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Bill 4-26: Guild Construction Authority

Flyingroc Chung
:)
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 329
05-02-2006 12:50
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
Don't you see that Flyingroc wrote it so it must be sensible? :D

Eh, my point there was that *I* wrote it, therefore *I* think it's sensible. There are obviously at least two people who think it is not. Which is fine, sensible people can sensibly disagree.
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
05-02-2006 12:50
From: Claude Desmoulins
And I don't like every texture change requiring an RA bill. I guess that's a point on which we are going to disagree.



Strawman arguments aside --nobody is arguing that a simple texture change requires an RA bill. If a texture is discarded and changed it can easily be changed back in minutes.

If someone decided to nuke the church one day --that would be a little more complex.


Perhaps I will make signs to display in Altenburg that state :

"The Government wants the power to destroy your Church"
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Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
05-02-2006 12:58
From: Claude Desmoulins
And I don't like every texture change requiring an RA bill. I guess that's a point on which we are going to disagree.
You assume the individuals will act reasonably. What if the next GM changes textures to be pictures of your face photoshopped over are horses rear? It would be perfectly legal.

I suggest something like a show and tell, where new structures or new designs are put on display for citizens and after allowing citizen feedback, the RA decides if they should proceed. Now that's sensible. ;)

~Ulrika~
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Flyingroc Chung
:)
Join date: 3 Jun 2004
Posts: 329
05-02-2006 12:59
From: Kendra Bancroft

"The Government wants the power to destroy your Church"


It's more like "the government wants the power to replace your church with another, similar church," really.
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Claude Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 388
05-02-2006 13:12
The question is, just exactly where is that line?
Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
05-02-2006 13:19
From: Claude Desmoulins
The question is, just exactly where is that line?



This is why NL 3-10 is important and should be strengthened.

Allowing one branch organized around a charismatic leader to make the sole determinations is not responsable.

This is why the RA must be involved. They represent the people's interests. You seem to think a bill is necessary for each change --all that is needed is the Gildemeister to present what they feel needs changing to a simple up and down vote.

Can I change the texture on the church to this? (shows texture) aye!

Can I build a giant statue of Ulrika on the Rathaus roof? No!

If the GM finds the RA is out of whack they can appeal to the SC for a constitutional ruling on the matter.
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Claude Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 388
05-02-2006 13:29
Ok, I think I see where you're going. TO look at this another way, let me ask this question.

"What may the Gildemeister do without RA approval?"
Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
05-02-2006 13:37
From: Claude Desmoulins
Ok, I think I see where you're going. TO look at this another way, let me ask this question.

"What may the Gildemeister do without RA approval?"



organize events -ex. Oktoberfest/Expo/Flohmarkt

assign private work comissions -ex.MoCa, Schloss

assign public work commissions - ex Rathaus, Biergarten, Marktplatz

maintain infrastructure and landscaping

Power of veto on budget
Power of veto on covenant

Power to Impeach any member of Government

power to levy sales tax on merchants of non-guild status

shall I continue?
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Claude Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 388
05-02-2006 13:38
Can you specify what you mean by maintain as it relates to infrastructure?
Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
05-02-2006 13:46
From: Claude Desmoulins
Can you specify what you mean by maintain as it relates to infrastructure?



Nobody else has the authority to "change seasons" as is our custom.

Only the Gildemeister has that authority to maintain the infrastructure and landcaping for that "illusion".

Much of the texture work on buildings, and tree placement is affected seasonally and that is the Gildemeister's discretion.

Not to mention Holiday decorations --on and on and etc.
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Claude Desmoulins
Registered User
Join date: 1 Nov 2005
Posts: 388
05-02-2006 13:48
Thank you.
Dianne Mechanique
Back from the Dead
Join date: 28 Mar 2005
Posts: 2,648
05-02-2006 14:04
From: Ulrika Zugzwang
The law N 3-10 wasn't created to satisfy casual onlookers. It's goal is to seek consensus and support from those who contribute to the shared space. After all, it's not the Guild's land -- it's the people's...
What an awful sentence. I give it a C- for (lack of) clarity. :)

- By "casual onlookers" I took Claude to mean the average observer, i.e - the populace.
- "Those who contribute to the shared space" can only mean the builders, i.e - the guild.

So what you said translates to:

"... (the law) wasn't created to satisfy the populace, its goal is to satisfy the guild, after all it's not the guilds land it's the populaces." :confused:

I think this law, like many, was really written to satisfy the law writer.
In this case you.
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Kendra Bancroft
Rhine Maiden
Join date: 17 Jun 2004
Posts: 5,813
05-02-2006 15:11
From: Dianne Mechanique
What an awful sentence. I give it a C- for (lack of) clarity. :)

- By "casual onlookers" I took Claude to mean the average observer, i.e - the populace.
- "Those who contribute to the shared space" can only mean the builders, i.e - the guild.

So what you said translates to:

"... (the law) wasn't created to satisfy the populace, its goal is to satisfy the guild, after all it's not the guilds land it's the populaces." :confused:

I think this law, like many, was really written to satisfy the law writer.
In this case you.



Strawman arguments aside, Dianne. What Ulrika is in fact saying is that the buildings are the property of ALL the citizens, not just thems what made'em.

The workers will have presumably been paid for their work by the populace, The populace therefore owns the work they contracted.

By your logic if I approved of a contractor to come do my kitchen, he could later come back after the job was completed and at any time at his will change stuff around because he thought it would look better.
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