Temporary + Physics = Bad?

Several people have told me now that temporary and physical is a bad idea, which kind of goes against the Wiki which strongly recommends it, particularly for bullets which is what I am using it on.

As a bullet has a life of a maximum of ten seconds it would seem sensible to make it temporary but I am less certain now.

There are only 2 kinds of munitions that I know of which would benefit from *not* being temp on rez: cages and followers. think about it like this: if you have a machine gun that fires 10 bullets a second and none of those bullets are temp_on_rez. you could fill up and entire sim with prims in a few minutes. not to mention all the litter that it would cause from the bullets not automatically being deleted, plus the spam to yourself when the parcels with auto-return enabled return your hundreds of bullets to you.


of course, there's always the fact that bullets usually delete themselves when they collide with something, but with no_script enabled land, they won't do so, and you'll end up littering that person's parcel.

in short, not having your bullets be temp_on_rez is bad scripting and will probably get you AR'd for littering when your bullets don't go away.

Did the people who said it's a bad idea ever give a reason why?

Thanks but I was specifically looking for any information of possible negative effects of temporary.

I have never heard of this. Now Temporaty+Physical+Flexi = Unkown.

I use temp-on-rez physical objects all of the time, and have yet to see any negative effects in the last several months.

Really makes me wonder why these "several people" would say something so vague as "it's bad" without at least a cursory explanation. If there are in fact negative effects, it would be good to explain why to people.

Was this {the following issue} fixed yet? 'cuz it could be why 'Temp on Rez' has a recent bad rap...

The Lindens have changed the way Temp on Rez items are counted against the Prim Limits in a sim. (as part of their battle against Gray Goo, I believe). At one time, Temp on Rez items were pretty much allowed, even in a sim 100% full of permanent prims. (there was an existing formula to limit Temp on Rez items, even in a full sim. This formula was tightened to make it more limiting.)
As a result, the 'object prim count' on many pieces of property were being exceeded, and permanent objects were being returned. This caused a lot of consternation. A 'house' might be returned to you, because of SIM Object Limits. People were surprised.

Eventually, fingers began to point at temp on Rez items as the culprit. Seems the servers were not discriminating enough to 'return' the Temp on Rez items, but apparently random objects. Having your house returned because your Angel Fish are spawning can be very frustrating, albeit good environmental policy.
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I cant' find the formula offhand, but there was allowance for (i think) 400 Temp on Rez items, even in a full SIM.

Hmmmm.... Yeah, I suppose that is logical. That also might explain why I would not have seen a problem, as it is highly unlikely one of my items would rez more than 3 concurrent temp objects for any given user, so would not likely put anyone over prim limits. But gun makers may have a reason to be concerned there, especially those who make weapons with a high rate of fire.

Unfortunately, that does not indicate what might be better for such intentionally temporary items as bullets and the like.

But even if that is what started people saying this, the problem is not with physics + temp-on-rez, which has worked quite fine until the Linden developers broke it and which they will presumably fix, right?

Just a guess, really, but I suspect the idea that Temp + Physics being bad comes from a misunderstanding of someone's original point.

I've seen plenty of coded guns where temp + physics items are generated (bullets, shell casings, magazines, etc.) and it's left to the Temp flag to remove the objects. Since a temp object stays around for a minute this can generate a lot of lag with the physics engine as it tries to handle hundreds of objects at the same time.

This might have caused someone to say 'Don't rely on Temp to clean up an item with Physics', which was mistakenly morphed into 'Don't use Temp and Physics'.

The real answer isn't to stop using Temp but to put in an llDie() command to clean up the object or else an llSetPrimitiveStatus() command to shut off its physics if there's some reason it needs to stick around for a short length of time.

I am sure that there are a lot of examples where bad coding skills led to people thinking you should not use such-and-such

From what I can tell though, the OP is not a new scripter and creates quality scripted items. I am not in-world at the moment and cannot verify, but I believe that it was Eata Kitty that made one of the things I wear every day

I do wish there was some definitive place where one could go for an answer. Is this related to recent updates and changes to auto-return? Seems logical, but I am sure not gonna find out by testing!

Sorry. I'm not saying she doesn't know how to code, or even that anyone here doesn't. I'm just saying my guess is that the Temp + Physics thing comes from a misunderstanding of how to avoid creating one of these lag inducing weapons that has been repeated until even the people who wouldn't make that mistake don't know where it came from.

I think the issue is this:

1) people associate temp on rez with those stupid rezzers which lag everything to high heaven cause it constantly uses a timer to regen a multi prim item over and over.

2) physics can be bad due to poor scripting and just the general SL engine (not saying anyone scripts poorly it is a general statement)

3) in guns now a days with bullets you have the firing bullet that is multi primed (?), temp on rez, and physical. Then you have the "expended" shell which is temp on rez, physical, and multi primmed. Finally in some cases you have bullet cartridges which are temp on rez, multi primed, physical.

4) in guns you normally don't fight alone so take that data and double it at least...for places like Tenebra, CoLA, Toxia, etc multiply that by upwards of 60 people.

5) most guns have options like sensors, particles, explosions, etc (add needed addon lag)

I know in Tenebra we do get lag and some people cannot even get past the rez point as thier systems cannot handle the lag created by all the prims, textures, etc. We do try to keep this down though as much as possible and encourage people to do more then combat 24/7 as it is a RP sim. Even then it still allows and enjoys combat so we do get the lag once the fighting starts.

Eata to put it in perspective take a gun and just go willy nilly on firing full auto, etc and have somethng around that might be able to see how many items fire out of the gun (land prim count) and then once done think of how many scripts, temp on rez, physical prims/items that is. Kinda puts it into perspective.

I think my C-Tech is something like 50 prims (not counting the actual bullet that fires at target) for every cartridge (ten shots?) I fire with my dual guns. I can easily go through ten 3 carts in a stand up fight and more in a moving fight.

Didn't mean to imply that you meant anything negative What I meant is that I am sure that poor coding by many people has led to such generalizing as "don't do this or that", in other words I think we agree. I also wanted to throw in a compliment to Eata at the same time