How much do scripters get paid?

Also beyond copyright and IP issues, there are fun things with warranties (express and implied) and indemnifications.

For fun I did a search on LAW in the SL search, and yep, there are already lawyers set up there offering contract and other services, in world.

Maybe its time for the forum operators to create a new Content Creation forum: Legal Issues?

Well, I have to pitch in... I have only been able to come up with a 'by the job' basis myself. Simply becasue it might take you more or less time on a given project, but it might also take you a ton more time on research and dinking around on testing an item on one hand, but only take 5 minutes writing it... whereas on the other hand it might take you several days ironing out a script but it only takes about 5 or 10 minutes to double check it with a few people to know it works.

Also - Not make money in SL? I am not about to be a butthead and toot my own horn with numbers, but For every island I terraform, build for, and / or script for... I at least pay my rent each month, usually quite a bit more than that... and I get to do something I enjoy doing on the side.

You want to talk about taking the heat off of paying the bills? Oh hell yeah! It's nice putting most of your paycheck in the savings account, rather than straight from checking - to bills all the time. SL has been a blessing to me!

Heck no you don't have to or need to make money in SL... it's just a fun place to hang out and enjoy yourself (do it all the time myself) - but if you really WANT to make some money on the side... it's more than just 'possible' - it's simply a matter of going out and doing just what you're doing... ask questions, work at it, and go do it!

Take care,
- Hap

P.S. - and if it hadn't been for very helpful exchanges in this and other forums, I wouldn't be where I'm at, so that's why whenever I finish a project, or I come up with some fun scripts on my own.. I post them for everyone to use... thanks everyone!!

I agree there 100% Haplo.

I don't normally hire out my services as a scripter, though I have assisted in a job or two before and will almost always help friends who are stuck trying to figure something out. Though in those cases my help tends to run more along the lines of assisting them to figure out what works best for them rather than doing it for them.

I find that I feel better and do best when I just create for myself and my business. We're doing fairly well for ourselves, though we're not making near enough to pay our RL bills heh. I would love to do that, but unfortunately I think I need to quit holding on to some of my better stuff and also need to learn to market a bit better than just having my classified ad

My point is no one expects to be paid in SL what they make in RL, but scripters. And we have to take their word for that that they are professional programmers and not some pencil necked 15 year old sitting in his mother's basement eating a jelly do-nut and drinking a YooHoo claiming to be a professional.

One of the key points that people seem to be missing is that the vast majority of SL users (scripters included) use SL for entertainment and relaxation. I'm a Chef by trade in real life, but I code for fun. I know what my time is worth in RL (about $40 an hour), but I don't expect to get paid for enjoying my entertainment, let alone real life equivalent wages. Infact, since in I'm here for fun my time here is numerically worth negative monetary values. Since I have established products and vendors that are making income, SL pays for itself, but that is the extent of my interest in the financial aspects of SL. I'm not here to make money, I'm here to have fun. When I stop having fun, I'll pack up my things and leave (figuratively)

For those critiquing my retaining the right to re-sell/re-distribute any code I write under contract, that is explicetly listed in my contract, and any potential customer knows this ahead of time. If they don't like that idea, then they will go else where. My own personal ethics stop me from outright re-selling code I write under contract, but I will use it as a base model for my own version of what I was contracted for if I find it interesting enough for my leisure time. This situation has only occured twice, both with very specific use scripts that I could (and did) incorperate into much larger projects I had on the boards.

I don't actively advertise my services unless I'm without any projects what so ever, so all my business comes as word of mouth, which is suprisingly steady. If you're into SL scripting for fun and relaxation, you don't need to launch a full fledged marketing campaign for your latest widget that you have slapped copyrights and IP retentions on in a legally secure manner. While a few people do look upon SL as a business revenue, remember at it's core its a gaming platform designed for entertainment.

I can see your point, however I do not subscribe to that theory... does anyone here honestly think I would design, generate (build), and implement buildings, landscapes, and other objects - write scripts small and incredibly lengthy to get some of them to operate in certain ways, and manipulate in-world engines to create a nicer-looking environment (like the horrifically limited terrain editor) all of that - over a period of sometimes a month or more -- all for the same price as what I'd expect in real life?

HAHAHAHAH!! I'd already be a mililonaire!! Just with scripting alone! And i'm not that great a scripter yet. Far better than some, and not even on the road to middle-ville compared to others.

If people are really asking for the same money as what they get in RL then they aren't based in Reality. This is Second Life and some people (can't afford) aren't willing to pay RL prices for nominal items. When you figure the currency here is not really riding par for the course... then you can't really expect people to pay you the same as your boss in Silicone Valley.

Anyway, that's just my 2 cents... I'm sure there are those out there that may wish to kill me at this point, but seriously... you can't expect full wages in a world that's not full wage. YET. It's getting there, and you can't sell yourself short, but you can't expect nuts.

c-me! Gotta get back to RL work. lol
- Hap

You have it backward, it's investing the US$2500+ at 5% annual to get the US$127 (36,500 * 20 = 730,000). It's one way to give a rough value to intangible digital products.

And yeah that's gross, but I have at least one product that sells one a day off the back of a L$50 advert and no other marketing. Support on those is minimal, typically one or two enquiries a month, and that's usually because SL problems made the delivery from the vendor fail.

Once you have a break even store, then the marketing cost for future products shrinks, the exisiting traffic your advertising brings will result in sales for new items also. That's the scenario I was using in my example, which of course is simplified for clarity. Or was I expected to break down the various tax brackets for the various countries SL is used in too?

I work at Grendel's Children for free avatars ^.^ but then agian I sell my scripts too, earn about 120 dollars US a month.

That's fairly impressive, Pip. May I ask if you are selling them directly, retail, or if this is contract work, or through revenue-sharing on objects that incorporate them?

Thanks everybody for the great discussion. I think I'll do small projects on a revenue-sharing partnership model (that'll give me some exposure to other business people in SL, which would be fun), and fixed-price for larger projects. I'll come up with some ratio-to-RL pricing model for larger projects (my price for scripting RL was always lower than for actual programming anyway).

And, Senuka, if you don't mind, I'll IM you inworld to talk about your shared-revenue vendor? Unless you've already shared the script somewhere ...

Thanks all!

I have to agree. Scripter's who work for $2 an hour on projects they don't like are simply wasting their time. You don't get any enjoyment while whoever buys your script will certainly profit.

Well I charge L$10k/hr. But I also have a web design/development/C++/VB biz and charge upwards of $40/hr. So when it comes to lsl scripting I have to charge the same rate...since it is an opportunity cost.

This means I don't really work on the simple projects because it's gonna be too costly to pay me L$10k/hr. just to create some "tipjar." I get the more complicated stuff. Other scripters pay me to fix their bugs when they arent having luck. Or I get contacted when other scripters have told a potential client "it can't be done"...then I make it happen Or a significantly involved type of project.

That being said, if I dont have any else going on (and i like the client's SL project) I have come down considerably in price. And I've done flat-rate projects where the time it took was huge in comparision to what I made, but I also added alot of "extras" just because I won't put junk-scripting out there. Often I'll also give repeat customers a nice discount. for prepaying for block of time.

Bottom-line here is just that...the "bottom-line." Even though SL is "just a game," people can (and do) make real money on the projects they hire a scripter/builder to create. THAT IS REALITY!

Consider...someone hires me @L$10k/hr to create something and it takes me 10hrs. Now suppose there is a similiar (although inferior..hehe) item for sale on SL exchange going for L$10k (and there's alot in that range). They hit break even after only 10 sales. So I think it's only fair to charge what you could be making doing something else. Since creating scripts IS programming...you should charge programming rates.

So...quote what you are worth and let the customer decide if their project justifies the expense of hiring you. If not...I'm sure you can keep busy on your own (potentially L$ making projects) until the next customer

If people are really expecting to get quality scripting on a "work for hire" basis for significantly less than they'd pay in RL they aren't based in reality.

yay necro thread goodness =)

personally I charge wheter I think the market will bear... heavy project cost more, but I discount heavily for thing I can resell, and consider it a bonus for creative input.

that said I do this for fun, so I charge a fraction of a RL wage anyways unless we're talking real development and the customer own rights to the code.

Hehe....yup. i found this thread through a search and thought it worthy of commenting on.
Since I suspect "how much to charge for scripting services" will always be a good question

I make $200,000 USD a year selling scripts and working at a few SL strip clubs.

And who are you again?

Oh ya, Bombastic Hyperbole...