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My Proposal...

Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-13-2005 16:06
From: Shadow Weaver
Originally Posted by Shadow Weaver

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Weaver
So basically blake what your saying is sort of in line with what had been saying take away the tie to weekly earned income and put it so that if people want to play the rate game the money goes to funding events basically? Am I wrong in this assumption?



You are correct. Put the ratings at a reasonable cost say $2L to $5L. The Savings created alone would be staggering with Linden Labs and surely would help fund Events, but also giving a gradual bonus to players for longevity taking into consideration also of taking out Basic Accounts and make Premium Accounts manditory after a one month Free Trial then both would begin. This would also provide incentive to retain accounts and account holders to refer new account holders to the game rather than stifling Social Events as Social Events promote enjoyment at least to alot of new account holders rather than herding them through a work line to start, and once settled in; they will learn the basics of creation because they will have probably met a Partner and want to build a house and then even a business with their Partner, also making bonuses based on Class Certificates of Education and learning the Tools in Secondlife with records of attendance. This way everyone wins, the Lindens win because they give incentive for learning and giving back to the Community and Economy through Productivity, the Community Wins by retaining account holders with Social Activities as well.
Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-13-2005 16:15
what do *ratings* mean to you Blake?
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Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-13-2005 16:20
From: Pendari Lorentz
what do *ratings* mean to you Blake?


Though Ratings are not tied to bonuses, with a reasonable affordability people will be more willing to rate friends, take out negative ratings and have the funds go into funding various Events.
Moleculor Satyr
Fireflies!
Join date: 5 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,650
01-13-2005 16:25
From: Blake Rockwell
You are correct. Put the ratings at a reasonable cost say $2L to $5L. The Savings created alone would be staggering


Savings do not need to be staggering. That would cause too much of a slowdown in the economy.

From: someone
and surely would help fund Events,


I'm sorry, am I missing something here? Does anyone here ACTUALLY want substandard events to remain on the event listings just because they get free money for being there? Competition is what makes people innovate. Innovation is what makes events great. Great events are what generate Traffic, and Traffic is precisely what event holders will be competing over.

From: someone
but also giving a gradual bonus to players for longevity


Bonuses for longevity has got to be the most laughably unsound economic idea I've ever heard of. If LL truly expects this place to remain in existence for a decade or more (and they have indicated that that is their intention), then a simple bonus for longevity ends up becoming the largest source of inflation in five years.

From: someone
taking into consideration also of taking out Basic Accounts and make Premium Accounts manditory after a one month Free Trial then both would begin.


Ok. MAYBE the day will come when LL decides to block basic accounts. Maybe. I'm not sure they could truly ever do this, as they've advertised SL as being $9.95 once for life. If they manage to do this, however, I'd probably have to reconsider whether or not I should be sticking around. Besides, SL has to become MUCH more popular than it is now for it to stand on it's own two feet with premium account only requirements.

From: someone
This would also provide incentive to retain accounts and account holders to refer new account holders to the game rather than stifling Social Events


I fail to see how longevity == better events.

From: someone
as Social Events promote enjoyment at least to alot of new account holders rather than herding them through a work line to start, and once settled in; they will learn the basics of creation because they will have probably met a Partner and want to build a house and then even a business with their Partner, also making bonuses based on Class Certificates of Education and learning the Tools in Secondlife. This way everyone wins, the Lindens win because they give incentive for learning and giving back to the Community and Economy, the Community Wins by retaining account holders with Social Activities.


Uh... that's got to be the most preposterous thing I've ever heard. First of all, the entire universe's population of humanity does not fit into your cookie cutter scheme. Second, no one should be required to take training courses or lessons or get certificates in order to be a respectable creator in SL. That's stupid!
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Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-13-2005 16:32
From: Moleculor Satyr
Savings do not need to be staggering. That would cause too much of a slowdown in the economy.



I'm sorry, am I missing something here? Does anyone here ACTUALLY want substandard events to remain on the event listings just because they get free money for being there? Competition is what makes people innovate. Innovation is what makes events great. Great events are what generate Traffic, and Traffic is precisely what event holders will be competing over.



Bonuses for longevity has got to be the most laughably unsound economic idea I've ever heard of. If LL truly expects this place to remain in existence for a decade or more (and they have indicated that that is their intention), then a simple bonus for longevity ends up becoming the largest source of inflation in five years.



Ok. MAYBE the day will come when LL decides to block basic accounts. Maybe. I'm not sure they could truly ever do this, as they've advertised SL as being $9.95 once for life. If they manage to do this, however, I'd probably have to reconsider whether or not I should be sticking around. Besides, SL has to become MUCH more popular than it is now for it to stand on it's own two feet with premium account only requirements.



I fail to see how longevity == better events.



Uh... that's got to be the most preposterous thing I've ever heard. First of all, the entire universe's population of humanity does not fit into your cookie cutter scheme. Second, no one should be required to take training courses or lessons or get certificates in order to be a respectable creator in SL. That's stupid!


From what I am reading you do not want Events, you approve of only Schooling but no incentive for it. As far as longevity there was no pay out number based on any stats to where you can say it is not feasible based on budget. The budget has to be evaluated first before deciding what incentives to give. As far as substandard Events, that's your opinion. As far as competition, if you want more of it; then promote it with incentive.

You offer no solution only critisism of nothing to go by.
Moleculor Satyr
Fireflies!
Join date: 5 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,650
01-13-2005 16:44
From: Blake Rockwell
From what I am reading you do not want Events,


I do not want substandard events. Events are fine. Great events are even better. Stupid events where everyone stands around, puts on their anti-afk scripts, and dances while the money-ball spits out money every so often need to die horribly.

From: someone
you approve of only Schooling but no incentive for it.


Well, pretty obvious you can't read. I never said cut funding to schooling. I am, in fact, in favor of the changes LL has made.

From: someone
As far as longevity there was no pay out number based on any stats to where you can say it is not feasible based on budget. The budget has to be evaluated first before deciding what incentives to give.


I'm sorry, budget? How is a budget going to help solve the problem of longevity people being here LONGER? Uh... Ok, think of it this way... if SL is WILDLY successful, and is around 50 years from now, 50 year old accounts will be madly insanely rich under a longevity scheme. They will, in essence, have millions upon millions of L$. Shrink that down a bit to just five or ten years now. They'll have much more money than the newbies. And BECAUSE they have much more money, as do all the other oldbies, prices will be staggeringly high because the larger number of SL users can afford the higher prices. Which means a newbie simply won't be able to buy anything when first starting out. Which means they'll leave.

It's called inflation.

From: someone
You offer no solution only critisism of nothing to go by.


My solution? Sit down, shut up, and let LL do what they're doing. They're doing fine. They might tweak it a bit in the next month or two, but they're handling things just fine.
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Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-13-2005 16:45
From: Blake Rockwell
Though Ratings are not tied to bonuses, with a reasonable affordability people will be more willing to rate friends, take out negative ratings and have the funds go into funding various Events.


Blake, ANY rewards tied to ratings means that the ratings will not be true to what they are meant to be.

Ratings are supposed to be a public notifier of how people should perceive others based on the various categories. Philip even touched on this in the Town Hall meeting last night.

If *anything* is tied to the ratings, other than the actual "person on person belief of worth" .. then the ratings mean nothing.

That said. If you feel there should be a way for Lindens to give SL residents free money, you should find another thing to tie it into. Of course, you still have to fight the battle of why anyone should get *free* money, but at least you take the game out of the rating system. And leave the ratings *somewhat* how they were originally intended.
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Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-13-2005 16:47
From: Pendari Lorentz
Blake, ANY rewards tied to ratings means that the ratings will not be true to what they are meant to be.

Ratings are supposed to be a public notifier of how people should perceive others based on the various categories. Philip even touched on this in the Town Hall meeting last night.

If *anything* is tied to the ratings, other than the actual "person on person belief of worth" .. then the ratings mean nothing.

That said. If you feel there should be a way for Lindens to give SL residents free money, you should find another thing to tie it into. Of course, you still have to fight the battle of why anyone should get *free* money, but at least you take the game out of the rating system. And leave the ratings *somewhat* how they were originally intended.


The ratings money is currently going to Lindens anyway. So in retrospect; either way they are probably using it. If it's going to cost $25L and they get less of it in the long run by doing so; why not lower it and get more money in the long run to fund the game and promote the Economy?
Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-13-2005 16:53
From: Blake Rockwell
The ratings money is currently going to Lindens anyway. So in retrospect; either way they are probably using it. If it's going to cost $25L and they get less of it in the long run by doing so; why not lower it and get more money in the long run to fund the game and promote the Economy?



No Blake, you are wrong. The ratings money goes into oblivion. It is a way to take money OUT of the system. Otherwise known as a "sink" in economy discussions for "online environments".

So, no. There is not *anyone* getting this $25, therefore no way to pump it back into the system.
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Hank Ramos
Lifetime Scripter
Join date: 15 Nov 2003
Posts: 2,328
01-13-2005 16:58
From: Pendari Lorentz
No Blake, you are wrong. The ratings money goes into oblivion. It is a way to take money OUT of the system. Otherwise known as a "sink" in economy discussions for "online environments".

So, no. There is not *anyone* getting this $25, therefore no way to pump it back into the system.


Pendari, you are correct. But, Blake...

Since money is taken out of the system, the remaining L$ that we all collectively have, increases in value as that money it taken out of the system. That is a good thing. It makes our L$ have more purchasing power. It increases the value of the Linden.
Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-13-2005 16:59
From: Hank Ramos
Pendari, you are correct. But, Blake...

Since money is taken out of the system, the remaining L$ that we all collectively have, increases in value as that money it taken out of the system. That is a good thing. It makes our L$ have more purchasing power. It increases the value of the Linden.



Thank you Hank! That is a good thing to add! :)
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Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-13-2005 17:51
Bottom line people..come up with a solution or lose accounts.
Ulrika Zugzwang
Magnanimous in Victory
Join date: 10 Jun 2004
Posts: 6,382
01-13-2005 17:54
From: Blake Rockwell
Bottom line people..come up with a solution or lose accounts.
Never trust anyone who addresses the collective with rhetorical clichés such as "people".

~Ulrika~
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Jonquille Noir
Lemon Fresh
Join date: 17 Jan 2004
Posts: 4,025
01-13-2005 19:42
From: Blake Rockwell
Bottom line people..come up with a solution or lose accounts.


I'm sure this will sound elitist and 'oldbie' (though I'm not one) to some, but I really don't care..

If people are only here to get paid to attend stupid ass events filled with stupid ass unimaginative contests that game the system for welfare, I don't really give a shit if they leave. If they don't feel the desire to contribute anything to the betterment of the game, and can only piss and moan because they were yanked off the Linden tit, then good riddence.

If all the predictions of people flooding off to some other (non-existant) game that gives them money and sex to their hearts content without having to lift a finger in return, then SL will be better for it. It will be better because the people left here will create for the sake of creating, and for the sake of the environment, and for the sake of SL, instead of their own pathetic greed and Welfare Mom attitudes. Fuck 'em. I'll pack for them if they want to leave. They can take their prize-winning g-strings and their hoochie hair and get the fuck out.
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Little Rebel Designs
Gallinas
Pendari Lorentz
Senior Member
Join date: 5 Sep 2003
Posts: 4,372
01-13-2005 20:05
*swoon*

Jon.. can I stalk you? :o
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Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-14-2005 09:39
From: Shadow Weaver
Originally Posted by Shadow Weaver

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow Weaver
So basically blake what your saying is sort of in line with what had been saying take away the tie to weekly earned income and put it so that if people want to play the rate game the money goes to funding events basically? Am I wrong in this assumption?



From: Blake Rockwell
You are correct. Put the ratings at a reasonable cost say $2L to $5L. The Savings created alone would be staggering with Linden Labs and surely would help fund Events, but also giving a gradual bonus to players for longevity taking into consideration also of taking out Basic Accounts and make Premium Accounts manditory after a one month Free Trial then both would begin. This would also provide incentive to retain accounts and account holders to refer new account holders to the game rather than stifling Social Events as Social Events promote enjoyment at least to alot of new account holders rather than herding them through a work line to start, and once settled in; they will learn the basics of creation because they will have probably met a Partner and want to build a house and then even a business with their Partner, also making bonuses based on Class Certificates of Education and learning the Tools in Secondlife with records of attendance. This way everyone wins, the Lindens win because they give incentive for learning and giving back to the Community and Economy through Productivity, the Community Wins by retaining account holders with Social Activities as well.


Again here is where my Proposal was Posted Kris.
Kris Ritter
paradoxical embolism
Join date: 31 Oct 2003
Posts: 6,627
01-14-2005 09:41
From: Blake Rockwell
Again here is where my Proposal was Posted Kris.


Again, Blake.. so what? You never listen to any counter proposals or arguments anyway.
Siobhan Taylor
Nemesis
Join date: 13 Aug 2003
Posts: 5,476
01-14-2005 09:43
From: Blake Rockwell
Bottom line people..come up with a solution or lose accounts.

Any particular account we're going to lose? Not yours I hope, you're way to entertaining.
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Willow Zander
Having Blahgasms
Join date: 22 May 2004
Posts: 9,935
01-14-2005 09:46
Ok... this is beyond a joke now... I was never this bad was I... PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE tell me no!
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<3 Giddeon's <3
Siobhan Taylor
Nemesis
Join date: 13 Aug 2003
Posts: 5,476
01-14-2005 09:50
From: Willow Zander
Ok... this is beyond a joke now... I was never this bad was I... PLEASEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE tell me no!

Er, truth?
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Willow Zander
Having Blahgasms
Join date: 22 May 2004
Posts: 9,935
01-14-2005 10:10
From: Siobhan Taylor
Er, truth?



Um.... by that reaction no

*runs off crying*
_____________________
*I'm not ready for the world outside...I keep pretending, but I just can't hide...*




<3 Giddeon's <3
Blake Rockwell
Fun Businesses
Join date: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1,606
01-14-2005 10:11
Also, even taking out the part of a longevity bonus would be a good start if that is an issue.
Siobhan Taylor
Nemesis
Join date: 13 Aug 2003
Posts: 5,476
01-14-2005 10:17
From: Willow Zander
Um.... by that reaction no

*runs off crying*

lol Willow... *hugs*
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Moleculor Satyr
Fireflies!
Join date: 5 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,650
01-14-2005 10:24
From: Jonquille Noir
I'm sure this will sound elitist and 'oldbie' (though I'm not one) to some, but I really don't care..

If people are only here to get paid to attend stupid ass events filled with stupid ass unimaginative contests that game the system for welfare, I don't really give a shit if they leave. If they don't feel the desire to contribute anything to the betterment of the game, and can only piss and moan because they were yanked off the Linden tit, then good riddence.

If all the predictions of people flooding off to some other (non-existant) game that gives them money and sex to their hearts content without having to lift a finger in return, then SL will be better for it. It will be better because the people left here will create for the sake of creating, and for the sake of the environment, and for the sake of SL, instead of their own pathetic greed and Welfare Mom attitudes. Fuck 'em. I'll pack for them if they want to leave. They can take their prize-winning g-strings and their hoochie hair and get the fuck out.


This post bears repeating. Read it. Make it your mantra.

From: Blake Rockwell
Also, even taking out the part of a longevity bonus would be a good start if that is an issue.


Blake, have you ever taken an economics class of any kind?

Did you pass?
_____________________
</sarcasm>
Moleculor Satyr
Fireflies!
Join date: 5 Jan 2004
Posts: 2,650
01-14-2005 10:25
From: Blake Rockwell
Also, even taking out the part of a longevity bonus would be a good start if that is an issue.


Blake, have you ever taken an economics class of any kind?

Did you pass?
_____________________
</sarcasm>
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