What happened to Supreme Court nominees deserving an up or down vote?
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 02:08
From: someone It's a pretty simple question. Do you actually believe that every nominee deserves an up or down vote? Or do you only believe that when you believe it provides a suitable platform for your argument with the right wing of the Republican Party (i.e. Harriet Miers). The main thing you appear to be taking issue with in starting this thread was the Right Wing of the Republican Party's unwillingness to take a consistant stand on the question whether every nominee deserves an up and down vote, making them hypocrits, in your view, for not sticking to their position. I'm simply asking if you're taking a stand with which you will be consistent with. Do you actually believe that every nominee deserves an up or down vote? I don't find your question to be relevant. You are comparing apples to oranges.
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 06:45
From: Neehai Zapata I don't find your question to be relevant. You are comparing apples to oranges. It's not relevant to ask you to clearly state your position on the very same issue you're criticizing others for not taking a consistant position on???? Is this like how you were complaining about Republicans changing the rules when it suited them? Would you berate others for not doing something you are affraid of or unwilling to do yourself? If you believe that it should be a simple matter for the Right Wing Republicans to take a position on that question, and then be consistant about it, why are you unable to take a position with whic you would be consistant yourself? If you're more than willing to call people hypocrits for not taking a consistant stand on the same question you won't even that a stand on at all...that's just as hypocritical. Other people on the thread have answered the question. At the risk of giving you another excuse to change the subject and continue to avoid answering the question, I'll even answer it myself. Question: Do *you* believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote? Answer: Alexin says yes, I believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote. So Neehai, you have already said you believe Hariet Miers deserved an up or down vote. Are you able to do what you've said the Republicans should do and take a consistant stand on this question? Do *you* believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote?
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 06:52
From: Chance Abattoir Isn't that what politics is about? -Sticking to a point of view belligerantly despite contrary facts because you don't want to be called a waffler? I mean, if you change your view on anything in politics then you lose more than if you stick to your guns and go to certain doom because everyone will call you a failure and a waffler instead of someone who was "defeated." What's with that anyway? Yup. Politics is a mucky business. One reason I'm not inclined to run for office. That and the fact I'd probably end up getting shot. 
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 07:16
From: someone It's not relevant to ask you to clearly state your position on the very same issue you're criticizing others for not taking a consistant position on???? Is this like how you were complaining about Republicans changing the rules when it suited them? From: someone Do *you* believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote? Do *you* like to eat shit out of a bowl? Do you think *all* baseball games should last an hour? When did *you* stop beating your wife? Your question is some sort of game you want me to play that does not relate to this issue. Republicans already stated that the nominees of their President (this President, right now) deserved an up or down vote. They then changed this to suit their own needs. Whether or not I believe all nominees deserve an up or down vote is irrelevant. I believe that the Republican party should stop with their constant lying and be consistent. What changed so drastically for them in the past few months? Why do these people hate America and freedom?  Bush is crying. He is the only person fighting for freedom and now even his own party is against him.
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Kurgan Asturias
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10-29-2005 09:14
From: Neehai Zapata Do *you* like to eat shit out of a bowl? Do you think *all* baseball games should last an hour? When did *you* stop beating your wife?
Your question is some sort of game you want me to play that does not relate to this issue. How is this a 'game'? It seemd like a fairly straight forward question to me. From: Alexin Bismark Do you believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote? The question is about you Neehai. You are making a point about people being two-faced. Alexin, and now I, am asking you: Would you stick to the up or down vote support on all condidates? From: Neehai Zapata Could the radical right of the Republican party be more hypocritical? The other question is, do you hold yourself to these same standards? But the first will answer this question... From: Neehai Zapata Whether or not I believe all nominees deserve an up or down vote is irrelevant. No, that is the question at hand. I think that Miers or any other candidate should get that vote, but that is me. The question is not a hard one, just like the vote, its either up or down. It has nothing to do with Republicans, Democrats, Bush, Gore, or Kerry. It has to do with you Neehai. We want to know your answer please.
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 09:43
From: someone No, that is the question at hand.
I think that Miers or any other candidate should get that vote, but that is me. The question is not a hard one, just like the vote, its either up or down. It has nothing to do with Republicans, Democrats, Bush, Gore, or Kerry. It has to do with you Neehai. We want to know your answer please. While I am flattered that you hold my opinion in such high regard, it is only the question at hand because you deem it so. My opinion on whether or not a candidate deserves an up or down vote is not the issue. I did not stand up and demand an up or down vote for nominees submitted by the President. The Republicans did. As such, I hold them to their previously stated opinions. My opinion on the matter in no way impacts their previous touted opinion on the subject. My opinion on nominees is as important as my opinion on which ketchup is best with McDonalds french fries. So, before we can make a true analysis on the Republican opinion on Supreme Court nominees I will need to know your opinion on which Backstreet Boy gives the best blow job. From: someone The question is about you Neehai. You are making a point about people being two-faced. Alexin, and now I, am asking you: Would you stick to the up or down vote support on all condidates? Again, my personal opinion on this matter or others is not related to the fact that these people lied. I do have an opinion on liars. I think lying makes the baby Jesus and the President cry. From: someone How is this a 'game'? It seemd like a fairly straight forward question to me. It is a fairly straightfoward question. Just like my asking you how many times a week you fuck your dog is a fairly straightforward question. Neither of these questions pertain to the topic at hand. They may be interesting to know, but that's about it. From: someone The other question is, do you hold yourself to these same standards? But the first will answer this question... I hold myself to a higher standard than that of public liars.
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Kurgan Asturias
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10-29-2005 10:46
Ok, Neehai, so I see that you are bent on distracting from the direct question, but that does not answer it. You are making a point that republicans are a bunch of two faced liars. I am not sure that too many will disagree. But the same can be said about almost anyone in public politics. The questions has turned away from that though, at least for me. I do put some weight to your thoughts (although as this thread goes on it is decreasing, and I am assuming you don't care  ). I realize that you may or may not agree with those that post here, but that does not mean you can not give an honest answer to the question posed to you. Do you, or do you not, believe that all nominees deserve an up or down vote?
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 12:04
From: someone Do you, or do you not, believe that all nominees deserve an up or down vote? The question is too ambiguous for me to answer. You will need to provide more detail. So, do you or do you not enjoy getting fucked by your dog? It is a simple yes or no question. Just answer either yes you do enjoy getting fucked by your dog, or no you don't enjoy getting fucked by your dog. You give me a yes or no anwer to that qustion and I will give you one to yours.
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Kurgan Asturias
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10-29-2005 12:28
From: Neehai Zapata The question is too ambiguous for me to answer. You will need to provide more detail. Ambiguous how? From: Neehai Zapata So, do you or do you not enjoy getting fucked by your dog? It is a simple yes or no question. Just answer either yes you do enjoy getting fucked by your dog, or no you don't enjoy getting fucked by your dog. So quid pro quo then? That is fine, we can play your childish game for a moment. No. Although I have never had a sexual relationship with a dog, I can see no redeeming factor in any such act, enjoyable or not. From: Neehai Zapata You give me a yes or no anwer to that qustion and I will give you one to yours. I have. Feel free to expand on your 'yes' or 'no'.
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 12:31
From: someone So quid pro quo then? That is fine, we can play your childish game for a moment.
No. Although I have never had a sexual relationship with a dog, I can see no redeeming factor in any such act, enjoyable or not. You chose a different question. You did not answer the question I asked. So quid pro quo I will now answer for you a question of my choosing. No, I do not like Vanilla Coke.
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Kurgan Asturias
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10-29-2005 12:39
From: Neehai Zapata You chose a different question. You did not answer the question I asked. Ok Neehai, you are were right in presuming that my estimation of you was too high. Since I can not get a mature response from you, I will leave you to your thread and let others make thier own opinion of this dialogue if they wish to continue.
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 13:31
From: someone Ok Neehai, you are were right in presuming that my estimation of you was too high. Since I can not get a mature response from you, I will leave you to your thread and let others make thier own opinion of this dialogue if they wish to continue. You go girl!
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 14:21
From: Neehai Zapata Your question is some sort of game you want me to play that does not relate to this issue. Nope, not a game at all. A simple question which you are seemingly incapable of answering. The same question you expect the Republicans to answer and hold to consistantly. You said you believed that Miers deserved an up or down vote. I'm askinging if you believe all nominees deserve an up or down vote, or just Miers? From: Neehai Zapata Whether or not I believe all nominees deserve an up or down vote is irrelevant.
Its very relevant to whether you're committing the same sort of hypocracy you're angry with Republicans over. From: Neehai Zapata I believe that the Republican party should stop with their constant lying and be consistent.
I believe its reasonable to ask if you're as consistent on the question as you demand others to be. From: Neehai Zapata I hold myself to a higher standard than that of public liars.
ROFL. Oh please. You can't even bring yourself to meet the minimum standard of those "public liars" you disdain and answer the same question you expect to answer consistantly. LOL Don't worry, I won't ask you again. I've come to agree with your earlier statement, your views are totally irrelevent. I thought you were tying to make a serious point with your thread, I didn't realize you were part of the forum entertainment. 
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 14:22
From: Kurgan Asturias Ok Neehai, you are were right in presuming that my estimation of you was too high. Since I can not get a mature response from you, I will leave you to your thread and let others make thier own opinion of this dialogue if they wish to continue. Wow this performance art stuff is pretty subtle sometimes, its almost like its real. 
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Lianne Marten
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10-29-2005 15:44
As far as I know, Neehai doesn't hold a position of public office, nor is in any way representative of a particular political ideology, therefore his opinions on the matter of an up or down vote are irrelevant. As soon as you actually participate in the voting on the appointment of a nominee, then your opinion on all that matters. Sure, it's interesting to know if people are being hypocritical in their judgements or not, but unless they have some way of influencing those events then it doesn't matter one bit.
Unless you just want to discredit the person asking the question by shifting the focus to their own opinions and "voting history"...
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 16:01
From: someone Unless you just want to discredit the person asking the question by shifting the focus to their own opinions and "voting history"... Lianne, you are so smart.  Ok, now back to Alexin. From: someone Nope, not a game at all. A simple question which you are seemingly incapable of answering. The same question you expect the Republicans to answer and hold to consistantly.
You said you believed that Miers deserved an up or down vote. I'm askinging if you believe all nominees deserve an up or down vote, or just Miers? I am capable of many thing. I am also capable of answering your question. However, given the vague nature of the question, my answer would not be pertinent to this discussion. I do not expect Republicans to answer that question either. As a matter of fact, it is not a question I posed. Republicans stated that nominees deserved an up or down vote. They were not asked by me. My influence in Congressional voting is rather limited. I said that based on previous Republican assertions, Miers should have an up and down vote by their own standards.From: someone Its very relevant to whether you're committing the same sort of hypocracy you're angry with Republicans over. This is untrue. Feel the need to deflect much? I have not exhibited hypocrisy. From: someone I believe its reasonable to ask if you're as consistent on the question as you demand others to be. I am quite consistent, but this isn't about me. This is about the Republican members of Congress who just two months ago demanded that nominees get an up or down vote. I will ask you again, what has changed since then to merit this change in ideology? I will remind you again, it is not my question. It is your question. You seem overly preoccupied with whether I want an up or down vote. I have no vote so it is irrevelant. Perhaps you should ask the Republican members of Congress who have seemingly changed their minds. From: someone ROFL. Oh please. You can't even bring yourself to meet the minimum standard of those "public liars" you disdain and answer the same question you expect to answer consistantly. LOL OMGWTFLOL (I can be clever too) What is the minimum standard that I have to meet? I have to answer a question that you made up? The question you ask is not a question. It is a statement made by Republicans that they have "changed their minds" about. What has changed? From: someone Don't worry, I won't ask you again. I've come to agree with your earlier statement, your views are totally irrelevent. I thought you were tying to make a serious point with your thread, I didn't realize you were part of the forum entertainment. I am both serious, gorgeous and entertaining. Unlike like your question, I don't limit myself. 
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 16:41
From: Lianne Marten As far as I know, Neehai doesn't hold a position of public office, nor is in any way representative of a particular political ideology, therefore his opinions on the matter of an up or down vote are irrelevant. As soon as you actually participate in the voting on the appointment of a nominee, then your opinion on all that matters. Obviously we disagree on this. I believe if someone is going to invest the energy to start a message thread expressing outrage over people being hypocrits because they don't take a consistant stand on a specific issue, I think it is perfectly fair to ask the person who is outraged if they can meet the same standard they are demanding of others...or more specifically criticize others for failing to meet. Neehai was unable to participate in the voting on the appointment of a nomine when he started this discussion and expressed opinions on that subject. As such I believe it would clearly abrogate any such bar from his opinion being irrelavent by reason of his not being able to participate in the voting on the appointment of a nomine. Besides, plenty of political opinions are expressed on these forums by people who are not, as far as we have evidence to know, in a position to actually vote on many of the issues at discussion. To limit relevence of opinions to only those who have direct means to participate in inacting those opinions would significantly limit participation in political discussion on this forum.
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 16:59
From: someone Obviously we disagree on this. I believe if someone is going to invest the energy to start a message thread expressing outrage over people being hypocrits because they don't take a consistant stand on a specific issue, I think it is perfectly fair to ask the person who is outraged if they can meet the same standard they are demanding of others...or more specifically criticize others for failing to meet.
Neehai was unable to participate in the voting on the appointment of a nomine when he started this discussion and expressed opinions on that subject. As such I believe it would clearly abrogate any such bar from his opinion being irrelavent by reason of his not being able to participate in the voting on the appointment of a nomine. Could you miss the point of this thread any more than you have? In the first post following mine you derailed this thread with your little question. Let me remind you what I posted. From: someone I don't want to hear the "every nominee deserves an up or down vote" ever again from these people. I didn't want to hear it then and I don't want to hear it now. Republicans had this position just two months ago and now they don't. All of this happened without my opinion on the matter. You are so up in my jock about this stuff. I could swear you are hitting on me. You don't have to go through all this just to get me in bed. A simple $20 will get you that.
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 17:19
From: Neehai Zapata I am capable of many thing. I am also capable of answering your question. However, given the vague nature of the question, my answer would not be pertinent to this discussion. [\QUOTE] What exactly is vague about the question "Do *you* believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote" ? (I'm asking you a question about the question so I'm not going back on my statement that I wouldn't ask you that question again.  ) Very straightforward, its asking for a simple statement clarifying your opinion on something you otherwise seem to have very strong opinions about, despite the fact that you're not in a position to official vote on the nomination. From: Neehai Zapata I do not expect Republicans to answer that question either. As a matter of fact, it is not a question I posed. Republicans stated that nominees deserved an up or down vote. They were not asked by me. My influence in Congressional voting is rather limited.
But despite that limited influence it was important enough to draw out your opinion. Fair enough, so I figured to draw it out a little more since you're in an opining mood. From: Neehai Zapata I said that based on previous Republican assertions, Miers should have an up and down vote by their own standards.
Actually what you said was: "As for Hariet Miers, yes there should have been an up or down vote so that everyone could seewhich Republicans support their President as he fights terror around the world and which ones don't." Which was in response to my post where all I said was "So do *you* believe every nominee deserves an up or down vote?" I followed up for clarification of your response, and then you started your little dance. From: Neehai Zapata I will ask you again, what has changed since then to merit this change in ideology?
My influence on the US Congress and the Republican party is rather limited, so how is my answer relevant? And actually you never asked me this question a first time, but nice try, and I find your insistence (noting the bold letters) for my opinion makes me warm and tingly in my special place. (And actually I'll be more than happy to answer your question once you answer mine. Seems only fair and all. )
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Neehai Zapata
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10-29-2005 17:27
From: someone And actually you never asked me this question a first time, but nice try, and I find your insistence (noting the bold letters) for my opinion makes me warm and tingly in my special place. Actually I did. It is right above the picture of the President where you made him cry. You should be ashamed of yourself. From: someone What changed so drastically for them in the past few months? Why do these people hate America and freedom?
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 17:54
From: Neehai Zapata Could you miss the point of this thread any more than you have? In the first post following mine you derailed this thread with your little question. Awww I think the thread came off the tracks all by itself. If my little innocent question derailed your big ol' thread then you need to speak to someone about a refund on your train. But then...I do have awesome superpowers beyond the understanding of mortal man so maybe you have something there. I defintely got the point of the thread. I just found my question more interesting. If you couldn't answer that, IMHO it's hardly worth getting into a serious discussion about the Supreme Court nomination process if you're not serious about it yourself. From: Neehai Zapata I didn't want to hear it then and I don't want to hear it now.
Well if you didn't want to hear it then you should have REALLY known better than to start a thread in these forum about it, shouldn't you? From: Neehai Zapata You are so up in my jock about this stuff. I could swear you are hitting on me. You don't have to go through all this just to get me in bed. A simple $20 will get you that.
I understand my irresistable draw (owing to those awesome superpowers beyond the understanding of mortal man and all), but that coy act didn't work on the choir boys Neehai, and it's not about to work on me, so go back to the priory and sin no more. 
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Alexin Bismark
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10-29-2005 18:05
From: Neehai Zapata Actually I did. It is right above the picture of the President where you made him cry. So you did, lost in the effluence, my bad. So again...being as our (our = forum readers) influence on nominees and the Republican party is rather limited, how is my answer relevant again? From: Neehai Zapata You should be ashamed of yourself.
If it hasn't happened in 38 years, I don't think its going to start now.
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Hiro Pendragon
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10-29-2005 21:21
Neehai, I think this was pretty embarassingly obvious.
Bush thought he'd "pull a Cheney" and nominate the person helping him search for a nominee. Miers is completely underqualified, and Republicans, rather than making a fool of Bush by voting her down, got her to withdraw her nomination to avoid the direct confrontation.
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Jamie Bergman
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10-29-2005 23:03
From: Neehai Zapata Could the radical right of the Republican party be more hypocritical?
They don't like Miers so they kill her nomination?
I don't want to hear the "every nominee deserves an up or down vote" ever again from these people. Oh blah blah blah. The American people have spoken and elected the Republicans to run stuff. So deal.
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Nyoko Salome
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Well!!... 
10-29-2005 23:24
quite a lil' kitchen-conversation goin' on, and i'm still not quite sure what to even make of it.  i'll just add this one tidbit i don't think i've heard mentioned yet in-thread... miers accompanied 'preznit' bush on his little 'getaway from indictment d.c.' earlier today - no, not a 'monica' type thing!!  - supposedly to 'ask her advisement' on a replacement scotus nominee. could be 'conspiratorial-sounding'... could be not. but i dunno... this long into life, paying attention to politics, -everything- sounds conspiratorial anymore, lol...  all i do anymore is wait for the actual outcome out of numerous possibilities, and see where the big puzzle leads then. 
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