Stolen Textures

well, it's possibly happened.

i bought some "custom" designs from someone to get my clothes line off the ground until i finish creating my own stuff (which i have now made 5 outfits, but will not put up for sale any of the new ones until May 10 or so when i bring out a bunch and host an event about it), and i have now been informed that they are copies of someone elses' work.

i don't yet know if they are the actual textures, or duplicates based on someone else's work, but for now those items are out of my store.

IF i determine they are NOT actual copies (stolen-ripped, whatever) but simply very close to copied but created by this person i bought them from.... well, i would like some advice on how to handle that.

i'm going to the creators' store today to see for myself.

do i never ever sell those again? is that my only 'honest' option?

obviously, if they are determined 'ripped' i am going straight to the Lindens with an ARable offense. i paid a lot of $ for those 'custom' designs that no one else should be selling. HOW do i determine if i had mine first, or the person who they might be duplicated from? any ideas on that? or do i just take their word for it. it's not like i sold any, so, to be honest, it's not really an issue for me to take them down permanently. LOL

Not sure what you mean by custom designs.....anything original is created in photoshop.....if you bought it in-world....then yeah, someone else had to have created the clothing (or whatever it is you're referring to as designs).

I've seen tons of resell clothing packages where basically you just buy a box of pre-made clothes (mostly bathing suits and underwear) and you can tint or apply your own textures.....but the reality is you can't do anything all that original because the clothing is already made in PS by someone else. So you might to be more specific about exactly what happened. Sounds like some kind of scam though.

not BIB.

someone i met while texture store hopping last december (we kept appearing at the same places so i naturally struck up a conversation), discussed with me the idea of starting a clothes line based on grunge, since i had been having fun playing with grunge art in photoshop and mentioned i wanted to sell clothes in that arena.

basically, they told me that they'd customize some outfits for me to start with, that i could mimic or draw ideas from, and that they would be original to me and not sold to anyone else.

i agreed to give it a try, and bought 10 textures, some obviously went together, others could be used in various other outfits with color changes. i took them and created what i wanted with them, and put them up for sale recently.

i have to get to work. i will deal with this later. for now, all the outfits made with the textures bought are off the store floor.

edit: these are not just square textures... meaning, they are shirts and skirts and pants textures.

i KNEW this would happen.

I am not an experienced clothes designer, but I am an experienced shopper...

I think if the actual design is different, why not sell it. If your seams are straighter, if the cuffs are different, if you have prim attachments that the other designer doesn't have... it's a different product.

2 further points:
* Look at RL fashion. Lots of people might use very similar fabrics, but design and construction varies. I don't think someone can expect you to cease and decist, based on the mere fact that you have found the same texture (if it even is exactly the same texture).

* Look at house builders in SL. This is something I AM experienced with. I am SURE other builders are using the same textures I am using. I would never think to keep my work off the market because that same brick or that same window is being used by another designer.

Because, Teejay, the texture itself is part of the art- it is "intellectual property"-

Some people all they do is make textures. (I am not one of them) I know I can't make clothes, however I take nice pics - if I shoot a bunch of stuff and sell it in SL after uploading, the textures are mine - and whomever I sell them to- not someone to take my work- and then claiming it as theirs to resell.

When you buy clothing in RL, the fabric is either for anyone and available widely or is a designer original and only the Design House will have it- that is how 'Knock-Offs' come about in RL.

There is a good chance that the textures have just been "ripped" from SL clothes but its also possible they are just similar or based on the same RL outfit.

If they aren't ripped textures you'll have to make a judgment about how similar they are and whether it is original work that the other designer is selling or an interpretation of a RL design.

It would probably be a good idea to determine if it has happened or not before getting to upset about it.




The Lindens are not likely to care or get involved in a transaction between residents.

It could be, too, that the OP's "designer" does this sort of thing often; sells "custom" designs to lots of people.

If you want to be certain that the person claiming to own the textures isn't lying, then unfortunately all you can really do is to wait for a DMCA notice, and then take the textures down in response.

If you're confident that you can show that you have a (exclusive) license (although it would probably take a lawyer to make that determination) then there's no reason why you shouldn't use them. You paid for them and have the proper documentation to back up your claim to the IP after all.

If the creator violates the exclusive license by selling it to someone else as well, LL won't do anything. It's a resident-resident dispute and you loose out until you take it to court.

You could file a DMCA against whoever else is using them, but they could counter-file and/or convince LL they have a proper license. In both cases LL restores the other person's content and tells you to fight it out in court.

They could file a DMCA against you, you could counter-file and/or try to convince LL you have a proper license. Again, LL would restore your content and tell you both to take it to court.

Unless someone is actually upset enough to take the issue to RL you can all do as you please and end up with a stalemate. Or that's what it looks like to me anyway .

(Edited to add that it's also possible that the person who sold them to you is not the original creator in which case you have no rights to the textures and you should not use them at all)

It's hard to figure out how to handle this, until you've seen the allegedly ripped-off work.

There is no great objective standard to determine what is similar but not a copy, and what is close enough to be a copy. Unless it's an exact copy, you just have to make a judgment call.

However, the person who created textures exclusively for you should be able to help your confidence in those textures by providing some sort of evidence that he or she made those textures. For every texture I've ever made, I have a .psd file showing all of my stages of work and revision. And without even referring back to the .psd file, I could probably describe step-by-step how I made the texture. If your exclusive designer can show you original files, and describe how the textures were made in detail, that could help ease your mind that the textures were not copied.

I hope the person you gave lots of money too hadn't ripped them off.
I guess unless you know a lot about texture sources, know the person's work and there
process there really no way to be 100 percent sure if the product is 100 percent made by
the creator.
If you know who though is original artist and creator you should definitely contact them and talk to them because only the creator of content can file a dcma notice.
Example if you had asked me to make something and I had used any part of image that had photo-sourced the image I would have told you directly where the site had been used in
and what parts even if it was traced and recolored.
I am not expecting to make money here and if I do its extra bonus but
truthfully if I borrow any image I always tell those I give the textures too even if it's
a tiny button because I wouldn't feel right about if I didn't.
I definitely wouldn't sell anything made by others period unless I knew the owners
and was 100 percent sure, had some legal paper stating they were creators, they had given me permission to do so.

Unfortunately there`s A LOT of thievery going on where people are reselling stolen designs to others. So its highly likely that`s what you received. If they are stolen you wont be able to use them, and in that you probably won`t get your money back.

Hopefully this is not what happened, but my items being the victim of schemes like this several times, that`s just where my thoughts first travel.

You should make it a priority to find out for sure, and fast. Ive seen all "virtual hell" break lose on thieves once the designers find the shop selling stolen items. Some people take it to the extremes. If you are new to the fashion scene and you make your entrance with stolen goods, though you did not directly steal them, you will be banned from many sims and have an extremely bad rep. So please do find out.

i still have not received a return message from the creator.

but, i have pics for comparison. you tell me. clearly similar. stolen? or mimicked?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2008/2450063931_a9150c6017.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2231/2450063877_eb416e2e18_m.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2193/2450889450_d7e696c72a_m.jpg

they, along with 2 other outfits made from received textures are off the floor until i get this figured out. i almost just don't want to worry about it. i'm not a thief and i know that.

also, even for as long as i've been frequenting this forum, i have no idea what a DMCA is. can someone define that please.

3Ring, they look to be almost exact duplicates. The comparison images are small, so it's hard to see the details, but over all they look virtually identical. I think you got duped by a con artist.

If you MUST use textures from someone, then make them accept a legally binding agreement that states they are original works for exclusive use by YOU, and don't pay with Lindens. Pay them through any means that creates a RL paper trail.

Two things I do to keep my hands clean:

1. I never ever, ever, EVER accept textures from anyone inside SL (or outside, for that matter) for design use or resale puposes. I simply don't know where the textures/images have been or where they come from. My one exception is custom skinning work. With custom skins clients must first agree to honor my TOS before I start any work. That puts the legal burden upon them should any copyright dispute come up. I also don't accept Linden dollars for that type of work.

2. I never ever, ever, EVER release original layered master files. This is the only REAL proof I have that I am the original creator of the work.

Do the work yourself and you'll never have a reason to second guess it's originality.

Edit: DMCA stands for Digital Millenium Copyright Act.

http://www.copyright.gov/legislation/dmca.pdf

I'd like to know as well!

Revised - OK, they look reeeally similar.. smoeone either stole texture or just made a really similar one on purpose, for those designs. Couldn't tell you who stole the ideas though.

And sorry about my previous version of this post. Was comparing the three, not the two in each.. dunno why, moment of retardation

Ok i figured out what was in images.
If you notice one side the quality of textures are different or less quality but designs look similar.
Yet most designs with few exceptions that I have seen out there look similar.

Overall a pair of jeans looks like a pair of jeans, regardless of who makes them. So, check for the things that no one would ever look at.

Each texture will have individual little flaws - a mismatched seam, a slight glitch on a straight line, etc. The odds of two different designers creating a shirt with exactly the same glitches is extremely remote.

This pair does not look identical to me.

The one on the right seems to have two blue horizontal stripes on the blouse, one at waist level, one at hip level. The one on the left only has it at waist level.

Custom textures for product designs really are a very Big deal. Especially if they are exclusives which is actually a pretty rare thing to order in SL as many people are not willing to pay for them. When I was learning this trade the rule of thumb was ten times the estimated price for the non exlusive custom. And they are ultimately either a big deal or not
depending on how well the creator does with creation and marketing. Potentially they could
be worth thousands of US dollars used on products over a period of years.

One thing I always urge people to do is to make sure they are using legal textures on their
creations whether they are exclusive or not. As you never know how well you may do in the future. If a person is lackadaisical about it, then they come out with a "hot" product using that texture, inevitably someone is going to come up and reveal that it is being used without permission or that it is a net grab, which will of course throw a wet blanket on sales not to mention possible DMCA's and the damage to the creators reputation.

Whenever you buy textures it is best to get them from reputable dealers. Even if they are for
your own use. But it is critical for anyone that is serious about selling their creations in sl.
As time goes by SL is less and less just a "video game" and more and more a very real part of the internet where real commerce takes place.

Some advice for next time and anyone else, do some research on the credibility of your texture sources and expect to pay a bit of money for them. Some people will do custom
jobs for great deals but unless you know them personally, definitely be skeptical if the
price quoted is too low. It will save you a ton of potential headaches in the future.

Hard to tell.

It looks like it may be stolen textures that were then modified. Some looked washed out. Also in the 3rd photo the dress has 2 stripes, while the other, 1 stripe.

Lots of people copy Real World outfits, but if this was an original design and color scheme/pattern by the designer... definitely a copy I wouldn`t be caught reselling.

But is this not just a risk when people soley photosource their creations?

What I mean is that this person may have genuinely believed they were providing 3Ring with 'unique' textures that they photosourced from the web themselves which is what a lot of designers do... and is it just a case of another designer having photosourced the exact same outfit?

I always wondered this... who owns the copyright to photosourced textures in SL just because both have got it from the same place?

Either way 3Ring this sucks this happened to you... if only hindsight happened in life before the deed, we would all be better off

Well beyond the question of who designed the RL fabric texture, the photographer owns
the copyright to the photo who then probably licensed it to the website that you found it on.
And in many cases there are less responsible site owners that do net grabs themselves
without regard to copyrights to try to make their sites look good. Which is a problem as well
because people find images on sites like this and do not find any copyright info and assume
that it is cool to take them.

Which is why unless you are vigorous in tracking down the actual owners of the copyrights
of the images to seek permissions from them, net grabs are usually just a huge legal
hairball which in no way ameliorates the responsibility of the person using them without
permission.

It is actually Easier to take your own pics for your textures. Then you get to enjoy peace of
mind.

If you take photos of any modern clothing design the design is still owned by someone though isn't?