already plugged into the grid, loaded with SL's software, terraformed, and with a little IT midget that magically fixes the problems for free.

I dunno why, when people decide to move away from their first land, it doesn't go back into the pool and they get a bit of extra cash as an extra bonus for signing up to premium.