To the Lindens A SIM question

Ok here is a good question. How much does it cost to implement a new Sim into the game? Primarily meaning Hardware cost. I know the game is designed to be expandable by just adding an additional server to run a Sim. I know the Grid structure has to be updated and the login server would have to have upgrades to implement. However, My questioning is that there are several of us looking for communities that can be built Cohesively. In some cases those that support this game whole heartedly may even want to help in incurring the start up cost of a New Sim by donating funds (Real DOLLARS) to implement one.

I know there will be questions like.

#1 why can someone that donates money get a Sim and Landowner privileges it’s not fair. Well in essence yes it is fair because at that point while its still in Beta those Individuals are INVESTING in the future to make this thing work when it goes gold.

#2 I’m poor I don’t have the money to donate to be a part of it. Neither do a lot of us it will depend on how much we love the game as to how much gets donated.

Here is an example of how I see it.

#1 a Sim is 1000 meters by 1000 meters. If you divided it out in 10 meter by 10 meter tracts that would be 100 tracts of land in that server.

#2 that means that if there are 100 Tracts in that server and there are 100 members that donate each one would receive a 10 x 10 Tract in return for their donation.

Just suppose it costs Roughly 6k per Server to get up and running. That would be Roughly $60 per 10 x 10 plot of land in that Sim dedicated to that individuals donation. So say the same 100 people donated enough for 3 x (10 x 10) that would be approximately $180 per that would be enough cash to put in 3 Sims up in the game.

I am looking at this as ways to #1 invest in the company and get Immediate ROI. It would help the Lindens get the capital they need to get this thing WAY off the ground and to test the theory of mega expansion. But it would also give all the Beta people the chance to get a “Footprint” for being in the game before it went gold.

Please remember most of what I said here so far is conjecture and I am just throwing out a Theory.

Lindens if this appeals to you please please email me at [email]ShadowWulf2002sim@yahoo.com[/email]

Shadow Weaver<<<<is always an Idea Man

A sim is only 256m * 256.

If it was 1000 * 1000 then there would be 100 * 100 = 10,000 of those 10m * 10m plots.

Realistically you want at least 12m * 12m plots (3 land squares * 3 land squares) and thats small, especially for a real world $$ investment, epsecially since some road should be included into that space.

However even given 16m * 16m spaces on one sim you have 256 plots that size.


Am I mistaken, cuz I thought the press release indicated the game would be going live next month (ie next week).

LOL...sok Ama...I was just speculating cause I wasnt in the game right now but at work. It may be 256 x 256 I dont know...but I cant remember if the plots are 10 x 10 or 1 x 1 I will find out tonight though when I get online. and the 1000 x 1000 was only a guess....Conjecture so to speak.

The Sims are 256m x 256m (I live on the edge of a sim), I believe land plots are 4mx4m? ( I remember buying a 20m X 20m plot of land and I think the size was 5 x 5 plots)

A sim is 256m * 256m. The minimum land you can purchase is a 4m * 4m square, and all land must be purchased in a configuration of those 4m * 4m squares.

Just trying to help your calculations.

Ama's last post is correct about sim size and distribution.

I believe the press release on Linden Lab's site mentions future plans to allow people to lease sims.

This is of great interest to me since I wouldn't mind owning a sim for myself and friends. And if hardware requirements are feasible, even hosting that sim, since I believe the grid may be capable of supporting geographically-separated servers.

Click for Relevant Press Release

Very interested to get people's feedback on this topic, so here are some more numbers to spark thinking:

Yes, a sim is 256m on edge, for a total area of about 16 acres.

Each simulator is a Linux 1U P4 machine that right costs us (Linden Lab) around $1000. Of course there is money involved in installing it, and there is additionally monthly money in paying co-location charges.

So we are thinking actively about how to offer whole simulators to the members who want to engage in larger or group projects, etc.

What sort of models would you like to see?

Sign me up! I don't care about costs - a girl's just gotta have her own sim. The options I want are:

- Pay for a year in advance and get a nice discount
- Pay the initialization fee prior to go-live and get an even nicer discount
- Pay both the above and get a mouse pad that says "I'm cool because I'm getting my own sim"
- I also want my sim named CandieLand. heh

Finally, when will the island contest winner be announced?!

Thanks,
Candie

I have a couple of 1Us laying around my office, if I bring one up can you guys plug it in?

HAHAHA

(not kidding, really)


fen-

Ok Based on Philip’s Notations and Ama’s quick calculations here is how I see it.

Like Ama mentioned in another post. 256 Meters x 256 Meters =64 x 64 Land plots with a total of 4096 Land plots.
1 Acre is equal to 16 LP x 16 LP for 256 LP.

One acre in Linden Dollar Cost per in Game=12,288LD, You do know that is not a bad price for an acre of land.

Hence the division of 4096/256 = 16 Acres of Land.

National Average for a Sub-Divided Community is .5 Acres for a Max of 28 Residents in One Community. Have to have a min of 2 acres spread across the Sim for Roads

That would reduce Lag and if those 28 Members wanted that whole Sim that way.

Then (REAL DOLLARS) it would cost approximately $57.00 per player for a ½ acre tract of land.
This is based on $1000 for the server and at least $600 for installation and migration to the main server grid.

To implement it I see a Mere Grouping of Members petitioning Linden Labs with a List of up to 28 names for that server and once all the money for that Server had been received by Linden Labs it could be put in place.

However, For A Sub Division doing this would also require pre-planning of the Sub division Comity for where the roads were and how the land plots were divided in either Half acre or full acre tracts based on donations. A Pre implementation Map would have to be put in place for all the Members to agree on.
Or a Single Developer could basically do the same thing. Convincing players to Donate to “His / Her” Subdivision based on a proposed Sim Layout they had. Then He / She would be the one petitioning Linden labs with the list of names so that they could hold title to the Sim until they had it suffciently developed for their buyers to move in.

Now some one would think Hmmm…a way to exploit the game and make REAL Money. Real Rules would have to be put in place when it came to “Real Money Donations for an Upgrade Sim”. For instance if a person wanted to be a developer and do that they would have to obtain permission for Linden Labs first. Then have it set up so that when he convinced someone to move into his “Sim Development” and donate real money that Real Money would go to Linden Labs, not to the Individual.

Have it posted on the Website, “NO MONEY to be sent to individual player trying to play Developer.” All money would be sent to Linden labs in Reference to his name.
This would Deter Exploiters and if people read their TOS like they are suppose to it could be put in there also. This would save Linden Labs a possible lawsuit and protect the players Legitimately wanting to help support the game and get some land for them selves.


Method 2 for the “Not So Rich Donators” would be a Payment Plan.

For Instance just suppose the monthly subscription rate would be $12 a month.

A Half-Acre Lot costs $57.00 and a person just wanted to have say 5acres of land. That would mean they would have to donate 570 to get that much land. Now remember this is guaranteed set land for use as the Donator saw fit. If they Paid $69 a month for 10 months. The Lindens could have a server set up for instances like this so that as that individual paid down his debt each month they would open .5acres of land for him/her. It could be done on a Sim that was still all owned by Lindens or have it combined with another player that wanted 5 acres and another one that wanted 6 acres betwixt the three of them. In 10 months they could totally own all that land in that Sim without having to fight anyone or race anyone to get to the land because the land outside of what was released to them would be held by a Linden ‘til they got it all paid for.

Now I know someone will think why do all that when you can just work and build and make money and buy land yourself. This is true however, look at the land available to you now. It’s broken sporadic and never what you’re really looking for. If you bought the land this way 2 things would be happening. #1 Guaranteed land that was suitable for you to build whatever your heart desired. #2 the ability for Linden labs to expand quickly and keep lag down by having limited numbers of players on a Sim.

Right now I see this game as possibly being Infinite. Imagine in the future People owning whole Sims and holding events without massive lag. Taking Hours to Fly from one side of the Map to the other. But we are going to have to work on that teleport cost thing because if you wanted to teleport 23 Sims away it could get real expensive real fast.

Again this is just my mind running rampant however if it sounds good let me know. But for now I need to be quiet a bit and listen to see what everyone says so far.

Shadow Weaver
[email]ShadowWulf2002sim@yahoo.com[/email]

Lessee...

IIRC, some rumor went around that a new sim would be added per 100 users... so the first months fee of $15 x 100 users would be about $1500, which would cover purchase and installation of a sim. Just spelling out some 'rationalization' I had done in my head.

What kind of co-location charges are we looking at? Can we get some sort of guesstimate at a monthly amortized cost to run one of these servers. I'm assuming here that the cost of adding bandwidth per server is constant, however if you are 1U over the current rack then you have to rollover into a new rack and that is a higher on-the-spot cost.

Electricity usage (assuming 300w x 24 hrs x 30 days) alone are 240 kwh per server, and running anywhere from a dime to 2 dimes per kwh, that's $24 to $48 per month. But that's likely included in the colo charges.

So pretty much what I'm asking is: how much do you pay for colo? And knowing you're in the Bay Area, I'm almost thinking you're using Hurricane Electric, seeing as they're sitting on MAE-WEST, but I may be wrong

Anyhow, I would suggest offering plans to lease/rent sims in 1/4 increments or else full sims. I would almost argue against doing increments due to themes and land modification issues, but based on the current size of the themed communities versus the originally planned size (1/2 sim) this sounds reasonable.

So say we're looking at colo costs of $100 (I doubled the high electricity estimate to cover bandwidth etc)... Set that up for a year (lock in a lease for that time period) so that's $1200+$1500 for the server and let's make a little profit so set it to $3000. That comes out to an amortized cost of $250 per month per server. After the first year the extra money is profit.

If someone purchases a quarter lot, that's $62.50. A little more than the cost of your broadband internet connection, for free reign on 4 acres of SL land. And obviously people could go in it together to reduce their costs.

Anyhow, I used to host an Activeworlds server, and there was an initial license fee, and then you paid annually for your world size. Of course I also hosted that world myself. But the thought I'm having here is that if someone is paying for their own sim, they should be able to get some discount (free?) on their membership fee. Perhaps something like AW did with the larger world got more accts. Perhaps 1 per 1/4 then.

I don't know, but I'm going to stop rambling now and hopefully y'all can interpret this the way I intended when I started typing like 20 mins ago.

Feel free to IM me in-world, I'd love to talk shop about this. I own too many computers and have too many grandiose ideas about hosting and colos that I could gab forever... maybe.

You can PM me on the forums, but I only check once a day and sometimes I miss a day, so it's easier to IM me or email me (yes I have my IMs sent to email).

--Bino Arbuckle

Of course, the question is, would I be willing to spend $250 per month on a sim? Heh I don't know