LL ad-farm policy now applied to non-ad-farms?

/me gets no joy from the wiki or blog so I come to the *REAL* source of info.. Forums!

So, my neighbor got an LL nastygram and a sign of hers returned today. This isn't an ad-farm thing, it was one sign on one parcel, a +7k of land she owns on zindra. It was indeed rotating, slowly, but wasn't that big - if it was a megaprim, which I doubt, it was 20m max.

What they sent her looks like the ad-farm policy which the wiki explicitly says is for networked advertising but she, again, had one sign on one largeish parcel that she owns.

Have the rules changed? Do I not understand the rules? Did LL screw up by yelling at her and returning her sign?

If you think it was 20m max (presumably square), then it was breaking the size rules, which are that signs cannot be more than 8m in height. Also, they must be on the ground (or on a building) but not suspended in the air.

Even on your own land?

This wasn't networked advertising or anything like that. One sign, one +7km2 parcel..

Even on your own land, the size/rotation/suspension/glow/particle rules apply to everyone, even if they have only one ad. All it takes is an abuse report (or two) and the offending ad will be removed by LL.

It was not an "ad farm policy," but an ad policy. Advertising signs cannot spin, glow, emit, or extend more than eight meters from the ground. Also, they must be grounded. Yes, these rules apply to one's own land--there wouldn't be much point in making a policy that applies only to prims put on other people's land.

Hrm.. The one wiki page I find on this stuff explicitly says it's talking about networked advertising, which this case is very much not about.

Anybody got a link to where LL says such things are not allowed on your own, non-microparcel land?

http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Linden_Lab_Official:About_ad_farms_and_network_advertisers

edit: and the thing that sorta bugs me is that I have neighbors with glowing megaprim signs on two sides of my land, one that's transparent on all signs NOT facing me and LL ignored those.. They just returned the one little sign my friend had.

This is the relevant adfarming blog post:

http://blogs.secondlife.com/community/features/blog/2008/09/13/more-information-on-ad-farms-and-network-advertisers

Specifically:

* We will allow no more than 50 advertising locations owned by a single individual, whether personally owned or via groups in which you are a member, unless you have written permission from Linden Lab to exceed this limit.Use of Alt accounts/groups to circumvent this restriction will be considered a violation.

* In addition to the cap, we will allow no more than 1 advertising placement by an individual in any single region.

* Adverts should be grounded to the terrain, not floating.
* Adverts should extend no higher than 8m from the ground.
* No rotating, no flashing content and no particles.
* No unsolicited dispensing of IMs, notecards, landmarks or content.
* No light sources or glow (full bright is acceptable however).
* Advertising hoardings should be Phantom.
* Adverts must be clearly PG in nature.
* No sound and no temp-on-rez content.
* Ban lines should be switched off.

----

While the intent of the new rules was to put an end to extortion and harassment from adfarming, Jack also made it clear that it applied to *ALL* advertisement; unfortunately, his blog post doesn't make it as clear as he did in his office hours, but this one question/answer illustrates one non-adfarm example:

Q. Does this policy include signs advertising Parcels for sale?
A. Yes it does.

TY for the link.. This is not, BTW, land for sale - she's had this place for +3 years (though recently forced to zinddra) which is like forever in SL years.

I see in the blog post this:

...which makes me think that having a sign on your own land - talking actual in-use land, not 16m2 BS parcels - is indeed legal. No?

Yeah, signs used for identifying purposes, like a business location, are supposed to be legal.

That's a badly worded FAQ question.

Imagine a sign above a door that says "Mc Kitty's - 30 million fried Nekos served up." on it. That's fine.
- Now make it rotate, glow, and be 9m tall. That's not ok.

So... Who's right??

Sindy it's the visual blight in question not the size of the parcel. As others have said, it can't glow, spin, or be high in the air or oversized. The rule has been that way for a while.

I'm not sure that's true. If it was, Talarus wouldn't have had to torture Jack Linden for 2 years to get the ad farm policy in place.

I could be wrong, though - do you know of a link to somewhere where LL has said that?

If you don't want to believe everyone who's replied you don't have to. No I don't know of the blog link sorry.

Shouldn't the proof be that the edict came from the Lindens themselves? That would seem to indicate something.

As others have also said it applies to ads not only ad FARMS.

I'm not sure what you mean about the 2 yrs thing, the question is about something that happened just recently, yes? At any rate, you've had your answers, if you don't want to believe it, don't.

A couple of posts from Jack clarified that LL reserved the right to apply "duck tests" to this stuff, that rules lawyering wasn't going to work.







There are words to the same effect at the bottom of the blog post and wiki page about the policy.

/me nods.. I've always been one to agree with that too - never expect them to totally define a rule, given how people like to game stuff.


Yes and, like I said, the only thing LL wrote about very clearly says it only applies to networked advertising. Like, again, where Jack Linden, the guy who owns the mainland, all of LL support and governance says:

So, I'm not allowed to say "but LL seems to clearly say..." here now?

This isn't SL Answers, ya know.

"of this kind." I think he was referring to normal store signs.

A 20 Meter spinning mega prim is apt to not fall into that category.

Ok. That helps. TY.

I am not sure who tortured whom more in that one. <.<



Viktoria found some good quotes and, indeed, the policy is rather "fluid".

That said, it means that circumstances are more likely to be considered than a strict adherence to a ruleset.

I mean, I have "floating"/"spinning" "signs" (two of them) at the two entrances to my mall. When I used them as examples, Jack said they would be fine. They are not really garish or obstructive, and fit with the theme of the mall.

I guess it would depend on what the sign content was, the content of the parcel it was over, the size of the parcel, etc.

It might behoove your friend to write in contesting it and asking for clarification of what was offensive about it to cause it to be removed.

It might. On the other hand, it might be worth considering that the original design was enough to:

1. Bestir somebody--probably a neighbor--to report it, and
2. Compel a Linden to remove it.

In my experience, #2 is a very considerable hurdle (so this must have been some sign), and #1 is to be avoided whenever possible.

The rules aren't applied correctly in the case of your friend and it sounds like they're being used as an excuse, which is rather silly as they could just cite visual spam.

The advertising issue is about parcels used primarily for advertising.

Oh definitely agreed, as someone in a sim I have land in has used glowing white towers with banlines. posted rotating large obscenities on said tower and currently has a huge half naked picture of The Hoff there and LL's response has largely been to shrug their shoulders. although they did eventually remove the obscenities.

"grounded" would include your 8 meter max sign being attached to the roof of your store that is "grounded".

Yes, remember adfarmers actually own their land.

The best advice is to follow their rules even if it is not adfarming. The few times I have rezzed a sign for something (some event I was involved with) I made sure to sink it into the ground a little (so it would not be accused of floating), had it no more than 8 meters tall, and set it to phantom.

I actually recieved a suspension for this rule.

Whatwas in fact on my land was a small around 5 m high sign on the gound lvl of my club with a sgn saying click t teleport up to the club (as people had funny lms etc) .

this sign combined with another prim also on th ground more than 30m away with glow on it put me according to the Linden who suspended me in vioation of the ad rules.

However uponcontacting the live chat and assertainign EXACTLY why i had my account suspended (the email was extremely vague andjust mentioned advrtising... not visualadvertising and could have ment anything from notices about my store group to groupIMs anything).

IT was obvious that the suspension i had recieved was unjustified and to be honest extremely ridiculous as neither the sign on the land nor the other prim were meant for advertising purposes and even if ou did say the teleport prim was advertising it was not in violation....

After appealing with a ticket containing the information i had recieve about whyi was suspended and copies of my own assertain that i was most definately not in violation of anyrules the suspension was wiped from my account...