Clarification of New Forum Policy Changes

Posted by Jeska Linden in the LL Announcement Forum:

Forum Policy Change & Clarification

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clarification
I wanted to post further clarification on the new Forum Policy Changes, as there seems to be some confusion surrounding the above announcement.
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Disciplinary Actions
Due to the unification of the in-world and forum discipline policies, forum discipline is now using a similar matrix as is used in-world. This means when a Resident violates the Community Standards or Forum Guidelines, points are recorded and tabulated much as on a driver’s license. The severity of the action and the previous history are both taken under account when assigning points. Much as it is in-world, discipline for the forums is escalated as follows:
Warnings
3-Day Suspension
7-Day Suspension
14-Day Suspension, Review for Ban
This means that one or more warnings will normally be issued to forum violators before any further disciplinary action is undertaken.

Suspension/Banning Clarification
If a Resident receives a two-week suspension, Linden Lab automatically initiates a Review for Ban. This escalation to a Ban Review then goes to the Resident Review Panel (read more here ). Very few Residents ever reach this stage of the disciplinary process.

Previously Banned Residents
To clarify, previously when a Resident was banned solely from the Forums, they were still able to view some of the forums, including the Linden Announcements and the Classifieds. Also, Residents banned from the forums are able to post to the classified forums, although that is a privilege and will be immediately revoked upon any misuse. All previously banned SL Forum Residents will retain these settings going forward.
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Discuss...

So, to summarize, if I say so-and-so is a monkey's mistress, I'm not going to be immediately banned without explanation.

I coulda told you that before, though.

I just don't understand why players banned from the forums cannot at least read them. It seems rather petty to me.

Alexa

Is there a roll-off for these warnings? A time period that can go by and the warning goes off your record? Or is this a permanent record with red checkmarks next to my name?

This is repressive, people! Fight! Fight against it!

coco

Judging by the level of civility and relative calm of the past few days, it's also effective. Seems like a nice change of pace to me. I may change my mind after I get my first forum vacation

I'm more leaning towards, "Embrace it"... Nothing wrong with some good repression, opression, or other forms of *sion... Except maybe depression, I guess... If it keeps these forums from being the monkey house they have been for the last god-knows-how-long, it's a good thing in my book.

I don't know about that, a couple of us just got called morons over in the copyright/trademark thread.

I think this is very fair, and linking inWorld behavior and forum behavior is a good way to help everyone remember that their actions have consequences.

People have to be willing to take responsibility for their own actions, including what they say, and I truly believe this is the way to do it.

Tying forum posts to the ability to play the game clearly represses speech on the forums.

And gives more ability to players to control not just what people join in on the forums, but also to punish them in-world as well - where they may have never done one thing wrong - just because they don't play nice in the forums.

Other posters can now be instrumental in getting someone BANNED FROM THE GAME on the basis of what that person SAID IN THE FORUMS.

Where is the bloody logic in that?

It is assault on free speech, pure and simple! Free speech in the public forum! That has NOTHING to do with the game - neither what has been said in the game nor what has been done on the game.

It's almost as if somone were arrested for making a public nuisance of themselves at a political rally in the town square, and while they were at it, the police also took away their house, in a neighborhood where they never bothered anybody. Probably because they hadn't been invited to express their views in their neighborhood. Yet - they will lose their house.

I imagine people would behave better at political gatherings and other such public meeting places if they know that the other people there could not only get them hauled off to jail for their behavior, but could actually TAKE AWAY THEIR HOUSE AND THEIR WHOLE LIFE. Of course, people would then behave better at the political gathering! That goes without saying. That would be repressive.

Particularly for those with minority views!

There's a difference between people who have been asked to join a forum to speak their views, and their in-game lives.

It makes no sense to invite people to a forum to speak their views, while at the same time adding an abuse report button, and anonymous protection for those who use it, while also cautioning everyone that what they say on the forums, how they conduct themselves there, may also mean they can't play the game at all.

Get on that thread, y'all, and speak up against this tying of forum behavior with the game.

coco

Coco,

Perhaps you'd do better to understand that this isn't a public forum. Its a private forum, run by LL for the benefits of the residents. You don't have the right to free speech in a private forum. You can't be arrested for it, but you can certainly be expelled from the forum.

- Jon

Backtrack:

I know it's not a public forum. I have nothing against people being banned from the public forum for what the Lindens deem to be their abuse of it, based on abuse reports of people's posts and the Lindens own evaluation of a person's forum behavior.

I am saying it is wrong to tie that to a person's ability to play the game itself.

And unnecessarily repressive.

coco

The logic is pretty clear ... dont stay stuff in the forums that can get you in trouble. And before someone asks how do you know what will get you in trouble, I firmly believe that each and every one of us knows when we are getting ready to say something we hadn't oughta. The problem comes when we then choose to say it anyway, or find some way to rationalize to ourself that its justified in some way.

And I do not believe this is an assault on free speech in public forum. Im reminded that these are private forums. The sand box belongs to Linden Labs. All the toys are theirs.

So there never /has/ been free speech in a public forum ... cause that isn't what this place is.

Edited to add: The point remains that this is an effective way to make sure that everyone understands that their words have consequences. In that respect, no speech is free ... surely there is a quote out there to that effect?

What Jim said.

With the added thought: Yes. It's repression of free speach. About f'ing time. Free speach is a terrible thing on message boards.

While I disagree with some aspects of what you have been saying about this, I agree completely that forum behavior should in no way be tied to in world access. That is beyond overreaching. I would not want to see SL taken away from even the worst forum offenders. If they act out in world, then deal with it there. Otherwise, what they have in essence done is extended TOS through the back door by making the forum "guidelines" affect in world discipline as well. That is clearly wrong.

Gah . . .

By the logic, I don't mean the logic of the process that leads one to being banned in the forums.

I mean the logic by which forum behavior leads to game banning.

And I KNOW these are not public forums. What does that have to do with it?

All private forums have limited speech, as set forth in TOS.

That those rules are there - which I uphold fiercely, by the way - is not what I'm talking about.

Those rules already limit speech here. In the right way.

I am talking about adding BANNING FROM THE GAME as a consequence of BREAKING FORUM RULES.

THAT is what is repressive. It's repressive because it creates a climate of fear (or delusions of power) where one should not, and need not, exist.

In other words, this is an unnecessary assault on our current freedom of speech in these private forums, which will have a repressive effect on speech in these forums.

Am I yet making myself clear here?

coco

P.S. Or, what Cristiano said. In fewer words.

Notice I said "relative"

I agree with Jim.

I've never understood the desire to be a total asshat on the forums, but then claim to be an angel in world. You're either an asshat, or you aren't... Unless you're roleplaying a seperate persona for either the forums or in-world, which is a choice which will also now have consequences other than neg-rates for forum behavior. I simply don't buy it that our personalities completely change just because we're in the forum and not in-world, or that "Well, it was only the forums." is an excuse any adult should expect to get away with.

We all have our moments of asshattery, but perhaps having more meat behind the threat of suspension will force some of us to think before we post.

Many of your previous forum posts would easily run afoul of the new rules - as would mine and those of a lot of other people. It wasn't such a terrible thing when the free speech was applying to you. The new guidelines amount to being able to be warned for saying boo if it scares some poor sensitive person. People need a bit of a backbone. This is not some whitewashed Disneyland - we are adults, not children that need to run to mommy LL because someone called us a bad name!

And I will have the same personality in my home that I do in the public square.

But does that mean disturbing the peace in the public square should carry with it the penalty of losing one's home?

coco

Well I think it's pretty obvious that the previous guidelines and disciplinary measures in the forums weren't effective. Without making forum bans have in world consequences, how would you suggest giving the forum guidelines some teeth?

By banning the user from the forum for an extended period of time - that has teeth. LL just rolled over and played dumb and let alts make a mockery of it. If they were consistent and enforced it, then it has teeth. It's about enforcement, not adding on new laws. I don't care what someone posts in these forums, they should not lose their access to SL unless they are doing things in world that violate the TOS.

What fear? I am confident that I am not going to get banned in game for anything I say on the forums. I've never worried about it. Because I don't act like an asshat on the forums. I've never recieved so much as an informal warning in any forum, and had a post edited a grand total of once (And its a point I disagree with Jeska on to this day).

What power? Unless someone is actually acting like an asshat, someone reporting the post isn't going to do anything. The mods aren't blind.

In another thread your tryign to start a group of people who agree to follow some rather extreme (IMO) rules and practices to make the boards more civil. Some of us have already been doing our part all along. It doesn't take a reinforcing group or an effort of herculean proportions to do this. Just don't act like a bloody idiot. I've never understood how people can get warned, suspended, etc, time and time again, and still not "get" it. It's not being censored if you don't act like a fool to begin with.

I'd go along with that insofar as I don't think anything that happens in the forums should result in a permanent ban from SL itself, but I can see how a 3 or 7 day suspension from both the forums and the world would be a serious kick in the pants.

Maybe. Maybe not. I hardly think I've been a nasty poster on the forums. I've said a couple things I've regretted, and I've also as a rule never made the same mistake twice. I'm only human, after all, but I try.

And this is the thing, I'm not "scared" of the new forum rules exactly because of this: I don't see it as a terrible burden to have to act decently. Hey, I slip up, like I say, I'm human. If I slip up badly enough to get warned about it, so be it... I can take my medicine.

I have, by the way, never been a proponent of free speech on the forums. I've pretty much always held the view that its the lindens to run as they see fit, and free speech on a message board is generally not a good thing.