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Rockas Rockett
Registered User
Join date: 5 Mar 2007
Posts: 11
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03-14-2007 09:44
Hi there! i don't know if this has been discussed before but I have one question.
is it possible to use 3D Studio Max modeled objects in SL?
Is the direct support for 3DS files programmed? In my humble opinion I think it wound be great and I don't think it would overload the grid. I just made a quick test in one of my furniture pieces and the 3ds file got 153kb... that don't is that bad if you think it will represent a bed and 2 bedside tables that exists on SL and are using about 15. The textures are included as well.
Please forgive me if this has been discussed before... I made a search and didn't found anything.
Thank you in advance.
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Chosen Few
Alpha Channel Slave
Join date: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 7,496
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03-14-2007 10:09
From: Rockas Rockett i don't know if this has been discussed before It has. Many, many times. From: Rockas Rockett is it possible to use 3D Studio Max modeled objects in SL? The short answer is no. The more complicated answer is sort of. Jeffrey Gomez, on of SL's resident geniuses, created a script that will replace every tri in an OBJ with a triangular prim in SL. Needless to say, the results are very prim heavy, so it's not something that's practical for every day use. For certain things though, it is quite handy. From: Rockas Rockett Is the direct support for 3DS files programmed? No From: Rockas Rockett In my humble opinion I think it wound be great and I don't think it would overload the grid. No offense, but before you make a statement like that, I'd encourage you do some research on how SL actually works, and to define what you mean by "overload". SL does not work the way you probably think it does. From: Rockas Rockett I just made a quick test in one of my furniture pieces and the 3ds file got 153kb... that don't is that bad if you think it will represent a bed and 2 bedside tables that exists on SL and are using about 15. The textures are included as well. Compare that with the mere hand-full of bytes it takes to describe the parametric objects that SL uses, and then multiply that by the hundreds of millions of unique objects that exist in the world. There's a little difference there. Remember, we're not just talking about storage space. The bottleneck is the internet. SL isn't like video games. There is no pre-existing static content. Every single object has to be streamed from the servers to every single client machine in real time. SL content is dynamic and volatile, changing every moment. The data that describes it has to be as streamlined as possible. In any case, the file size is only the least of the problems with using arbitrary meshes in SL. Rather than retype all of them again, I'll quote myself here from another conversation I had on this subject not long ago: From: Chosen Few The reason is because unlike any other 3D environment, SL is 100% user created, and 100% streamed. There is no permanent geometry whatsoever. The world changes literally every moment.
There are many problems that would need to be solved before arbitrary meshes could work in SL. The biggest is level of detail. Most amateurs are not going to have the time or the know-how to create meshes with pre-set variable LOD built in, so we'd need a way for the system to automate it. Unfortunately, there's really no good way at present for the system to intelligently judge polygon reduction over distance. It could be done strictly by math of course, but the results in many cases, if not most cases, would be less than pretty. For example, you could model the Statue of Liberty in exquisite detail, and from up close she could look great, but from any significant distance she'd probably look like nothing but a lumpy green blob as her polygons begin to reduce as the camera moves further away. That's a hard problem to solve.
The alternative would be not to use LOD, but if you think SL's laggy now, imagine what would happen if poly counts were never reduced by distance. There would be very few computers on Earth that would be able to handle SL in any semblance of real time if that were the case.
Another problem is bandwidth. If arbitrary meshes were to be used, the instructions for how to create every single polygon would have to be streamed to every single client for every single model. That would be an incredible amount of data.
By using a common set of parametric objects as building blocks for everything as SL does now, the process is streamlined. Since every client computer enters the world with foreknowledge of ow to make each type of primitive, the only data that needs to be streamed is where to put the prims, what size to make them, how to rotate them, etc. That's a relatively tiny amount of information.
Also, how to you calculate physics with an arbitrary mesh? There have been many suggestions on this, but none have been ideal.
LL has said many times that they do want eventually to allow mesh modeling in SL, and when that day comes, we'll all rejoice. However, these technical obstacles have to be overcome first, and none of them are easy.
In the here and now, what you need to do is learn how SL's present modeling system works, the same way you had to learn how Max worked back when you started with that.
As a professional 3D modeler myself, I can promise you that getting good at modeling in SL will make you better at modeling in Max. Because SL is so limited, it forces you to use a specific type of problem solving intelligence that more sophisticated modeling applications let you bypass. The result of exercising those problem solving skills is you become a much more efficient modeler, both inside SL and out.
Once I started getting good in SL, I found that my average poly counts per model in Maya were going way down while the visual quality was going way up. Also, my texturing skills increased at least a hundred fold.
Give it a little time, and I'm sure you'll say the same thing. From: Rockas Rockett Please forgive me if this has been discussed before... I made a search and didn't found anything.
Thank you in advance. Yeah, searching can be a little tough sometimes on these forums. The search engine has a minimum of 4 letters per word, so if you were searching for "3DS Max", you wouldn't find anything, as both words are just 3 letters.
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Rockas Rockett
Registered User
Join date: 5 Mar 2007
Posts: 11
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03-14-2007 10:32
From: someone Yeah, searching can be a little tough sometimes on these forums. The search engine has a minimum of 4 letters per word, so if you were searching for "3DS Max", you wouldn't find anything, as both words are just 3 letters. Don't you want to give me the lotto numbers too? lol lol lol Those were the exact words I searched  I understand your explanation but I'm not fully convinced. I know everything must be downloaded and It's all about "sizes" and basic forms. And I wouldn't expect SL being capable of importing 3ds files as unique objects. I thought about it as some kind of conversion way for that widely spread format. Anyway... we can't alway want what we need/want From: someone As a professional 3D modeler myself, I can promise you that getting good at modeling in SL will make you better at modeling in Max. Because SL is so limited, it forces you to use a specific type of problem solving intelligence that more sophisticated modeling applications let you bypass. The result of exercising those problem solving skills is you become a much more efficient modeler, both inside SL and out. Well... me too and that's why the lack of some simple "standard" features makes me wanna scream lol ... cause doing it all day for the money... leaves you little patience to do it for fun when you get home at night 
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Thunderclap Morgridge
The sound heard by all
Join date: 30 Sep 2006
Posts: 517
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03-14-2007 20:41
If you can code, perhaps you can take the build function and replicate it in 3ds. Jeffery did it for Blender and someone else did it for Maya. All we need is someone to do it in 3ds.
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Simil Miles
Creator
Join date: 1 Mar 2007
Posts: 300
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03-15-2007 09:32
From: Thunderclap Morgridge If you can code, perhaps you can take the build function and replicate it in 3ds. Jeffery did it for Blender and someone else did it for Maya. All we need is someone to do it in 3ds. If you're talking about the equivalent of Prim.Blender for 3D Studio Max, then it's called SLPrims and was released 3 months ago.
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