What to do about rigged gambling?

What should I do if I think a gambling object is rigged?

Stop gambling?

There are no gambling boards or rules in Second Life that I am aware of. Although I guess you could rely on word of mouth as to which gambling vendors/casinos are honest, I don't see how there is any real way to know.

To make it guaranteed in the same way real world casinos are, there would need to be gambling comissions that inspected the software running the games, perhaps having the "random" elements in scripts that could not be edited. I am not entirely sure how foolproof that would be either.

Let's imagine for a moment, that there is a group that certifies the fairness of gambling machines in SL. Would they be able to craft a small object that could be linked in with gambling machines? It could look like a bolted on certificate of some sort. I think a user would be able to view the linked object and see who the creator was, right? As long as the creator is careful that would be difficult to forge, wouldn't it?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

i found it annoying too, so i set up my own fair club - The Gaming Emporium

with no lag, no annoying scripts, no slots, no camp chairs, just gaming fun!

What I don't understand is that there is no rule for rigged machines.... however a long-time SL user gets perminantly banned for listening in on a casino game's channel in order to gain the advantage?!?!?

If the casinos can cheat us... the players should be allowed to find ways to cheat the casinos.


... anyway, SL gambling is illegal... All the casinos will disappear and be gone as soon as the first casino owner gets a 5 year jail sentence.

My Friend toy once said "Gambling is for people with Poor Math skills."

Houses don't have to Rig Gambling machines because the Odds are already in their favor. Gamble long enough and you will just be habding them all your money for Nothing.

Angel.

the short answer, Sam, is that you probably can't do anything. There are no rules about gambling devices in SL. So far, market forces have prevented truly crooked games from sticking around - people will gravitate toward places that give them the best experience - payoff frequency being one of those.

Can you be more specific about what you think is wrong with this object? Can you tell us what it is? (without naming a specific avatar) If the item is truly rigged, probably the only thing you can do is go to some of the other forums and talk about it there. If the person who's running the object has truly rigged it, then people will catch on and take their business elsewhere.

It was my understanding that such machines are always "rigged", I have a friend who owns a RL fruit machine he bought for fun because collects things like that, there is a setting inside it which alters how much it pays out, this can be changed making the machine more or less likely to get 3 things in a row etc.

Surely if such things were actually fair there would be no gambling places like this, the house always wins right?, Im not sure where the legal line is drawn on how "fair" such a machine must be.

I once did experiment with building a slot machine in SL. Even if there is no deliberate attempt by the creator to skew things in his/her favor the odds are still in favor of the house. Pure probability states that the odds of hitting 3 of a kind are much lower than any other combination. The Casino owner might make less money over time with an "honest" machine but he/she will make money. It is completely unnecesary to tamper with the natural odds.

That said I suspect many do tamper anyways to increase their wealth.

I want to make a totally rigged machine that always pays back exactly what you pay in.

I am thinking of making the top graphic show the payout and odds for the various combinations and see how long it takes them to figure it out.

XYY Odds 100%, payout 1:1
YYY Odds 0%, Payout 1:1

Don't use it.

The SL gambling industry is entirely unregulated, and I wouldn't trust any of them because of that simple fact.

There are many other risks involved for owners as well as users - but I won't repeat them for fear of giving people ideas to rip others off.

Lewis

MANY MANY MANY gambling machines are rigged. most of them probally are and ALL of them are slanted more to the owner than a RL slot machine would be for example.

IF YOU MUST GAMBLE:
Gamble playing poker or some other type of game that lets you play against others, the owner of the table will probally get a small percentage but then they should if they are providing you the entertainment.

All forms of gambling, rigged or not, favors the owner of the game. If they did not make a profit as the owner of the game, the game would not be run by that owner. Play long enough, and they will have all your money. Rigged systems are greedy, but merely accellerate how fast you lose.

In RL, I very rarely gamble, and then I treat it as purely an entertainment expense. I set aside a sum of money that I fully expect to lose. If I manage to get a decent win, I walk away right then, with a small profit. If not, I quit playing when the money runs out. I get some free drinks, and maybe some free food or shows as part of the night's fun. But at least in RL, there are gambling commissions that strive to ensure that the game at a professional casino is not too severely rigged in favor of the house.

I suppose that in SL you can treat gambling the same way. But since there is no regulation of the gambling industry in SL, you're far more likely to get ripped off. Personally I refuse to gamble at all in SL. I won't even play slingo. If I want to give someone money for nothing, I'll pay it to them directly, as a tip.

If you can verify a severely rigged gambling device exists, I suppose you could abuse report the owner. But I doubt anything will come of it.

The recent US law against Internet gambling will, most likely, cause all the SL casinos and gambling games to eventually shut down. The people who run such games will have too much legal liability and risk to make the few pennies that they win worth the possible real jail time if they get caught. Personally, I won't be sorry to see them go.

The object in question is the high-stakes blackjack table in the Portage blackjack room.

I play blackjack because it has the best odds (theoretically) in the casino.
I'm also fairly good at it so I can usually win or at least break even.

Well I had been doing well in another casino and actually felt guilty for winning so much (L$3000) so I tried out Portage. After about an hour, I was up L$3000 at which point, the odds seemed to have changed. I no longer got low hands, blackjacks, or natural 18-21s, and every hand the dealer got went to 21. Every hand I took insurance on turned out not to be blackjack (but went to 21), and every hand I didn't take insurance on went blackjack.

Now I've been playing blackjack for 20 years and I've never seen anything like it.

Of course it's possible that all of this happened strictly by chance, but it seemed like I hit some sort of win limit and then the odds changed.

Btw, the table is called "Lucky Charmer." I will no longer play on a table with that name.

"Deluxe Blackjack" tables have all been fair with me.

Don't ever feel guilty when you take a casino's money. I doubt they're thinking about you when you lose it.

back 3 years ago i had a fairly long and protracted discussion with several of the big casino owners at the time about fairness and win ratios.. i learned a few things...

1) very few of them understood anything about the underlying principles of probability or gambling fairness

2) the most common response was 'my machines are fair! they pay back x %' where x was usually a number at/below 50% (for reference casino slots pay back a minimum of 75% and most pay back 85% or so, casino table games all pay back at roughly roulette odds or something on the order of 97-98%

3) when asked about verification most don't even have access to the code from their *OWN* machines, most jus purchase them sight unseen (code wise) and deploy them out randomly, trusting they will 'get a cut'

so i would say in general, if you must gamble in SL, do so at the lowest cost machines you can find and enjoy the atmosphere and the thrill of the game itself... Don't go in expecting to come out a winner, because with no regulation theres really no rules saying that the 'super mega sl slot 5000' is not just a 'ding and then you don't get any money' machine

I own SLIDERS, a club/casino with a variety of gambling machines, tables, and other games, and I have a few comments.

There is really no need to create a crooked game. All of the games at my place are purchased from vendors who sell to casinos. Usually the vendor cautions that there is a possibility that I could lose money even as the owner. I buy the game, put it on the floor, and keep enough lindens in reserve in case somebody hits.

I think a crooked casino would be pretty easy to spot. A good casino will have staff on hand to see to your needs. The games for the most part should be familiar to you. We have a "money machine" that actually gives money to everyone on the premisis periodically, as a draw to our club/casino. We also have contests where we give away money. My guess is that a crooked casino would have none of these things.

Bottom line: If you are gambling, expect to LOSE. The act of gambling is a bit like going to a county fair. You are spending money for thrills. Gambling should never be a method of income, it is a form of entertainment. Never bet more than you can afford. You'll find that if you treat your gambling hobby in this manner, it will be more enjoyable and thrilling, honest casinos can pay their staff members, and the occasional dirty game won't upset you.

Again, expect to lose. You are spending money to be entertained, get a few thrills, and to have FUN If it ever stops being fun, you should STOP!

Archangel Mountain

Play for the thrill and fun...
I can play Black Jack or Roulette all day long with 2000L it's nice to win 20k several times...of course I'm bored and keep playing then lose it all...lol

I only play specific types of tables also(after trying several)...the cleaner the looks...then "probably" then cleaner the code...

I wonder if there is a win cap also in the coding...I swear after I win lots I always seen to get real bad luck for the next several bets...like Dealer gets Black Jack 5 times outta 10 on a one deck table and the rest he gets like 20...or I'll bust having to hit on 15's...>:

Same with Roulette...I get pretty hot on some numbers or areas and get pretty lucky in my choices...then all the sudden I can't pick anything right...like the variance in the numbers go from somewhat "normal" predictable within a few rolls to the complete other way after I win a lot...like double 00 and 0 hits 5 times in 10 rolls...after I stop betting the 1,2,3,0,00 bet (basket?)...hehe...

:rolls :eyes

Sorry to digress but its always struck me as odd that a country where you can go out and buy a gun, is so uptight about gambling, surely its a fundamental freedom to be silly and risk money, arguably preferable to being silly and carrying a gun.

Im maybe missing the point I dont know, it might be that this is just higher profile than similar restrictions in other countries which you dont hear so much about.

It just seems that banning something presumably to protect people from themselves, is a bit like prohibition on alcohol, its human nature to find something more attractive if its prohibited.

Altruism has nothing to do with it, tax revenue and protected casino markets have everything to do with it