Conference Call with Land Owners

Thanks Robin that makes sence.
Interesting to note that no one owns 15 sims as they claim.

I dont need any more info. Thanks for explaining the process and why ppl were picked and how many responded.

Cat

If you don't know who the twenty people are how can you make statemenst such as the people polled were the ones who spent the most money or owned the most land?

attack the topic not the person. Apparently I was mistaken in my assuption. But you knew the answer to that question before you asked it.

Actually I didn't know because I didn't scroill down to see Robin's post. It wasn't an attack either it was a question. A lot of the problem with things like this lately are people making assumptions and characterizing them as facts which leads all sorts of people to start talking about the sky falling.

On the other hand it might have been better if LL sent out an email to all land holders asking their questions. They would have probably gotten a better return and more information.

Talen Morgan I find it ironic that you are continuing to harrass me again today. I have asked you to stop yet you don't.

I also find it ironic that you accuse me in a public forum of bashing at least 2 ppl which I have not done. Yet you continue to harrass and bash me for the last 2 days.

You are now on perm. ignore.

from talen morgan:
"Actually I didn't know because I didn't scroill down to see Robin's post. It wasn't an attack either it was a question. A lot of the problem with things like this lately are people making assumptions and characterizing them as facts which leads all sorts of people to start talking about the sky falling.

On the other hand it might have been better if LL sent out an email to all land holders asking their questions. They would have probably gotten a better return and more information."

end quote from talen morgan.

How is the above an attack on any way? Honestly? It's not an attack. What the hell?

LF

LF why is this your concern? If you realy must know Talen has been posting every chance he gets in the last two days. I was referring to the one above that post. Usualy a snide insulting or condescending remark. I am tried of dealing with him. Read the other threads and fourms. There are plenty to choose from. Your not helping.

Cath

catherine, talen had only entered that line of discussions to defend himself from the blanket conspiracy theory you laid down involving a group he is a part of.

Catherine,

I am sorry, I am confused too. You quoted Talen's post asking you can comment on anything about the twenty people involved if you don't know who they are, saying it was an attack. That is not an attack, it is a question, and a valid one at that.

That's a long ago battle I gave up on in the old sims of SL, in the far distant past. Keep up the good fight Snakekiss! Hugs

Yes, simple: Bid, win, and redistribute the land among the less fortunate at wholesale prices. But that means taking action and risks.

As the great Socialist Revolutionary Leader, Ernesto "Che" Guevara once said:




Robin: Thank you for your efforts regarding this issue. You guys are on top of it. But no matter how hard you try, it will never be enough or good enough. Don't let that discourage you.

- T -

So, again.. not all of them are the evil land barons.

There seems to be a need for larger plots initially. I know many newer people that like the 1536m tier. It is ashamed to have to make the process so difficult trying to obtain 3 512m plots right next to each other just to get what was originally wanted. They probably wind up spending more than neccesary as well.

I would like to see a more flexible tier fee schedule. The amount land tier doubles as they get bigger. A person that has 4096m may just want an extra 1024, but have to pay to hold another 4096m. And, ultimately will not buy land in the next tier because of the quanity and cost involved.

I think that the real money to be made by LL is via land tier fees. There is too much emphasis on the initial selling of land. The goal ought to be to have more customers owning land, making the process easy is essential. The real reward is happy customers proud of their land holdings and paying tier fees for the long haul. Making it easier to hold various amounts of land, different from current tier structure, ought to be a priority for LL.

I have no desire to answer someone who attacked me all weekend. Just becuase he posts one decent responce to me does not automaticaly grant him that right.

Cat

As for the 20 ppl read my response to robin it sums up my thoughts.

agreed!

my guess:

inital land sell revenues cover any hardware and infrastructure costs.

land tier fees cover the service provided.


FREE FREE FREE

Since you tell the 20 people to refer to your response to Robin's comment, I'd like to say a few things.


Cat.. *some* might be, but w/o knowing who participated in the poll, you're really just taking a guess. My guess is that the ones you despise probably didn't respond.


So, who should they have asked? Take, for example, if LL wanted to have a round-table discussion about LSL. Doesn't it make sense that they discuss it, at least initially, with the folks who use LSL the most? IMO, if you want to discuss a feature of SL, you start discussions with folks that use that feature the most. As for setting policy, that's where it should be a community-wide discussion.



There you go again, lumping all of the participants into a category. Oh, and you don't even know who participated. Nice.

Cat, give me a break, please.

I'm attacking you? Puh-leeze. Please point to where I was 'attacking' you. Further, how am I, or anyone, to respond to a comment YOU made or an opinion YOU voiced without directing it at YOU?? Please explain.

So, I took the liberty of saying you 'despise', when in fact, you did not ever mention that. What you did say was: "I think it should also be noted however some of them are the most hated players in SL."

While you didn't utter the words "despise" you made a blanket statement on behalf of the entire SL community about these people. Or am I mis-reading that?

Next, you didn't answer my question: If you disagree with WHO they chose to participate in the discussion.... who should they have chosen? Doesn't it make sense that you choose those who use the feature most to *start* the discussion? Please address.

Lastly, I think you may be confused about my 'lumping' comment. You did lump all of the participants together: "I just dont see it doing anything but glorify and validating what they have done in the past."

Who would 'they' be, Cat? The respondants?

Sigh

Its common knowledge how ppl feel about certain ppl in these forums. I am not defending everyones thoughts here.

I did disagree with who they picked in the begining as I took them to mean the top land owners. If you notice later on Robin posted a very clear statement and I thanked her for it. Apparently not many responded at all. So does that change my opinions? of course it does. It also changes some of the things I said in the beginging. Its not an excuse, its an explination of the initial information that was given and just my responce to it.

Yes I was miffed when I thought that they chose just a small segment of the population without reguard to other players. Apparently that is not the icase according to some of robins later statements.

I cannot be held with contempt for assuming the obvious from the information I had at the time.

Cat

I gotcha Cat.

I guess it's a good thing I chose to participate in the discussion. Unfortunately, due to RL work, I was not able to attend. As I'm *not* a land dealer, I felt I should really do what I could to voice my opinion on the matter, so I submitted my thoughts to Robin via email. I was worried the discussion would only include the opinions of land dealers, so I did what I could to toss in my $.02.

I'm another person who has been quite active in slowly, and painstakingly restoring two of the older sims. Lusk and Perry.

I've been managing the land in luskwood for almost a year now, in lusk, and then additionally restoring and attempting to aggregate the entirety of perry. Turning as much of these two older sims to a sort of free-form parkland as i can, with the help of several friends. Additionally i've helped manage the lusk estates land trust, returning what was a barren and useless wreck of a 'planned' community back into something people can actually participate in, and enjoy.

Its not easy working within these older sims... The utter terribleness of their patchwork states is hard to over-emphasize. And their best feature, their terraformability, also can become one of the worst nightmares of dealing with plots in them (when someone tries to extort some cash by holding land you want (often small little squares in the middle of land you own) hostage by terraforming it into 30m high spikes and other annoyances.

The new terraforming tools have helped alot... especially the smooth tool. definate kudo's for that.

There are still alot of problems with 'dead' accounts.. especially long dead lifetimers.

Being in an old sim, there are random little squares and strips in perry that are owned by accounts that haven't logged in in easily 6-9 months, or more. I would love to incorporate them into our land, for terraforming.. and because of a newer, more disturbing trend that i've begun to see.

People are looking for these types of plots, and often setting up stores or scanners etc on them. Knowing full well that no one in game can really *do* anything about it. There are several plots like that in perry right now... most actively *inside* of our land.


Another problem thats been thankfully fixed was the public land baron fiasco's... i honestly don't want to think about how many times i'd log in and see a plot i've been wanting to get for *MONTHS* is now owned by one of 2-3 sepcific people, and set for sale, for $20 or more per square meter. Its especially aggrivating when its a little *useless* like 64sqm plot, set for sale for TENS of thousands of linden... basically outright extortion... combine that with spinnning particle spitting signs, and land-terraforming extortion and its been a serious uphill ride to just try and get a good area.


Griefing has been another problem. When yer in an old sim.. especially one bordering the welcome area... yer gonna generally get the worst SL has to offer when it comes to bored people with over-powered guns. The tools in the game to combat this type of behavior, especially during events etc just are nowhere near adequate. And its far too easy to get in trouble yourself, if you try and take matters into yer own hands, even if its to protect a friend hosting an event on *YOUR* land.


One last sorta aside as far as problems that've been increasingly aparant. Sim hardware. We've had the luxury of stable sims (build wise) for quite some time now... and its been pretty shocking just how much performance can differ between sims. A good part of that is probably not cpu's.. as they don't seem to be that diffrent, but rather overall chipset/ram/system performance.

Whatever the cause.. it really.. really sucks... when one day a sim you basically own, can be running 1000 fps with nary a blip of lag, with 15 people over... and the very next day... after a sim crash... yer sim is running about 100 fps.. with 5 people.. and havin time dilation flicker back an forth like crazy...

and the only thing that changed is the sim number (say from 475 to 40).

It really sucks that i'm forced to pay the same $195 this month... for a sim thats barely been usable... compared to last month... when we were 'top of the world' hardware wise..


well thats about all i have to say monologue-style on owning large land blocks, in older sims... We've been asked about movin to an island before... and sometimes it can be sorta tempting... but i wouldn't give up bein part of the *REAL* sl for the world. Havin new people wander over and jus talk is somethin i wouldn't give up.. even for a more controlled island setting

-PS I learned shortly after the conference, via email.. that i was in the group of 100 (though i was not in the group that was randomly picked to actually phone in)