VAT in Finland and rights to charge it

Fighting LL over contract breach, either in US or EU, won't work. According to the EULA, which was readable during the purchase, so legit according to both US and EU law, LL has the right to increase prices unilaterally.
According to EU customer law, this only allows customers to an option to disband the contract, from the moment the contract was changed. This is the only option LL has to offer to their EU customers.
Only if LL is not allowing EU customers to cancel their quarterly/yearly contracts after the price increases, then they are not handling in accordance with EU customer rights, and the option to sue is possible, but only on the fact that LL is extending a no longer legitimate contract. Not on the fact the contract existed in the first place.

The US would be the same on this.

In light of that, I don't know what you all are to do. I guess tiering down is the only option you have.

I think this is backwards. The requirement is to itemise VAT paid in billing, not to specify VAT not being paid where that is the case.

Given that LL only became liable for VAT once they opened a UK office, VAT was not previously included. As the price increase did not take place immediately I assume LL have had to swallow a large bill for backdated VAT which they could not add to our billing backdated for that period.

From tradingstandards.gov.uk on EU wide legislation;

"The Unfair Contract Terms Act 1977 and The Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999

These laws allow you to challenge terms that may be unfair or unreasonable to you as a consumer. The standard terms and conditions used by the retailer should be written in clear language. It is illegal to have a contract term that attempts to restrict a consumer's rights. In some cases, your local Trading Standards Service may be able to take action to prevent a company from using unfair terms in their contracts."

Anything in the EULA which seeks to undercut or deny the consumer's rights already given under law are themselves illegal.

The fact that it is unilateral doesn't really matter - almost all price increases are unilaterally decided by the retailer / provider. When my power bills increase the companies don't ask me to negotiate with them, they just inform me of the fact. Further, I don't see where the current EULA allows for a unilaterally determined price increase to be backdated which is effectivley the case with tier.

VAT is being introduced now, but LL has been obliged to make VAT payments since 2003.
Has anybody given thought for that?

LL doesn't need to be registered in EU in any fashion, to conduct business with EU residents, they have to stil lcharge & pay VAT.
http://www.out-law.com/page-3684
http://www.ibls.com/internet_law_news_portal_view.aspx?s=latestnews&id=1746

Think about this:

1st option:
LL introduced last night VAT, legally, price has included VAT from get-go, they deny that.
If LL hasn't been paying VAT to EU, they have to RETROACTIVELY pay them from 1st of July 2003, that being upto 25%, HOW MUCH money is that?

2nd option:
If LL has been paying VAT to EU, this is nothing more than raising price ILLEGALLY.
LL has been paying VAT to EU, otherwise there would have been already news etc. about the matter they do not pay. They couldn't conduct business with EU residents without paying VAT. LL has been too big for a long time to be unnoticed, and EU can retroactively make a claim on VAT.

Either way, LL is FUCKED with this.
1st option: They own A LOT of money to EU.
2nd option: They are raising prices illegally, and are subject for VERY easy lawsuits!

Oh yeah, i just ended chat with concierge, i was DENIED my right to receipts!
also, i was DENIED the demand of not to pay this added VAT on my next Mainland tier payment.

Both of that is ILLEGAL.
(Denied VAT exemption on Mainland tier on next payment, payment for current cycle, is illegal because it's CURRENT cycle, end user has to be given a choice. Otherwise a company could decide to increase price by 10 fold for the service currently being offered and you would be obliged to pay it. You don't need to accept such terms for CURRENT TERM, only NEXT.)


Also, i will be visiting tax office next week to try and find out LL's VAT payments, but i think i need to goto a more central tax office than our capital city area's!
I will head there first to ask questions where to direct my questions, and ask them for documents holdable on court. Hopefully, i will not need an lawyer to get these documents nor court order.


(Oh yeah, i'm NOT an lawyer, so correct me if i'm wrong)

OK, I'll be happy to correct you, since you asked. Your next payment is for 30 days IN ADVANCE. You already paid for the CURRENT cycle, with the last payment you made, which was also made IN ADVANCE. LL bills & collects for the following 30 days IN ADVANCE on all tier and estate payments, which negates your argument and demand to NOT pay VAT on the CURRENT cycle. You DIDN'T pay VAT on the current cycle, which you paid for some time ago!

Mainland tier is NOT paid in advance.
It's paid afterwards.
I verified this from Concierge.

Estates are collected in advance.

Backdating a price increase is the same as increasing prices without allowing the consumer the right to cancel.
And yes, i believe this is illegal under EU law, based on council directive 93/13/EEC-3 (3) 1-L. Which should be implemented in the law of every EU country.

http://eur-lex.europa.eu/smartapi/cgi/sga_doc?smartapi!celexapi!prod!CELEXnumdoc&lg=EN&numdoc=31993L0013&model=guichett

(l) providing for the price of goods to be determined at the time of delivery or allowing a seller of goods or supplier of services to increase their price without in both cases giving the consumer the corresponding right to cancel the contract if the final price is too high in relation to the price agreed when the contract was concluded;

As per usual Linden Labs communication is p!ss poor! So no real surprises there.
I was informed via an email late last night. At first i thought it was a hoax, it was only when i double checked "My Account" page that I saw it for real.
The reality is that the largest community now using SL are the Europeans, that's a fact
you can't run from.

The impact will be felt especially for Land sales such as Private SIM's and plots on Mainland. For example, to buy a brand new SIM from LL now, it will cost me $1968 (UK Vat) instead of $1675 for non- EU customers. Clearly a disadvantage.

I have had to pass on some of those increase in monthly tiers onto my existing residents, had no choice really.It also makes me uncompetitive selling land in future as the tiers I need to set will be more than my non-EU counterparts that pay LL for their monthly SIM tier.

For your average European gamer, its probably now advisable to buy plots of land on Private Islands from non-EU Estate Landowners. That way they pay the Tier direct to Estate owner and not Linden Labs. The biggest impact will be felt most of all for those owning land on Mainland SIMs......why buy a 4096sqm plot with $25+VAT Tier, when you can save yourself the VAT element by buying on a non-EU Private Island. From the above example you save yourself 12 x $4.37 VAT (UK-17.5%) a year on that size plot. If an EU person owns a whole Mainland SIM it becomes 12 x $34.12 (around $400 pa)...by downsizing pr switching to renting or buying smaller size on PI one can make a considerable saving.

I think this will have a bigger impact then the Gambling Ban on Land Economy. Factor in the incoming Age Verification which will hinder the Sex Industry badly......and we have major problem ahead. The trickle down effect will eventually hurt everyone earning money from this game. Example : The impact on sales for house & furniture builders as they will be the 1st in line to feel the downturn on land sales.

On the plus side, renting looks a very good option right now especially for EU residents.

Tier is not paid in advance, it's based on the highest amount of land owned in the previous billing month. If your tier is due tomorrow, you will be taxed and it will be for the previous months ownership.

The Lindens rarely if ever read these forums, so you'll probably be waiting a while if this is the only attempt at contacting them you've made.

Call, submit a ticket, track someone down at office hours, mail an actual letter, but don't expect the forums to be your gateway to the Lindens.

That's correct, as i own both types.