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What are your top 3 most-despised SOPT (Same Old Putrid Tactics)?

Argent Stonecutter
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05-19-2009 15:37
Don't forget, the only thing worse than self-deprecating humor is when some rodent gets into a fight with his alt over whether he's a rodent or not.
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Argent Stonecutter
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05-19-2009 15:39
PS: People often mix up "status quo" (the way things are) and "status quo ante" (the way things were before whatever is under discussion). :D
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Sling Trebuchet
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Join date: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 4,548
05-19-2009 15:39
From: Kidd Krasner
Blindly quibbling over semantics: ......


The build on that would be setting out to *deliberately* quibble over semantics as a diversionary tactic.
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Cato Badger
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Posts: 92
05-19-2009 15:39
From: Talarus Luan
True, but that doesn't invalidate the construct "The status quo has changed", nor does it make "the status quo will remain" redundant. :)

Remember it is the "present state". The "present state" can be different from the "past state" or the "future state".
I disagree. The status quo is what is current. It would have to be a previous different status quo for it to have changed. Only if the status quo has not changed is it still the same status quo. Which does make "the status quo will remain" redundant.

ETA What Argent and Sling said.
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Ponsonby Low
Unregistered User
Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 15:41
From: Ciaran Laval
No we'd be The Borg and those gits are always upto no good.

Right so, derailing a thread, taking a quote out of context, away goals count double, no mention of pie, I reckon I'm in for about seven points here.

On a serious note, in between the barrages of hatred and contempt I'm yet to see anyone who isn't actual helpful at some time. These forums do serve the purpose they were intended for, people do get their queries answered, the bickering, and heck I'm guilty of that more than most I guess but I'm on a vow of good behaviour, is just part of the whole package, the disparate parts make up the whole, the whole is good.




I agree that RA does serve as a wonderful source for, well, Resident Answers, some very large percentage of the time. I'm not saying it's a vast wasteland by any means. A lot of genuine help is offered, here.

But it's annoying when legitimate topics, topics that might be illuminated by logic, descend into the unhelpful darkness of personal insults.

Also, sometimes it's just a matter of sighing heavily at seeing the same old tactics again and again. You can make book on seeing, somewhere in some post on the RA front page on ANY day of the week:


***You need to learn to read.
***By your rez date, I can't see why we should listen to anything you say. Go live in SL for six months and then come back.
***Thanks for proving my point.
***You clearly don't understand the English language. You fail.
***Is it damp there in your parents' basement?
***What are you, 13?

....SOS over and over.

It would be nice if those who routinely resort to these hackneyed insults would realize that their habit has been noted. And that this habit is less admired than they, mired in self-delusion, imagine.
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 15:44
From: Cato Badger
I disagree. The status quo is what is current. It would have to be a previous different status quo for it to have changed. Only if the status quo has not changed is it still the same status quo. Which does make "the status quo will remain" redundant.

ETA What Argent and Sling said.


Well, just for you, I'll use the construct "the current situation will remain", even though it means the same thing. :)
Ponsonby Low
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Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 15:46
From: Argent Stonecutter
Don't forget, the only thing worse than self-deprecating humor is when some rodent gets into a fight with his alt over whether he's a rodent or not.


QFT.

Another tactic that might qualify for the list is surely

#__) SOCK PUPPETRY: The most obvious use of alting is to a) insult the opponent under the guise of being a third party, and to b) praise one's self, again under the guise of being a third party. But there's also the 'attempt to fill the thread with dozens of posts on an unrelated topic or tangent from the original topic, posts which purport to be between two people but which are actually all coming from the same person using two accounts.'



Again, you have to picture (and pity) the emptiness and despair of a life in which this sort of thing seems like a good idea.
Ciaran Laval
Mostly Harmless
Join date: 11 Mar 2007
Posts: 7,951
05-19-2009 15:52
From: Ponsonby Low
It would be nice if those who routinely resort to these hackneyed insults would realize that their habit has been noted. And that this habit is less admired than they, mired in self-delusion, imagine.


Sorry for clipping your post, yes it would be nice but you can't teach old dogs new tricks. People will bite. Wonderfully intended threads get derailed and turn into fests of unsavoury content, I think everyone can recognise where it goes wrong and we could all do with taking a breath before wading in.

Some of us need longer breaths than others. Words however are powerful, they raise emotions and try as we will there will be times when it all goes Pete Tong. Some people back away, others bite like rabid dogs. There's no simple solution but this forum is better than many.
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 15:55
From: Ponsonby Low
But it's annoying when legitimate topics, topics that might be illuminated by logic, descend into the unhelpful darkness of personal insults.


There are two sides of that coin, though. Offering insult, and taking insult. They are both just as prevalent in discussions, too. Sometimes, no insult is offered, but it is taken, and the discussion goes off on that tangent. Other times, insult is offered, and the discussion goes off on that tangent. I would even argue that, more often than not, people offer insult because they perceive insult, even not directed at them. I don't think there are very many people who just start out to offer insult without a stimulus. "Going on the offensive" is not a normal "ground state" for most personalities, even ones who appear to issue more than their "fair share" of offense.

It is going to happen; we're talking human beings here (or other creatures living in human bodies or having human traits or whatever.. point is, human is the lowest common denominator).

From: someone
It would be nice if those who routinely resort to these hackneyed insults would realize that their habit has been noted. And that this habit is less admired than they, mired in self-delusion, imagine.


In that, you make the assumption that people are concerned about their "self-image" or worried over being "admired". In that, you fight against the common problem called "the anonymity of the internet". Further, many people have decided that their reputation is already worthless or have low self-esteem, and don't see being offensive as really hurting them any more than they already are.
Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
05-19-2009 15:58
From: Ponsonby Low
QFT.

Another tactic that might qualify for the list is surely

#__) SOCK PUPPETRY: The most obvious use of alting is to a) insult the opponent under the guise of being a third party, and to b) praise one's self, again under the guise of being a third party. But there's also the 'attempt to fill the thread with dozens of posts on an unrelated topic or tangent from the original topic, posts which purport to be between two people but which are actually all coming from the same person using two accounts.'



Again, you have to picture (and pity) the emptiness and despair of a life in which this sort of thing seems like a good idea.

And then of course there are the unsubstantiated accusations of alt masquerades.

Pep (I feel really sorry for those who are accused of being me)
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Ponsonby Low
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Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 16:09
From: Talarus Luan
I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was a thread solely about the list that Ponsonby Low considers as "Putrid". I withdraw the remark.



I believe this demonstrates a failure of logic.

Your claim (in post #37---a response to my post #30) was (to paraphrase---interested readers should look at the posts) that if anyone posts a phrase, the use of which they believe to be a violation of forum etiquette, and then someone else posts that phrase, then that person has violated forum etiquette.

According to your claim, for example, if someone in this thread posts "I think that anyone who posts a word with more than three syllables has violated forum etiquette" and then I post a word that has more than three syllables, then I have violated forum etiquette.

But since I never agreed with the proposed rule (that posting a word with more than three syllables violates etiquette in the hypothetical example, or that posting the phrase 'fixed it for ya' violates etiquette in the actual example)----since I never agreed with that, then I never violated etiquette.



My response (in post #43), to which you responded with the above comment ["I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was a thread solely about the list that Ponsonby Low considers as "Putrid". I withdraw the remark"], was that since I hadn't agreed that posting the particular phrase was a violation, then I had committed no violation.

Anyone may post any rule they wish. They may post 'typing the letter X violates Forum etiquette.' But that doesn't make anyone who subsequently types an X a violator of Forum etiquette. Therefore your remarks on this topic in post #37 were lacking in logic and common sense (as were your remarks in post #43.)

It looks as though your goal was to put across the claim 'Ponsonby won't accept any of the rules proposed in this thread, other than her own' I'd guess that those who read my responses to others' ideas will realize that such a claim has no validity.
Argent Stonecutter
Emergency Mustelid
Join date: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 20,263
05-19-2009 16:13
You know, I really hate long running debates over definitions, even when I manage to get sucked into one.
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"And now I'm going to show you something really cool."

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Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 16:15
From: Ponsonby Low
I believe this demonstrates a failure of logic.

Your claim (in post #37---a response to my post #30) was (to paraphrase---interested readers should look at the posts) that if anyone posts a phrase, the use of which they believe to be a violation of forum etiquette, and then someone else posts that phrase, then that person has violated forum etiquette.

According to your claim, for example, if someone in this thread posts "I think that anyone who posts a word with more than three syllables has violated forum etiquette" and then I post a word that has more than three syllables, then I have violated forum etiquette.

But since I never agreed with the proposed rule (that posting a word with more than three syllables violates etiquette in the hypothetical example, or that posting the phrase 'fixed it for ya' violates etiquette in the actual example)----since I never agreed with that, then I never violated etiquette.



My response (in post #43), to which you responded with the above comment ["I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was a thread solely about the list that Ponsonby Low considers as "Putrid". I withdraw the remark"], was that since I hadn't agreed that posting the particular phrase was a violation, then I had committed no violation.

Anyone may post any rule they wish. They may post 'typing the letter X violates Forum etiquette.' But that doesn't make anyone who subsequently types an X a violator of Forum etiquette. Therefore your remarks on this topic in post #37 were lacking in logic and common sense (as were your remarks in post #43.)

It looks as though your goal was to put across the claim 'Ponsonby won't accept any of the rules proposed in this thread, other than her own' I'd guess that those who read my responses to others' ideas will realize that such a claim has no validity.


What part of "I withdraw the remark" did you not understand?
Pserendipity Daniels
Assume sarcasm as default
Join date: 21 Dec 2006
Posts: 8,839
05-19-2009 16:17
From: Ponsonby Low
I believe this demonstrates a failure of logic.

Your claim (in post #37---a response to my post #30) was (to paraphrase---interested readers should look at the posts) that if anyone posts a phrase, the use of which they believe to be a violation of forum etiquette, and then someone else posts that phrase, then that person has violated forum etiquette.

According to your claim, for example, if someone in this thread posts "I think that anyone who posts a word with more than three syllables has violated forum etiquette" and then I post a word that has more than three syllables, then I have violated forum etiquette.

But since I never agreed with the proposed rule (that posting a word with more than three syllables violates etiquette in the hypothetical example, or that posting the phrase 'fixed it for ya' violates etiquette in the actual example)----since I never agreed with that, then I never violated etiquette.



My response (in post #43), to which you responded with the above comment ["I'm sorry, I didn't realize that this was a thread solely about the list that Ponsonby Low considers as "Putrid". I withdraw the remark"], was that since I hadn't agreed that posting the particular phrase was a violation, then I had committed no violation.

Anyone may post any rule they wish. They may post 'typing the letter X violates Forum etiquette.' But that doesn't make anyone who subsequently types an X a violator of Forum etiquette. Therefore your remarks on this topic in post #37 were lacking in logic and common sense (as were your remarks in post #43.)

It looks as though your goal was to put across the claim 'Ponsonby won't accept any of the rules proposed in this thread, other than her own' I'd guess that those who read my responses to others' ideas will realize that such a claim has no validity.

That sounds similar to the "Missing 'In my opinion' ".

As in ";(In my opinion) the sun rises in the west".

Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, as long as it is clear that it is their opinion and not anyone else's.

Pep (and that it is not necessarily accurate)
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Pserendipity Daniels
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Join date: 21 Dec 2006
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05-19-2009 16:19
From: Talarus Luan
What part of "I withdraw the remark" did you not understand?

After which the Judge usually says on TV "The jury should therefore disregard the defendant's admission of guilt".

Pep (Or was that a book I read?)
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Ponsonby Low
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Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 16:19
From: Argent Stonecutter
You know, I really hate long running debates over definitions, even when I manage to get sucked into one.



What do you mean by 'definitions'?



















j/k ^_^
Ponsonby Low
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Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 16:25
From: Talarus Luan
What part of "I withdraw the remark" did you not understand?




#___) PARALEIPSIS*: A pretense of being morally, ethically, and spiritually above making some remark, but still making it. For instance, saying "___________" by posting "I would never say _______________" or "some say _______________ but I would never do so" or (as in this case) "____________________. I withdraw the remark [of ________________]."



If you genuinely withdrew the remark, you would have done exactly that, by using 'Edit'. (Surely you must realize that people can see that!)

*not Latin!
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 16:25
From: Pserendipity Daniels
After which the Judge usually says on TV "The jury should therefore disregard the defendant's admission of guilt".


Hmm. Never seen that. I don't watch much in the way of TV, as it is usually too utterly vapid and far from representative of ANYthing in RL. Though, for some people, it *IS* their lives. Well, that, and talking about it on message boards.
Ponsonby Low
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Join date: 21 May 2008
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05-19-2009 16:28
From: Pserendipity Daniels
That sounds similar to the "Missing 'In my opinion' ".

As in ";(In my opinion) the sun rises in the west".

Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, as long as it is clear that it is their opinion (not anyone else's) and that it is not necessarily accurate.




That's why I began the post you quoted with the words "I believe..."
LittleMe Jewell
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05-19-2009 16:29
From: Argent Stonecutter
Only a Nazi would say something like that.
From: Talarus Luan
Godwin! :D


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Pserendipity Daniels
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05-19-2009 16:29
From: Talarus Luan
Hmm. Never seen that. I don't watch much in the way of TV, as it is usually too utterly vapid and far from representative of ANYthing in RL. Though, for some people, it *IS* their lives. Well, that, and talking about it on message boards.

And for some people, being a dragon in a virtual world (and talking about it on message boards) is much more relevant to rl than TV, of course.

Pep (keeps forgetting to put sarcasm emoticons on)
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Whimsycallie Pegler
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Join date: 28 Apr 2006
Posts: 1,003
05-19-2009 16:31
Totally off topic personal attacks.
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 16:34
From: Ponsonby Low
If you genuinely withdrew the remark, you would have done exactly that, by using 'Edit'. (Surely you must realize that people can see that!)


Really? and I can edit it out of other people's quotes of that post, and delete their entire diatribes on it, too?

Even still; that's not how forums traditionally work, and not how I use them. I treat them as a running commentary. Going back and deleting/editing what was said, outside of a few limited reasons, is revisionist history, which is something I consider reviled. I said it. It's there. If I want to amend it, I will amend it later with an amendment, which I did. Deleting/editing previous comments tends to cause continuity problems in the thread that annoy people.
Talarus Luan
Ancient Archaean Dragon
Join date: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 4,831
05-19-2009 16:35
From: Pserendipity Daniels
Being a dragon in a virtual world (and talking about it on message boards) is much more relevant to rl than TV, of course.


It's definitely more interactive! :D
Ponsonby Low
Unregistered User
Join date: 21 May 2008
Posts: 1,893
05-19-2009 16:38
From: Whimsycallie Pegler
Totally off topic personal attacks.

What do you see as being the topic?
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