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A Question about security systems

Myhrrhleine Wingtips
Registered User
Join date: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 29
10-25-2008 10:00
I have a question about security systems. No, Im not wanting to buy one, I created my own that requires input from to to do anything. My question is about the automated ones. I thought they were supposed to give some sort of warning before TPing someone home. Is this still the case?

I have a neighbor who's security is always TPing me home without warning every time i cross onto their land. No I'm not doing this intentionally, but it sometimes happens when I'm trying to get my sub out from my dock into the open water, and is quite annoying.
Alicia Sautereau
if (!social) hide;
Join date: 20 Feb 2007
Posts: 3,125
10-25-2008 10:04
optional
Ceera Murakami
Texture Artist / Builder
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 7,750
10-25-2008 10:08
10 seconds warning is customary. If it's less than that, I think it can be abuse reported. Virtually all security systems have a configuration option for setting that warning delay. Try talking politely to the neighbor, and ask them to set their system to allow a 10 second warning.
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Kathy Morellet
Registered User
Join date: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 809
10-25-2008 10:09
Most of the popular ones have configurable warning times and most of the makers recommend giving at least some warning prior to attacking. But the user is still the one that makes the final decision as to how much warning, if any, is given.

You might send a polite IM to your neighbor and ask, nicely, if s/he would be willing to add you to their white list so you don't keep getting attacked. But, if they aren't willing to do so and the system only bounces you while on their land, there really isn't much else to do.

If it was attacking you while still on your land then, you could file an AR on it but, if not then they are within their rights as a land owner.

ETA: I am assuming mainland here. If you are renting on a private estate than you should talk to the Estate manager/Owner about it.
Ceera Murakami
Texture Artist / Builder
Join date: 9 Sep 2005
Posts: 7,750
10-25-2008 10:12
FYI - I just looked in the TOS and Community Standards, and it s not explicitly mentioned in either document. So I guess it's more a case of "accepted practice" to allow he warning. It used to fall under the "Assault" category for AR's.
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Myhrrhleine Wingtips
Registered User
Join date: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 29
10-25-2008 10:24
I sent them an IM hopefully this will solve the problem. Until I get a response I will just edit/drag the sub out into the open water. Much easier that way. This is not the sort of thing I want to write an AR about, after all it is their land and if they don't want anyone on it so be it. I still can't understand people being so "ZOMG I don't want anyone on my land for a second" it seems a bit paranoid to me. It not like anyone can actually do anything to the land or stuff on it sheesh. The only time I worry about someone being on my land is when I have "company" and don't want to have to deal with uninvited guests.
Phil Deakins
Prim Savers = low prims
Join date: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 9,537
10-25-2008 10:47
I'm in the camp that says a warning *must* be given, and I'm sure I've read something to that effect by LL. I see no reason at all for anyone to set the device to TP people home on the first scan after they enter the land. Dumping them on the other side of the land's border is ok by me, but not TPing home.

Since you made you own, you should be aware that, unless it's been fixed, the normal scan for avs on or over your land will also pick up people within the scan range who are in the next sim. It won't TP them anywhere because they are not on/over your land, but they keep getting the warnings. There's a way round it that I incorporated into mine but, offhand, I don't remember what it is.
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Myhrrhleine Wingtips
Registered User
Join date: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 29
10-25-2008 13:00
The one I created does not use a sensor, it uses several strategically placed transparent and phantom prims that detect collisions, sending the name of the agent that collided with them to the hud which I wear. The hud informs me of the persons presence and if I choose to take action, I can or not. I know this method is not foolproof, but all I intended for it to do was to allow me to take action without actually having to hunt down the interloper to remove them.

From: Phil Deakins
I'm in the camp that says a warning *must* be given, and I'm sure I've read something to that effect by LL. I see no reason at all for anyone to set the device to TP people home on the first scan after they enter the land. Dumping them on the other side of the land's border is ok by me, but not TPing home.

Since you made you own, you should be aware that, unless it's been fixed, the normal scan for avs on or over your land will also pick up people within the scan range who are in the next sim. It won't TP them anywhere because they are not on/over your land, but they keep getting the warnings. There's a way round it that I incorporated into mine but, offhand, I don't remember what it is.
Mortus Allen
Registered User
Join date: 28 Apr 2007
Posts: 528
10-25-2008 13:03
The popular ones I have bought and used have a minimum delay of 10 seconds to ensure there product is not used in a way that violates the TOS and Community Standards regarding such devices, the Omega Security System even has an option to turn off when you are away from you home, this is something I do like and prefer. So far though I have only used the Omega and Land Protector so others may let you set lower.
ArchTx Edo
Mystic/Artist/Architect
Join date: 13 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,993
10-25-2008 14:10
This post quotes Lee Linden on security systems. It is as close as you will find to an official Linden position regarding the systems designs.

/108/db/104716/2.html#post1023879
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Charliedru Lannock
Registered User
Join date: 31 Aug 2008
Posts: 19
10-25-2008 14:41
It's interesting hearing about all the security systems out there, but I don't believe any of them to truly be accurate at all.

I developed my own security system recently. It's perfect. I could not ever think to find anything else to better suit my security needs. My system uses exact coordinates and polygons to detect if a person is inside a building. It also moves by itself within any other perimeter of my choice.

It uses sensors, makes visitor lists, gives notecard/landmarks, tells people where they cannot go, has option to ban people on multiple offense, and ejects from land if people not on the access list cross into unwanted areas. All of these things achieved in exact perimeters based on exact coordinates.

My system, in my opinion, is the most efficient and best system around. My security bot can roam an entire sim if I want it to, making the 96m sensor much more efficient.

I'm not sure what the question was in all, but I just figured I'd mention this. I know how annoying Security Orbs can be, so I did my best to make the friendliest system around.

(Nice aesthetics thanks to a friend, too. ^^)
ArchTx Edo
Mystic/Artist/Architect
Join date: 13 Feb 2005
Posts: 1,993
10-25-2008 15:01
From: ArchTx Edo
This post quotes Lee Linden on security systems. It is as close as you will find to an official Linden position regarding the systems designs.

/108/db/104716/2.html#post1023879/108/db/104716/2.html#post1023879


I decided to quote it here.

From: someone
Originally posted by Lee Linden:

We know there's a bit of a gap between the current built-in security tools, and people's desires to be alone on their property. While we allow residents to supplement their land security tools with scripts, it's important not to violate other people's rights in the process.

An acceptable security script should remove an offender from the land, nothing more. Ideally, this should involve two calls: llUnSit and llEjectFromLand. More details on these functions here:

http://secondlife.com/badgeo/wakka.php?wakka=llUnSit
http://secondlife.com/badgeo/wakka....llEjectFromLand

These two calls will eject someone driving a vehicle with no chance for them to recover it, so it's important to provide both a warning and a reasonable delay for someone "just passing through", especially if they're not a repeat offender.

llPushObject should not be used in a security script; it's totally unnecessary. llTeleportAgentHome is also a bit unfair to people attempting to fly to another location, and should also not be used. Both these functions have the potential to disconnect someone from Second Life, which is considered a disruptive action.

In my opinion, the ideal security script would have the following features:

1) Scan in intervals greater than 1.0 second to reduce server load.
2) Maintain a list of recently ejected residents, as well as a "blacklist" of names forbidden by the owner.
3) After a new avatar (not recently ejected or blacklisted) enters, wait a few seconds, then warn the user via IM (one time only) that they're on private land and should leave.
4) Give the avatar at least 10 seconds to leave for this first occasion.
5) If the avatar doesn't leave, IM them again, then llUnSit and llEjectFromLand.
6) Add the avatar to the "recently ejected" list. If they return, they receive a shorter delay before being removed.
7) Blacklisted avatars receive a short delay and IM warning before being ejected and added to the "recently ejected" list. Blacklisted avatars on the "recently ejected" list can be immediately removed.

That's a wish list, not a list of requirements. If someone makes that security script, I'll be sure to recommend it!

As always, circumventing the security tools (ours or yours) to harrass someone isn't okay, and such bad behavior should be reported via the Abuse Reporter.
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Charliedru Lannock
Registered User
Join date: 31 Aug 2008
Posts: 19
10-25-2008 16:18
Yes, I read that post earlier. But in my opinion, you are violating a person's rights simply by ejecting them from the parcel for flying over it. If you don't want them to fly through, activate controlled access. In other cases, the security should be as specific as to let people know the exact areas they should not enter. This would be the ethical approach.

I have been simple strolling through parcels and I find myself ejected for no reason. 5 Second timer. Yeah, that's what it says. But it doesn't consider the lag (that it causes I might add) and the time dilation and by the time I get that dialog I'm already ejected.

I am referring to the traditional security orbs. I have not yet seen the L$5000 ones that are on SLX, but I do not believe these are any better than the rest.

So, basically I agree with the post, but my expectations are a bit higher than simply giving a warning that they shouldn't be in the parcel. If the parcel is accessible, I should be able to fly through with no problem. It's an offense to be to be ejected for no apparent reason.

*CDru