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a few thoughts on opting out of campus research

Remo Yossarian
Registered User
Join date: 15 Feb 2004
Posts: 121
10-28-2004 05:18
From: StoneSelf Karuna


i really want some way to opt out of dealing with these people.



Well I don't speak for these groups or LL but I can tell you, in most western nations you can't escape from being studied. You can't escape the promethean element which pushes humankind forward and upward.

Everyone here is being studied.

You are studied when you buy bread, perform a bank transaction, and when you make a telephone call. I am being studied right now as I type this.

I ask that you submit so that Prometheans can gain an enhanced understanding of all humans. We will do both good and bad things with this knowledge.

I am studying you right now. I could write 1000's of pages just on the contents of this simple post. There are volumes of information contained within a simple human gesture, or in the path of a piece of paper as it falls to the ground....

Opps... Sorry I need to go and work on my genetically engineered man-eating hamster.
Donovan Galatea
Cowboy Metaphysicist
Join date: 25 Mar 2004
Posts: 205
10-28-2004 05:25
omg, I just read Richard Parent's vitae/bio last night.

He's a graduate student. In the Department of English. Which means he's doing cultural studies. And he uses words like narrative, hermeneutics, metaphor, metonym, synedoche, and reflexive writing. He either belongs to or aspires to the Modern Language Association. And reads "continental" comic books by the likes of Jacques Derrida and Michel de Certeau. And winces at the name "Alan Sokal" or mention of the Social Text affair.

It explains everything. Especially why his class is doing what amounts to human subjects studies without the necessary and common-sensical precautions.

My bad. I thought he was a seasoned academic in a field that recognizes the need for careful preparation and procedure. I thought he might have been one of those "very smart" ethnographers or anthropologists -- or perhaps even a sociologist.

Please, LL, work with these people to develop standards of cultural penetration and resistance. (See? Their language is fun to use, too.)

;)

ed. to add winky face
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
10-28-2004 09:48
From: DoteDote Edison
There are three study groups... they are called study groups, not research groups. They are studying various aspects of this new form of interaction (not that it's new, since it's been around in one form or another since my first encounter with "Worlds Away" back in the early 90's.)
what they called doesn't actually change what they are doing. they are doing research with human subjects.
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Wiggle Biggles
Second Life Resident
Join date: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 645
10-28-2004 10:49
What's the problem with this exactly?

I could understand if there is harrasment involved, but being studied isnt to bad. How does it negatively affect anyone if someone observes them and draws conclusions?

I do it all the time, I just dont write it down anywhere, but there is definately studying and conclusions going on here.
Ansi Belvedere
Second Life Resident
Join date: 17 Oct 2004
Posts: 23
10-28-2004 11:05
From: Wiggle Biggles
What's the problem with this exactly?


The problem is that you haven't been correctly brainwashed. What they're saying is that they have a RIGHT to privacy, and a RIGHT to control where the words they say go. Moreover, they have a RIGHT to know EXACTLY what someone intends. This is pretty standard fare for most first-world countries, who seem to suddenly develop a hugely complex, mostly irrational, and completely unenforceable system to manage these kinds of things. For example, in America (that is, the USA) it is considered ASSAULT to INSULT someone. I'm not kidding. Nobody enforces it, but it's true.

Unfortunately, these are not rights, and never were. They're laws. Those are different. If LL doesn't implement those laws in the scope of their new nation, that is their choice.

-Ansi
Wiggle Biggles
Second Life Resident
Join date: 18 Oct 2004
Posts: 645
10-28-2004 11:18
From reading the other post, "Panda in a pitri dish" it seems that the real problem is that some of the students dont havqe a clue about virtual world manners, but other than that I dont see a problem.

They would also be totally mistaken to think that everyone in these worlds have social problems or are hiding from the scary real world. Some may have problems that SL allow them to get around I'm sure, but that is a pretty shallow observation.

As far as really experiencing the game world, they need to get over their "I'm studying you" attitudes and just go interact with people like any other newb.

I invite some students to come along with me if they like and we can go study some hawt virtual women and act a fool playing some bingo.
Rose Karuna
Lizard Doctor
Join date: 5 Jun 2004
Posts: 3,772
10-28-2004 11:30
From: Kris Ritter
What makes you think people are going to 'put on a show' for them? What, like the fucktards who just HAVE to wave at a tv camera when a reporter is doing a broadcast or something?

I think the only likely conscious behavioural change that will occur around these jokers (sorry, students) is that people will stfu whenever they come near for fear of being quoted out of context or psycho analysed by some jumped up little snob who thinks we're all sad losers and beneath them.

The only show I'd be putting on for them is showing them what the ejection tools are for :)



*** Pulling Down Pants and mooning the little piss ants. ***** :D
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Lecktor Hannibal
YOUR MOM
Join date: 1 Jul 2004
Posts: 6,734
10-28-2004 11:54
My my what a lovely moon tonight !! :D
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StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
10-28-2004 14:20
From: Wiggle Biggles
What's the problem with this exactly?

I could understand if there is harrasment involved, but being studied isnt to bad. How does it negatively affect anyone if someone observes them and draws conclusions?

I do it all the time, I just dont write it down anywhere, but there is definately studying and conclusions going on here.
many studies start out well intentioned and certainly without any intention of harm, but in the course of actual study, harm has been done in many cases. that is why universities put their studies through a human subjects committee - to make sure no harm will be done, and that every precaution to prevent harm has been taken.
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AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
10-28-2004 14:39
From: Ansi Belvedere
What they're saying is that they have a RIGHT to privacy, and a RIGHT to control where the words they say go. Moreover, they have a RIGHT to know EXACTLY what someone intends.
actually standards of for academic studies exist to 1) protect the subjects, 2) protect the researcher, and 3) validate the methodoloy.

a little insight into the concerns of internet research:
http://www.aaas.org/spp/sfrl/projects/intres/report.pdf

federal human research guidelines:
http://ohsr.od.nih.gov/guidelines/45cfr46.html

The definition of a "human subject" from the federal rules for human subject research, 45 CFR 46.102(f), is "a living individual about whom an investigator (whether faculty or student) conducting research obtains 1) data through intervention or interaction with the individual, or 2) identifiable private information." Private information includes information about behavior that occurs in a context in which the subject can reasonably expect that no recording is taking place and information the subject has provided for a specific purpose and can reasonably expect will not be made public (for example, a medical record).

46.102 Definitions.
(d) Research means a systematic investigation, including research development, testing and evaluation, designed to develop or contribute to generalizable knowledge. Activities which meet this definition constitute research for purposes of this policy, whether or not they are conducted or supported under a program which is considered research for other purposes. For example, some demonstration and service programs may include research activities.
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AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
StoneSelf Karuna
His Grace
Join date: 13 Jun 2004
Posts: 1,955
what rises to the level of research
10-29-2004 15:25
so i haven't been able to reach u pitt's research oversight group, yet. but i did speak to uc berkeley's Committee For Protection of Human Subjects. while are not the same university, the definitions of research are largely uniform across universities.

in general things that make this class activity rise to the level research
- this class is funded by the univesity
- that there is human interaction that is sought out
- personal data (even essays) is being published. publishing to a website counts.

notably things that do not need human subjects review are listed through these exemptions:
http://cphs.berkeley.edu/content/guidelines.htm#part2

in particular, exemptions would be granted IF

[...]

3. Surveying or Interviewing:
(a) Research involving survey or interview procedures is exempt if:
(i) in the researcher's private data (including field notes) as well as in any published material, responses are recorded anonymously and in such a manner that the human subjects cannot be identified, directly or through identifiers linked to the subjects; or

[...]

4. Public Observations: Research involving the observation of public behavior, including observation by participants, is exempt if:
(a) in the researcher's private data (including field notes) as well as in any published material, observations are recorded in such a manner that individual human subjects cannot be identified, directly or through identifiers linked to the subjects; or

[...]

however, the criteria for these exemption are not met, and at uc berkeley the class activity would need review. and i think they would need review at u pitt.

the thing that was the largest ethical violation was publishing the log in relation to this study. this ethical violation was initiated by the instructor's lack of preparation, and compounded by his poor response.
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AIDS IS NOT OVER. people are still getting aids. people are still living with aids. people are still dying from aids. please help me raise money for hiv/aids services and research. you can help by making a donation here: http://www.aidslifecycle.org/1409 .
Kathy Yamamoto
Publisher and Surrealist
Join date: 1 May 2003
Posts: 615
Oh Brother
10-29-2004 22:34
Look, here's my perspective.

Except for those things I choose to keep to myself, I am straightforward in all my dealings, speech, actions and responses. I will certainly NOT be changing ANYthing just because some college student is standing next to me watching. At least until he creeps me enough that I feel I want to respond. Then I'll either tell him to bugger off - amplified with whatever appropriate technical gadgets and tools I happen to have at hand - or I will leave myself. OR I may start doing my Riverdance routine. (I don't have one yet, but I know where to buy a script ;-)

At any rate, I expect the people around me to respect my dignity and the Community Standards. If they don't then they're in trouble. End of story.

Until they make me notice them, however, they are welcome to come and go as they please. And to write whatever they please. They have the very same rights I do. As far as I understand. they are here under the same set of rules I am under.

So, if they follow all the rules, I could give a fetid fig what they see, say or submit to their class. If they don't follow the rules, then their butts are up for a proper SL-style re-education :-)
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Kathy Yamamoto
Quaker's Sword
Leftist, Liberals & Lunatics
Turtlemoon Publishing and Property
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Emmy Guillaume
Breaker of Items Scripted
Join date: 26 Jun 2004
Posts: 67
10-30-2004 00:41
In the conversation that I had with a nameless Pitt - whom I thought was rude and whiny to be asked to view their behavior for possible etiquette issues - they made the statement "Why is everyone so mad? I'm new and not very familiar on the terms of service!"

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the SL TOS a umpty-ump paged document that you have to do something to in order to get online the first time you sign on? ie, you can't NOT read it, unless you blow by it in your eagerness to get online?

In most places 'ignorance of the law is no excuse'. And in SL, TOS sort of is 'the law'..(that, and a nice pair of Seburos with a push script). Whether you read it or not..you checked a box saying "I Agree" or something similar in order to get far enough into SL to piss people off.

If this were a chat room in the old days, many of these children would be Snerts on a school holiday. You can either laugh them off your land, shoot them, ban them or ignore them. They certainly are no longer doing any sort of 'secret' observation. I also think their assignment was to spend 10 hours in SL. 10 hours is just enough time to learn how to fly into walls, and put a box of clothes on your head. Not sure what valuable insight they are going to get out of that.

Also, since any kind of electronic chat has the chance of being cut and pasted, I'd think it would be prudent to take care what one said in online discourses with 'new friends'

My $2L (adjusted for recent extreme Linden Crash)
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