Fair casino play

In the thread on rigged casino games there were some suggestions for ways to prove that games are legit. Here is my idea for how this could be done.

The idea is to use a pseudo random number generator that works from a specific seed. This would be used in place of llFrand(). There are many possibilities but I would propose to use llMD5String() on the seed and parse the returned value to create random data.

So what you would do in something like blackjack or video poker, is at the end of the hand, the machine would tell the player what the seed had been. The player would be wearing a HUD which would check the seed against the cards which had appeared and make sure that this seed does in fact produce those cards. In this way the player would be sure that the cards were randomly and fairly chosen, and it would be impossible for the machine to cheat by messing with the cards.

Of course, machines could still cheat by simply refusing to pay people when they should, or conveniently "crashing", or for that matter sprouting legs and running off as soon as you pay them. But this kind of cheating would be obvious. The bigger problem is machines that bend the odds, and the proposal here should fix that.

To go into the idea in a little more detail: in order for the HUD to know what cards had been dealt during the hand, the machine would have to tell it as each card appeared. The HUD can't know what the machine is showing the player, so the HUD would need to show the player the cards it hears from the machine. The player would have to make sure that the HUD cards matched the machine ones; but actually, it makes more sense for the player simply to look only at the HUD to see what his cards were. The machine display is redundant and only useful for looky-loos. So in practice, the machine would tell the HUD the cards, and the HUD would show the cards to the player.

The HUD would remember the cards and then, at the end of the hand (or at the end of the deck, in blackjack, when it is to be re-shuffled), the machine would reveal the random seed and the HUD would then confirm that no cheating had occured.

One more point: the machine should not choose the random seed itself, otherwise it could try a lot of possible seeds until it finds one that is favorable to itself. Instead, the machine and player together must jointly choose a fair seed. This is one of the oldest crypto protocols in the book, and it goes like this:

Machine chooses seed1
Machine sends llMD5String(seed1) to player (i.e. HUD)
Player chooses seed2
Player sends seed2 to machine
Machine plays using a random seed of llMD5String(seed1+seed2)
Machine sends each card to player (HUD) as the game goes on
At end, machine sends seed1 to player
Player (HUD) verifies llMD5String(seed1) matches what it got in step 2
Player (HUD) re-creates seed = llMD5String(seed1+seed2)
Player (HUD) re-checks all cards

This algorithm ensures that seed cannot be known by the player and cannot be pre-chosen by the machine. (This assumes that MD5 is strong, which is not so true anymore, but there are ways to fix that which I won't go into here.)

And the final point, which is most important: the HUD would be open source. We would define a standard protocol for machine-HUD communications which could be shared across a range of gambling machines. The random number generator would be standard, and the HUD would just enforce that it was not cheating. Everything else about the game could be customized and each game builder could have his own techniques and secrets. The game machines themselves would be private just like today, only the HUDs would be open source. In this way game designers could prove to their players that they weren't cheating, while still having privacy and a competitive advantage by using their own techniques in their games.

Well, I don't know how solid this is but even if it is a bulletproof way nothing is stopping the many casino operators from avoiding it and writing their own scripts. Plus it kind of seems like a hassle on players if they have to go and verify every seed or play themselves.

I feel the only way to make it fair is to have a group to keep tabs on them, maybe supply them with fair scripts, blacklist the cheaters and warn new players about unsafe gambling.

Ongoing Discussion here
/165/9d/80377/2.html#post897527

The players wouldn't have to manually verify the seeds and play, the HUD they are wearing would do it for them. I antiticpate that HUDs would be given away and be open source. Experts could review HUD scripts and you could make sure you had a trustworthy one. Meanwhile the game machine script can be completely private, it just has to follow the protocol for the random number generator so the HUD can verify it is not cheating.

As a potential player, wouldn't you prefer to play in a casino where you couldn't be cheated? Where your HUD would check each play of the machines to be sure it had been fair? If this technology became popular and successful, it could get to the point where non-compliant casino games were automatically presumed to be cheating. Casino owners would find it unprofitable to run gambling machines which did not follow the rules, and we would see more honest games. One source of bad feelings among players would be eliminated and the SL experience would be improved.

I think a good way to make that technology become popular would be to sell it as part of a 'casino business kit" at a fair price.

Then any new wannabe casino operators will most likely buy that and get their casino going quickly, as opposed to writing scripts themselves or hiring scriptors. It seems like a win/win situation.. The fair scripts will go into more casinos, newbs can start a casino easier, you won't need to open source any code (?I don't think) and last but not least.. you can make $ at it too!

A reference: The blacklist idea could be considered blackmail and/or extortion. Make a list of 'certified fair use' versus a blacklist, with no hint that others -are- unfair..only that those on the list are fully trustable.

I'm not so sure. By your definition, just posting a bad message in the forums would be "blackmail" since anyone can search it up and decide to avoid your casino. How about those TV commercials which compare products (like, pepsi vs coke)...blackmail?? Or how about any form of RL politics. People should be allowed to make informed decisions. Even the Lindens strongly advise against using "vending machines" in SL. That must tell you something.

I think if there is an affordable "casino startup kit" containing fair scripts, nobody in their right mind will go through all the trouble of writing their own scripts from scratch or hiring scriptors...unless they need to scam people. We won't need a blacklist. Just a list of casinos that use the kit would suffice. Anyone doing forum research will see the kit was made with a focus on fair play. Chances are, if it's easy to buy and set up.. The odds of visiting a fair casino will increase.

Unless they like to script.. or want to buil it all on their own..or want to feel acheivment not ready made...

There are -many- reasons people would avoid premade casino scripts.

Personally.. I'd rather visit a casino built from scratch, with love and pride, not just bought. it just shows more care for your craft than the buying does.. tends to show 'caring, ambitious manager' versus 'cold easy way out manager.'

Yes, I use a prefab house..I don't plan to build a house myself..and I -am- learning to do clothing.

Edit: I would get the hud freeware just to check casinos.. find any who react to it, I would leave and spend my money elsewhere

I'm not sure how the HUD will work exactly.. or if some clever casino scriptors will be able to work around it. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, since I don't fully undertand it.. but maybe it isn't enough. I think a kit will help to lessen the problem, while providing a service to SL entrepreneurs. and nobody says you can't customize the look of the casino kit

1. I would prefer writing my own scripts from scratch
2. I do agree with a fair gaming seal of approval idea, in that it verifies that the script does what it claims, e.g. a game can be unfair if it tells you how it's unfair. For instance a double or nothing machine that aims to give back 99% of the money it takes in. (I'm working on that one)

3. One possibility is that once someone develops something, there could possibly be a data/script server process whereby the script running the machine is obtained by the machine from a verified server on random intervals. with possibly a matching key idea (e.g. on touch the machine displays a code that a seperate device also displays both obtained from a verification server. Not sure how possible all this is but it's just an idea.

what about a fair gaming group? casino's and games become group machines that way they can be checked? there could be a mechanism to make sure the right person ends up with the money.