New Search/All Rankings Don't Make Sense

The new Search/All rankings don't make any sense to me.

Here's my example. NCI/New Citizens Incorporated offers 50+ free classes a week. All of these are posted on the Search/Events schedule. NCI has four campuses that have daily traffic ranging from 1200 (for our newest) up to 22,000 (for NCI Kuula), and have the term "classes" included in the descriptions. Lots of people have NCI in their picks (based on anecdotal observation). But if you type "Classes" into the new Search/All, NCI does not show up until page seven!

The number one result if you type in "Classes" is TUi Edumart tutorials. Okay—most likely a decent product. And TUi does a lot of good classes. But if you type in "Edumart", you only get eight total results!

Am I missing some obvious factor?

Oh gee.... here they come. I really hope we don't get a lot of people in here complaining about where they are ranked in the new search.

Much like any other Google search, the results -do- make sense and -do- follow rules, though you may not be aware of what those rules are or how to use them most effectively.

If it made sense, it would be easily gamed. Traffic is not as relevant a factor anymore. You may need to pump up the description of the plots with keywords.

And if they are anything like Google, they will keep the exact way they work it out as a secret so that people can't "game" the system like they did with the campers....

Then why don't you enlighten us, please?

Okay--what are those rules? How do I use them effectively?

I don't think that's it either. The name field has: "NCI Kuula-New Citizens Incorporated-Your Portal to Second Life" and the description field has "Newbie New Players Information Freebies Free Stuff Sandbox Classes Tutorials Help Clothing Newsstand Park Newbie". Those are the keywords that seem to describe us well. Though I'd be happy for any advice on things I'm missing.

Some new details in the blog, though probably not as much as you'd like...

http://blog.secondlife.com/2007/11/13/tip-of-the-week-10-how-to-use-the-new-search-2/#comment-518395

Try this, Carl.

Newbie New Players Information Noobs Freebies Free Sandbox Class Classes Education Teach Teaching Tutor Tutors Tutorials Help Mentor Mentors

If I was searching for "newbie", I think the search results would be different.

I suspect breaking an operation up into separate parcels like NCI has done will move it way down in the search results because some factors that increase rank, such as traffic, are done on a per parcel basis. So taking all of NCI's operations and moving them into one sim with one big parcel would get it a better ranking.

Do the number of objects listed affect ranking. TUi has a lot of objects listed.

Too bad we don't get a list of factors to choose whether to include in determing the order of our list.

Google is gamed every day. There are entire forums out there talking about nothing but.

The new SL search will be gamed as well. All it takes is a little understanding on how the google search appliance works, and how to apply the already existing Google knowledge to SL.

As long as there is RL money at stake, people will do anything for a competitive (or uncompetitive) advantage. That will never change.

Thank you Cristalle. I will try that tonight.

No, they do not all make sense. My search results show many items listed for sale on my land that I do not even own let alone have rezzed on my land, including a female/male shower. I have never owned one.

In addition, our very popular top selling store is not listed at all under key words.

Dont be so sure you are right before you hear what the problems are.

They make perfect sense.. you just have to figure out LL's algorithm for 'sense'

So would putting in camping chairs and strippers

Seriously--NCI's distributed campus system is a deliberate part of our design. When we were all concentrated in Kuula we found it impossible to support all the classes and visitors due to lag and sim crash issues. Now that we are spread out over four campuses, everything works far better.



That could be part of it. I'm not sure there is a way around that, though. NCI is not in the business of selling things. Even our freebies are in a vendor that gives on a click. Perhaps all our our LM givers can be set to "Buy Copy for 0L$" and we can include our keywords in the Description field.

Besides if it made sense it wouldn't be SL.

Carl, if you have the prims, you might plant some underground at each campus with things "for sale" that include the keywords tutorial, tutorial, class, classes, teach, teaching, education, etc.

An excellent idea Cristalle! Thank you!

lol... refining the idea - "sell" all your various classes on each campus.

"building 101 class classes tutorial help mentor"
"object manipulation class classes tutorial help mentor"

etc.

That way it will actual look more relevant in search.

If too much of an industry builds up around gaming the system, they will do exactly what Google does - change how they calculate it, to keep everyone on their toes.

Actually, since they bought the thing from Google, maybe they get that as part of the package and don't have to work on it themselves....

Well here is the thing.... if the system is designed around sale of objects (and it may be) - it evens the ground for businesses, sort of, but favors large landowners and people who buy pricey classifieds (in a pure business context, yes, it should favor those who pay for the ability to be found).

It hurts places like NCI who aren't selling anything but provide an invaluable service. They need an easy way to be found by new players.

Carl, I would write to Jeska and ask her if the amount of educational (or any type) events going on at each parcel goes into the equation, and if she says no or is ambivalent, outright suggest that it SHOULD matter since NCI is always stacked with educational events.

Refining the thought further - link the parcel places search category with events. If it's listed as a hangout, and has events consistent with a hangout (nightlife, live music, etc.) then its relevance should bump higher.

I'm sick of this whole thing, people.

I signed on to SL to create things, and to enjoy selling them to people. I love to create.

I did NOT sign on to play an intense game of "Button, Button, Who's Got the Button" with SL every week or two, just to avoid being HIDDEN.

They are pimping this "All" category to high heaven, shoving everybody to it in the interface, and it is going to kill anyone who can't figure out how to game it, which appears to consist mainly of paying enough to classifeds, in order to show up on it.

I've about had it spending huge chunks of my time trying to beat LL at the game THEY are playing.

That is not my game, and not a game I wish to waste time playing.

First there was the business hiding my shop because they made anything on Mature land hidden by default. I IM'd Lindens to no answer. Finally, I was selling off my property (sold three plots), and IM'd Robin and told her, "This is it, I'm gone. No use trying to sell when my shop is hidden."

Thankfully, Robin got back to me and told me to hang tight; that it would be fixed, and it soon was. Within a week it was changed to default hiding of parcels with mature CONTENT, rather than being on mature land. I could continue.

And now this. This game of trying to figure out how to get seen in the new "All" category they are pimping like there is no tomorrow, basically SHOVING players at it in Search. (In the preview viewer.)

And within it, are so many OTHER horrible things - so many ways to game (and you HAVE to game) - so many that it would take a Ph.D. to figure them out, and as they have said, they can tweak backstage however and whenever they want to, without informing us.

Now I've no doubt that is a game some people enjoy playing, but it is not my game. My game is creating.

IF they needs to do this new "All" category, it should at least be the LAST category, and not promoted on the search page as if it were the be-all and end-all of everything.

Instead, they are so proud of it, they've got to make sure everyone goes to it FIRST.

And you know people will, and they will pick off the first page, and from the classifieds beside it, and that will be that. They won't plow through the following pages, and will be less likely to look at classifieds.

I find myself not having time to work on my new items, due to having to figure out this next new horrible thing. And that is BAD.

And it plain old stops being worth it. I didn't sign on to play marketing strategist in a world where the marketing rules change at the drop of a hat.

That's a game of us trying to survive, and the Lindens constantly moving the goal posts to kill us off, and I didn't sign on for that game. I don't like that game.

It's too time-intensive and takes away from my REAL job here, which is to create new things.

I'm sick of having to abandon my shop and my creating in order to figure out how to even be found.

I've got a VERY strong feeling that a single $100,000 classifed each week would probably do the trick. But I don't want to spend $400 to find out.

coco

from campers to use every single free prim u have as description, good way forward, now we won`t lag cause of the campers but from rezzing 15000 prims in each sim...

almost ...

Odds are 100,000 L$1 classifieds would do the "trick".

Really? That's useful information.

Please, PLEASE someone tell me how to get off the first page of "All."

Let's say I've looked up "prefabs" and gotten a page of results.

When I click on the page 2, or 3, or "Next page" (at the bottom),it doesn't do anything but highlight some of the first page I'm already looking at.

I'm stuck on the first page of "prefabs."

What am I doing wrong?

coco